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fopuszyn

Joined: 31 Aug 2014
Replies: 177
Location: Connecticut USA
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Posted: Wed May 20, 2015 7:38 pm Post subject: Re: Wojciech Nadrowski d.1849

Elzbieta Porteneuve wrote:

fopuszyn wrote:

Elzbieta

Attached is 1849 death record of either the father or brother of my 1G GM Katarzyna Nadrowska Przetakowska. Katarzyna was born in 1838 in Jankowo. Kataryna's father is Wojciech and mother is Franciszka Kowalska as denoted in her 1856 marriage record.

Thank you

Frank

Frank,

Here it is. The record is not easy to decipher, but I see 1848 rather than 1849.

Numbers indicate Wojciech was married to another person before Franciszka (she is 40, and Marcin, son of Wojciech is 29).

Best,
Elzbieta

==

==PO199:
http://polishorigins.com/forum/files/lds_1343903_nadrowski_wojciech_d1849_233.jpg
DATE-of-ACT: /17/29/ - 29 January 1848?, 2 pm, in Sumin
WITNESSES: Marcin Nadrowski, son of the deceased, craftsmanship carpenter, 29 years old, residing in Jankowo, and Mikolaj Mankiewicz, [komornik] farmer-tenant, 65 years old, residing in Jankowo
KTO: Woyciech Nadrowski, died /15/27/ - 27 January 1848?, 3 am, farmer, 63 years old, residing in Jankowo, born in Makowsko?,
PARENTS: son of parents of unknown names,
WIDOW: leaving behind a widowed wife Franciszka Kowalska, 40 years old, on the farm in Jankowo

==

Very interesting. I found a Marcin Nadrocki born in 1819 in the village of Mazowszo just north of Jankowo (Lipno). 1819 + 29 = 1848. Can Makowsko really be Mazowszo?

Frank

Elzbieta Porteneuve
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Posted: Thu May 21, 2015 2:18 am Post subject: Re: Wojciech Nadrowski d.1849

fopuszyn wrote:

Very interesting. I found a Marcin Nadrocki born in 1819 in the village of Mazowszo just north of Jankowo (Lipno). 1819 + 29 = 1848. Can Makowsko really be Mazowszo?

Frank

Frank,

Yes! I do not see well this village name, but definitely it can be Mazowszo // Mazowsze today.
Actually a tricky name, Mazowsze is also the name of the whole region of Warsaw.

I am looking forward for Mazowszo's records.
Best,
Elzbieta

==

jeanluck

Joined: 13 May 2015
Replies: 41
Location: Toulouse, France
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Posted: Thu May 21, 2015 7:21 am Post subject: Tomasz Dzieran x Rozalia Komor 1860 Uniejów

Hi,

Here is a marriage record of Tomasz Dzieran x Rozalia Komor -1860 - Uniejów

# 73 http://metryki.genealodzy.pl/metryka.php?ar=3&zs=1707d&sy=1860&kt=2&plik=71-73.jpg#zoom=1&x=1778&y=1026

Only a summary is enough. I would especially like to know if Salomea Górka (bride's mother) is still alive or not.

Best regards,
Jean-Luc

janbee
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Joined: 19 Oct 2014
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Posted: Thu May 21, 2015 7:52 am Post subject: Marriage Record #29: Magdalena Lalewicz to Ludwik Plewa

Hello all....

Haven't yet heard back from my post of this yesterday...am wondering if it is perhaps in Russian, not Polish?
I have a partial translation but am requesting a more complete and full translation of this marriage record for what I
believe to be my grandfather's sister, Magdalena Lalewicz to Ludwik Plewa in 1886, in Kielce, Olesnica.
I believe she was 18 (so born about 1868?).
Her parents: Franciszek Lalewicz and Marianna Ziembińska.
I am looking for the age of Ludwik as well as the names of his parents, names and ages of witnesses if possible, as well as any other information.

Perhaps I need to post this under "Russian Translations"???

Many thanks,
Janbee

Magdalena Lalewicz Ludwik Plewa marriage record no 29.jpg

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Magdalena Lalewicz marriage to Ludwik Plewa in 1886

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Magdalena Lalewicz Ludwik Plewa marriage record no 29.jpg

_________________
Janbee

Last edited by janbee on Fri May 22, 2015 10:31 am; edited 1 time in total

mestanton

Joined: 14 May 2015
Replies: 212

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Posted: Thu May 21, 2015 4:50 pm Post subject: Translate Lutocin 1864 Marriage of Katarzyna Nadratowska

Dear Elzbieta,

This is the 1864 marriage of my great great grandmother Katarzyna Nadratowska of Przeradz Maly to Julian Lucjan Zgliczynski of Gutkowo Wite in Unieck parish. I can see their signatures at the bottom of the document, along with two other witnesses. I need help with the record to help me figure out details (social class, birth, etc.) about Kazimierz Nadratowski, her father who is already deceased. From her other three sisters' marriage records in Lutocin, I think that he was deceased by 1856. When I sent in the earlier Kazimierz Nadratowski 1821 Lutocin second marriage to the widow Salomea, I was thinking that maybe Kazimierz married for a third time to Antonina Malewski and had daughters from about 1835-1845. But now I know, thanks to your translation, that the Kazimierz who remarried in 1821 at age 65 would be rather too old to start a new family in his late seventies. So I am especially interested in how the deceased father and the mother are described. I believe that Antonina Malewski was from Przeradz Wielki. Birth and deaths for these Kazimierz Nadratowskis are not readily available. And I have not found the marriage of Kazimierz and Antonia Malewski which would give his age. Maybe the records are untranscribable by the same priest with the illegible handwriting in the 1821 marriage.

Katarzyna and her husband Julian Zgliczynski were baptism sponsors for my grandfather Czeslaw Krzywkowski in 1886 in Myslin (Chamsk and/or Biezun parish). Is it unusual to have grandparents be on the birth record?

Best regards,
Marilyn

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zack

Joined: 22 Apr 2014
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Posted: Thu May 21, 2015 7:01 pm Post subject: Oracz + Rubinstain

SHALOM
Thanks for your detailed translation.
have a good day.
Zack

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fopuszyn

Joined: 31 Aug 2014
Replies: 177
Location: Connecticut USA
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Posted: Thu May 21, 2015 7:16 pm Post subject: Re: Wojciech Nadrowski d.1849

Elzbieta Porteneuve wrote:

fopuszyn wrote:

Very interesting. I found a Marcin Nadrocki born in 1819 in the village of Mazowszo just north of Jankowo (Lipno). 1819 + 29 = 1848. Can Makowsko really be Mazowszo?

Frank

Thanks Elzbieta! Got to order more LDS films. Will take a couple weeks or so.

Frank

ironhide781

Joined: 14 Jun 2012
Replies: 37

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Posted: Thu May 21, 2015 11:53 pm Post subject:

Thank you Elzbieta!! I greatly appreciate your help.

Elzbieta Porteneuve
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Posted: Fri May 22, 2015 1:35 pm Post subject: Re: Tomasz Dzieran x Rozalia Komor 1860 Uniejów

jeanluck wrote:

Jean-Luc,

Nothing is said about bride's parents, that would imply they are alive.

Best,
Elzbieta

==

# 73 http://metryki.genealodzy.pl/metryka.php?ar=3&zs=1707d&sy=1860&kt=2&plik=71-73.jpg#zoom=1&x=1778&y=1026
73 Człopy
DATE-of-ACT: 25 November 1860, 2 pm, in the city Uniejów
WITNESSES: Kasper Korona, 70 years old, and Andrzej Hajdas, 30 years old, both farmers residing in Człopy
GROOM: Tomasz Dzieran, young man, farmer, 20 years old, born and residing in Człopy
GROOM-PARENTS: son of Walenty Dzieran and the late Jozefa born Margaz,
BRIDE: Rozalia Komor, Miss, 20 years old, born and residing in Człopy
BRIDE-PARENTS: daughter of Wojciech and Salomea born Górka, spouses Komor,
BANNS: in parish church in Uniejów, 4, 11, 18 November 1860

==

fopuszyn

Joined: 31 Aug 2014
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Location: Connecticut USA
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Posted: Fri May 22, 2015 9:58 pm Post subject: Re: Przetakowski

Elzbieta Porteneuve wrote:

fopuszyn wrote:

Elzbieta

Attached are three records for father and son Przetakowski. As follows:

1) 1822 marriage of Jan Przetakowski (2G GF) to Eleonora Kędzierska (2G GM)
2) 1853 death record of Jan Przetakowski (2G GF)
3) 1856 marriage record of Stanislaw Przetakowski (1G GF) to Katarzyna Nadrowska (1G GM)

Whenever you are next available, can you translate?

Thanks in advance

Frank

Frank,

Here are 3 records.

Best,
Elzbieta

==

==PO195:
http://polishorigins.com/forum/files/lds_544103_przetakowski_jan_m1822_p1_108.jpg
Akta Malzenstwa 15
MARRIAGE: 14 October 1822, in Sumin, circuit Lipno, voievodship Plock
GROOM: Jan Przetakowski, young man, serving in Jankowo, 23 years old, according to submitted before us [metrics] birth records cut from the books of the parish church in Lipno,
GROOM-PARENTS: son of Maryanna Przetakowski, unmarried, now deceased, according to submitted before us death records cut from the books of the church in Lipno
BRIDE: Eleonora Kędzierska, Miss, handmaiden in Jankowo, 21 years old, according to submitted before us [metrics] birth records cut from the books of the parish church in Lipno?,
BRIDE-PARENTS: daughter of Jozef Kędzierski and Maryanna, who both are dead, according to submitted before us death records from Sumin and Brzezno
WITNESSES: Mikolaj Mackiewicz, 34 years old, Pawel Strzutkowski, 38 years old, Piotr Woynichowski, 35 years old, Walenty Petrkiewicz staying with his father in Jankowo, 21 years old, [wloscian] farmers from Jankowo
BANNS: 29 September, 6 October 1822, in local church

==

Elzbieta,

I realize words are words and that's all we have now but just curious. What can be inferred from Jan's mother being "unmarried"? If Jan's mother was a widow then I would have expected this marriage record to state that. Not sure if divorce existed back then. Only option left would be that Jan was born out of wedlock.

Wondering if Przetakowska is Maryanna's maiden or marriage name. I guess I'll never know...

Based on religious and social customs and culture during that time period, maybe you have insight on record keeping back then?

Frank

jkorup

Joined: 23 May 2015
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Posted: Sat May 23, 2015 2:24 am Post subject: seeking assistance with marriage record translation

I'm seeking some help translating a marriage record from the Warszawa św. Aleksander church records from 1904. Outside of picking out the names of the bride and groom, I haven't been able to figure out what any of the rest of the document says.

Groom: Ignacy Korłub
Bride: Eleonora Chodorowska

I would love to be able to surprise my Grandfather with details of his ancestry for father's day this year and any help I receive will be appreciated immensely. Smile

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jeanluck

Joined: 13 May 2015
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Posted: Sat May 23, 2015 6:57 am Post subject: Re: Tomasz Dzieran x Rozalia Komor 1860 Uniejów

Elzbieta Porteneuve wrote:

jeanluck wrote:

Hi,

Thank you Elzbieta for this informations.... too bad there is nothing about bride's parents, yet the father is dead on 1852 (I found his death record).

Best regards,
Jean-Luc

Elzbieta Porteneuve
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Posted: Sat May 23, 2015 7:29 am Post subject: Re: seeking assistance with marriage record translation

jkorup wrote:

Hi,

I like your record, it is about so many areas I know well, from my childhood.
I have been walking every day on Nowowiejska street.

Here it is. Not big surprise you do not read it, it's in Cyrillic. But it's Warsaw, my place.

Best,
Elzbieta

==

NOTE:
Ignacy’s profession is a legend in itself, warszawski dorożkarz. When you google with “dorożkarz warszawski”, you get plenty of songs, poems or movies about, see also “dorożkarz wikipedia”. “Zaczarowana dorożka” – Magic Cab, is legendary. The other name for Polish beautiful word dorożkarz is fiakr, of French origin (fiacre).
Pictures of dorożka
http://pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doro%C5%BCka

==PO200:
http://polishorigins.com/forum/files/474_106.jpg
MARRIAGE: 29 October 1904, 7 pm, in Warszawa, parish office of Holy Aleksander, Kościół Świętego Aleksandra
GROOM: Ignacy Korłub, young man, dorożkarz – cab man, 26 years old, born in the village Bronowice county Kozienice, residing in Warszawa, parish Holy Trinity, Kościół Świętej Trójcy, street Przemyslowa 5201
GROOM-PARENTS: son of Walenty and Marianna born Kozioł, spouses Karłub
BRIDE: Eleonora Chodorowska, Miss, servant, 19 years old, born in the village Tokary, county Gostynin, residing in Warszawa, parish Holy Aleksander, Kościół Świętego Aleksandra, steet Nowowiejska 5130
BRIDE-PARENTS: daughter of the late Roman and Antonina born Malik, spouses Chodorowski
WITNESSES: Jan Korzuchowski and Walenty Kornet, servants of the perfectness [Tsar Nicholas II, Emperor and Autocrat of All the Russia - occupant of Poland], residents in Warszawa
BANNS: 9, 16, 23 October 1904, in both parishes
CHURCHES:
Kościół Świętej Trójcy, Solec, Warszawa
Kościół Świętego Aleksandra, plac Trzech Krzyży, Warszawa

474
It did happen in Warszawa, parish office of Holy Aleksander, Kościół Świętego Aleksandra, /16/29/ October 1904, 7 pm.
We make it known that in the presence of witnesses Jan Korzuchowski and Walenty Kornet, servants of the perfectness [Tsar Nicholas II, Emperor and Autocrat of All the Russia - occupant of Poland], residents in Warszawa, today have been concluded religious marriage between Ignacy Korłub, young man, dorożkarz – cab man, 26 years old, born in the village Bronowice county Kozienice, son of Walenty and Marianna born Kozioł, spouses Karłub; and Eleonora Chodorowska, Miss, servant, 19 years old, born in the village Tokary, county Gostynin, daughter of the late Roman and Antonina born Malik, spouses Chodorowski; both residing in Warszawa, the first in the parish Holy Trinity, Kościół Świętej Trójcy, street Przemyslowa 5201, and the second in our parish, steet Nowowiejska 5130. Three banns, in both parishes, 9, 16, 23 October current year. No prenuptial agreement. (no opposition to the marriage). Religious rite by priest Alojzy Rowinski, vicar. This act was read by us, the bride and () signed, the groom and his sister, do not know how to write.

NOTES: geography
Ignacy is from very beautiful area, circa 94 km from Warsaw to Kozienice, plus 30 km more to Bronowice, Puławy County. Next few km, you will get to Kazimierz Dolny, very touristic place. And you can continue over Vistula River, until mountains.
http://pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kozienice
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kozienice

==

Elzbieta Porteneuve
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Posted: Sat May 23, 2015 8:00 am Post subject: Re: Przetakowski

fopuszyn wrote:

Frank,

I have seen a couple of records from 1820s with babies born from unmarried woman, each time it was out of wedlock. We even had a mistery of the same mother, with 3 or 4 babies is a row out of wedlock, then 8 years later a marriage, which I suppose with the same man, who could not marry due to Family Council supervising inheritence.

Przetakowska is Maryanna's family name, Przetakowski her father name.

Your record let me think the family is of Roman-Catholic religion, I do not believe any divorce or separation was possible unless extenuating circumstances to invalid the marriage.

The parish in Lipno should have Jan's birth record circa 1799, and his mother's death record.

Best,
Elzbieta

Elzbieta Porteneuve
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Posted: Sat May 23, 2015 12:57 pm Post subject: Re: Translate Lutocin 1864 Marriage of Katarzyna Nadratowska

mestanton wrote:

Marilyn,

I must confess I do not understand your search.

Let me summarize, maybe I am wrong or do not understand something:

3 daughters of Kazimierz Nadratowski and Antonina Milewska (from Geneteka):

45 1863 4 Ksawery Kóskowski Rudowska Paulina Nadratowska Malewska Lutocin
Paulina 22 years [BIRTH-ESTIMATE: 1841]

27 1863 5 Antoni Dramiński Dóbrska Antonina Nadratowska Malewska Lutocin
Antonina 20 years [BIRTH-ESTIMATE: 1843]

13 1864 20 Julian Lucjan Zgliczyński Chądzyńska Katarzyna Nadratowska Malewska Lutocin
Katarzyna 20 years [BIRTH-ESTIMATE: 1844]

It implies that we may estimate the year of Kazimierz and Antonina's marriage, and estimate their year of birth:

Marriage Kazimierz Nadratowski and Antonina Malewska MARRIAGE-ESTIMATE: 1840 or earlier
and
Antonina Malewska BIRTH-ESTIMATE: 1800-1820
Kazimierz Nadratowski BIRTH-ESTIMATE: 1780-1820

The numbers are quite clear, Kazimierz from 1821 record is NOT a good one, he could be an ancestor, rather the generation of grandfather that the one of father.

The marriage records of all 3 daughters Nadratowski are very similar, nothing specific about Kazimierz or his wife Antonina.

You are right that no records of your Kazimierz Nadratowski are online, so probably you should consider LDS films, or anything known to you.

On my side, I think I found a scan of Antonina Malewska birth, at least numbers fits: Antonina Teresa Urszula born 16 April 1809 in the village Bonisław, her father, 39 years old, is well-born, working as financial manager, married to Urszula, widow of Białkowski, 37 years old, witnesses are from well-born families.

41 1809 63 Antonina Teresa, Urszula Malewska Tomasz Urszula Bonisław

This baby Antonina born in 1809 will be 30 years old when the first of 3 daughters Nadratowski is born.

==

As I typed your record before making the above considerations, here it is. No translated, there is no information.

Best,
Elzbieta

NB. Please post your records under "Polish records translations". If you have an URL with record at Geneteka, it is much better to provide it, that copy to a jpeg, the quality is better.

==

==PO200:
http://polishorigins.com/forum/files/nadratowskakatarz1864m001_137.jpg
20 Wies Przeradz Mały
Dzialo sie we wsi Lutocinie dnia trzynastego lipca tysiac osiemset szescdziesiatego czwartego roku, o godzinie siodmej po poludniu. Wiadomo czynimy, iz w przytomnosci swiadkow Jakoba Molskiego, dziedzica w wsi Maryśce zamieszkalego lat czterdziesci cztery i Jozefa Siemiętkowskiego wlasciciela czesci w Cendatach? zamieszkalego lat czterdziesci trzy majacych, na dniu dzisiejszym zawarte zostalo religijne malzenstwo miedzy Julianem Lucyanem Zgliczynskim, mlodzianem dziedzicem czesci w Gutkowie Wita parafii Unieckiej zamieszkalym, urodzonym w Gutkowie Wita, z Bonifacego i Maryanny z Chadzynskich malzonkow Zgliczynskich, lat dwadziescia jeden majacym, a Katarzyna Nadratowska, panna przy matce w Przeradzu Małym parafii tutejszej zamieszkala, urodzona w Przeradzu Małym z niegdy Kazimierza i Antoniny z Malewskich malzonkow Nadratowskich, lat dwadziescia majaca. Malzenstwo to poprzedzily trzy zapowiedzie w dniach: dwudziestym szostym czrwca, trzecim i dziesiatym lipca roku biezacego, w kosciolach parafialnych Lutocinskim i Unieckim, jak dowodzi swiadectwo tego aktu dolaczone ogloszone. Zezwolenie obecnych aktowi malzenstwa ojca nowozaslubionego i matki nowozaslubionej ustnie bylo oswiadczone. Malzonkowie nowi oswiadczaja, ze umowy przedslubnej nie zawarli. Obrzed ten religijny dopelniony zostal przez ksiedza Wincentego Tabeckiego, wikaryusza parafii Lutocin. Akt ten stawajacym i swiadkom przeczytany, przez nas i stawajacych i swiadkow podpisany zostal. Ksiadz Wincenty Tabecki, wikaryusz Lutocinski, utrzymujacy akta Stanu Cywilnego
Signatures:
Julian Zgliczynski
Katarzyna Nadratowska
J Molski
Jozef Siemietkowski

==

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