Elzbieta PorteneuvePO Top Contributor
Joined: 09 Nov 2012
Replies: 3098
Location: Paris, FranceBack to top |
Posted: Fri Feb 12, 2016 9:24 am
Post subject:
johnkril wrote: | Hello Elzibieta,
here is the complete document. Can you please just tell me what it is in general terms. I'm particularly interested also to know whether it is an official document that might be accepted by Polish authorities in establishing my heritage through my parents Dmytro and Helena.
Thanking you
John |
John,
Below is translated marriage record. It is Roman-Catholic parish document, it should be recognized by the church.
That being said, I have no idea what is required by Polish authorities to establish any heritage, if and how it works.
Re: jus soli, jus sanguinis
My personal perception is that Polish right is right by blood rather that right by place of birth, but it is my own speculation (otherwise I should have large collection of passeports of all invaders of my ancestors' places over time, which makes half a dozen different ones). I suggest you ask Polish Consulate in Australia.
Best,
Elzbieta
==
==PO-278:
Marriage Certificte - 21 March 1945.pdf
http://polishorigins.com/forum/download.php?id=8806
Marriage Certificate issued by the Roman Catholic Ministry, at Field Airport, Camp Chapel in Adelherde, in Germany
Pursuant to the book of marriages, volume III, page 20, it is certified formally that on 21 May 1945, in the Camp Chapel in Adelherde, in Germany, have been celebrated marriage according to the Roman-Catholic rite, between following persons:
Left column=Groom, Middle Column=Bride, Right Column=witnesses and the Chaplain
Groom:
Name: Kryl Dymitr
Occupation: no
Faith: Roman-Catholic
Status: young man [unmarried]
Birth date: 5 October 1922
Birth place: Choszowczyk [NOTE1]
(birth place) County: Lesko
(birth place) Voievodship: Lwów
Names of parents and maiden name of mother: Michał and Maria born Szewc
Bride:
Name: Jaślen Helena
Occupation: no
Faith: Roman-Catholic
Status: Miss [unmarried]
Birth date: 10 October 1922
Birth place: Ożarów
(birth place) County: Opatów
(birth place) Voievodship: Kielce
Names of parents and maiden name of mother: Józef and Maria born z Hudłów CORRECTION: or something similar. After checking for existence of Hudł*, I am sure it is not H at the begging, but rather K, "z Kudłów" => Kudła? CORRECTION
Witnesses:
Last-FirstName1: Bartosz Stanisław
Place1: Łosocin, Opatów voievodship Kielce [NOTE2] // CORRECTED, the name is Lasocin
Last-FirstName2: Kowal Mikołaj
Place2: Choszowczyk, Lesko, voievodship Lwów [NOTE1]
Chaplain:
Priest Chaplain
Nowacki Walenty
Done in the place of stopover, on 21 may 1945.
Signature of the Chaplain, and Roman Catholic Ministry seal
NOTE: geography
NOTE2: CORRECTED, the name is Lasocin
Lasocin:
https://pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lasocin_%28powiat_opatowski%29
Lasocin is part to “gmina”=community Ożarów
https://pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/O%C5%BCar%C3%B3w_%28gmina%29
NOTE1:
Lesko aka Lisko
http://dir.icm.edu.pl/Slownik_geograficzny/Tom_V/313
Choszowczyk, Lesko
Does not exist, probably typo, could it be Hoczewka (not so different pronunciation)
Hoczew, Hoczewka
http://dir.icm.edu.pl/Slownik_geograficzny/Tom_III/86
Google maps:
Kielce,+Poland/Opatów,+Poland/Ożarów,+Poland/Lesko,+Poland/Hoczewka,+Gmina+Lesko,+Poland/Hoczew,+Poland
==
Last edited by Elzbieta Porteneuve on Sat Feb 13, 2016 9:35 am; edited 2 times in total
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PhilipPO Top Contributor
Joined: 03 Mar 2014
Replies: 117
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Posted: Fri Feb 12, 2016 1:02 pm
Post subject:
Hi,
is it possible to have the translation of these 2 documents?
Thank you very much, i appreciate always your work.
Best,
Philip
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czaplicki
Joined: 01 Nov 2008
Replies: 49
Location: USABack to top |
Posted: Fri Feb 12, 2016 3:52 pm
Post subject: Marriage of Franciszek Bartołd and Małgorzata Szypulska
Elżbeata, thank you for your last helpful translation. Here's my great great grandparents wedding record. Could you please translate it?
Conrad Czaplicki
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_________________ Researching: Czaplicki, Rudziński, Bartołd, Chmieliński in Ciechanów area;Furtek, Dyka, Armata, Petka, Maslonka near Frysztak; Luczkowski,
Pakos in Dubany, Ukraine
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Elzbieta PorteneuvePO Top Contributor
Joined: 09 Nov 2012
Replies: 3098
Location: Paris, FranceBack to top |
Posted: Fri Feb 12, 2016 4:49 pm
Post subject:
EANWhitson wrote: | Hi Elzbieta!
This is the family that married into the Krystman/Christmann family. I'm thankful for Geneteka where I found more family. With all the translations you've helped me with through the years, I've spent some time going back and forth trying to translate this on my own. Please correct anything I've mistranslated.
Death Record. Akt No. 4, Komorowo. It came to pass in Ostrowi, 2nd day of February, Year 1864. Presented himself, Kacper Zapisek, 44, tavern keeper and Jozef Michalik, 34, farmer, …in Komorowie residing. They testified that on day 18 (? Lost on the rest of this, I know the year is 1864) died in Komorowie Konstanty Zapisek, 9 months. Son of Kacper and Ann Winnicka married Zapisek. (cannot make out this sentence) Akt read to them, etc.
(BTW, this is a twin birth.)
Akt. No. 116. Komorowo. It came to pass in Ostrowi on day 20th May, year 1863, at the eleventh hour afternoon (?). Presented himself, Kacper Zapisek, 40), innkeeper, in Komorowie residing in the presence of Ludwik Michalik, 41, and Antoni Zadrogi, 34, both residing in Komorowie and showed us a child of female sex ……?..... was born in Komorowie yesterday. … Born of his wife Ann Winnicki, 35. For child this Christening holy today performed. The child is given the name Julianna. Godparents are Ludwik Michalik and Apolonia Kowalska. This entry was read to the witnesses as they do not know how to write.
Akt. No. 117 seems to say the same with the difference being this twin is a male, named Konstanty. Godparents are Antoni Zadrogi and Lucya Kowalska.
Thank you!
Beth |
Beth,
You are doing very well. Sometimes there are words not easy, such as "onegdajszego" = a day before yesterday [wczorajszego=yesterday] in the death records. I can just confort you, that "onegdajszego" is ambigous for experts, because it might sometimes mean older that 2 days before. In other cases, always difficult, recowering nominative from declension: Antoni is Zadroga. And in all long passive sentences, you find the subject at the end - like the sentence about giving baptism, the given name is at the very end.
Here are your translations slightly corrected.
Best,
Elzbieta
==
==PO278:
http://polishorigins.com/forum/files/zapisek_konstanty_d_1864_so_kacper_161.jpg
DATE-of-ACT: 2 February 1864, at 8 am, in the city Ostrow
WITNESSES: Kacper Zapisek, 44, tavern keeper and Jozef Michalik, 34, farmers, both residing in Komorowo
KTO: Konstanty Zapisek, died 31 January 1864, at 3 pm, 9 months,
PARENTS: son of mentioned Kacper and Anna born Winnicka, spouses Zapisek
4 Komorowo
Dzialo sie w miescie Ostrowi dnia 2 lutego 1844 roku, o godzinie 8 przed poludniem. Stawili sie Kacper Zapisek, lat 44, szynkarz, i Jozef Michalik, lat 34, gospodarze, obydwa w Komorowie zamieszkali, i oswiadczyli, ze dnia onegdajszego o godzinie 3 po poludniu umarl w Komorowie Konstanty Zapisek, miesiecy 9 majacy, syn wspomnianego Kacpra i Anny z Winnickich malzonkow Zapiskow. Po przekonaniu sie naocznie o zejsciu Konstantego. Akt ten stawajacym pisac nie umiejacym przeczytany, my tylko podpisalismy.
X.Leon Krzyszkowski, proboszcz Ostrowski, U A.SC. (Utrzymujacy Akta Stanu Cywilnego)
Death Record.
Akt No. 4, Komorowo. Ostrow=Ostrów Mazowiecka
It came to pass in the city Ostrow, 2nd February 1864, at 8 am. Presented himself, Kacper Zapisek, 44, tavern keeper and Jozef Michalik, 34, farmers, both residing in Komorowo. They testified that on a day before yesterday, at 3 pm, died in Komorowo Konstanty Zapisek, 9 months, son of mentioned Kacper and Anna born Winnicka, spouses Zapisek. After visual conviction that Konstanty passed away. This Akt was read to the presents not knowing how to write, we only signed.
Priest Leon Krzyszkowski, pastor in Ostrow
==PO278:
http://polishorigins.com/forum/files/zapisek_julianna_and_konstanty_b_1863_no_116_117_children_of_kacper_153.jpg
DATE-of-ACT: 20th May 1863, at 11 am, in the city Ostrow
FATHER: Kacper Zapisek, 43, tavern keeper residing in Komorowo
MOTHER: Anna born Winnicka, 35 years old, his wife
KTO: Julianna Zapisek, born 19 May 1863, at 5 pm, in Komorowo
WITNESSES: Ludwik Michalik, 41, and Antoni Zadroga, 34, both residing in Komorowo
GODPARENTS: Ludwik Michalik and Apolonia Kowalska
116 Komorowo.
Dzialo sie w miescie Ostrowi dnia 20 maja 1863 roku, o godzinie 11 przed poludniem. Stawil sie Kacper Zapisek, lat 43, szynkarz w Komorowie zamieszkaly, w obecnosci Ludwika Michalik, lat 41, i Antoniego Zadrogi, lat 34 majacy, obydwu w Komorowie zamieszkalych, i okazal nam dziecie plci zenskiej, oswiadczajac iz jest urodzone w Komorowie na dniu wczorajszym o godzinie 5 po poludniu, z jego malzonki Anny z Winnickich lat 35 liczacej. Dziecieciu temu na chrzcie swietym dzis odbytym nadane zostalo imie Julianna, a rodzicami jego chrzestnymi byli wspomniony Ludwik Michalik i Apolonia Kowalska. Akt ten stawajacemu i swiadkom pisac nie umiejacym przeczytany, my tylko podpisalismy.
X.Leon Krzyszkowski, proboszcz Ostrowski, U A.SC. (Utrzymujacy Akta Stanu Cywilnego)
Akt. No. 116.
Komorowo.
It came to pass in the city Ostrow on 20th May 1863, at 11 am. Presented himself, Kacper Zapisek, 43, tavern keeper residing in Komorowo, in the presence of Ludwik Michalik, 41, and Antoni Zadroga, 34, both residing in Komorowo and presented us a child of female sex, declaring he was born in Komorowo yesterday, at 5 pm, with his wife Anna born Winnicka, 35. For this child, on the holy Christening performed today, was given the name Julianna. Godparents are Ludwik Michalik and Apolonia Kowalska. This entry was read to the witnesses as they do not know how to write.
==
TWINS
116 Komorowo: Julianna
117 Komorowo: Konstanty
==
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Elzbieta PorteneuvePO Top Contributor
Joined: 09 Nov 2012
Replies: 3098
Location: Paris, FranceBack to top |
Posted: Fri Feb 12, 2016 6:26 pm
Post subject:
crispm28 wrote: | Elzbieta, Thank you for translating my prior documents. I have several more for you when time permits.
Christine |
Christine,
Here are your records.
Best,
Elzbieta
==
==PO278:
http://polishorigins.com/forum/files/pawyza_michal_6_608.jpg
DATE-of-ACT: 28 January 1830, in the village Dzietrzkowice
WITNESSES: Alexander Pawyza, brother of the deceased, laborer from Łubnice, in the presence of Szczepan Olek and Antoni Przybyla
KTO: Michal Pawyza, died 26 January 1830, 24 years old
PARENTS: son of Bartlomiej and Zofia, spouses Pawyza
6 Łubnice
Dzialo sie w wsi Dzietrzkowicach dnia 28 stycznia 1830 roku. Stawil sie Alexander Pawyza, brat zmarlego, parobnik z Łubnic, w obecnosci Szczepana Olka i Antoniego Przybyly, i oswiadczyli iz w dniu 26 stycznia umarl Michal Pawyza liczacy lat 24, syn Bartlomieja i Zofii Pawyzow. Po przekonaniu sie o zejsciu tegoz. Akt stawajacym przeczytany pisac nie umiejacym, przez nas podpisany zostal.
X. A. Dornchowski, wikaryusz
Translated:
It happened in the village Dzietrzkowice, on 28 January 1830. Appeared in Alexander Pawyza, brother of the deceased, laborer from Łubnice, in the presence of Szczepan Olek and Antoni Przybyla, and declared, that on 26 January, died Michal Pawyza, 24 years old, son of Bartlomiej and Zofia, spouses Pawyza. After visual conviction that he passed away. This Act was read to the present, who do not know how to write, by us was signed.
==PO278:
http://polishorigins.com/forum/files/olek_kusiek_katarzyna_22_d_5_8_1844_133.jpg
DATE-of-ACT: 8 May 1844, at 7 am, in the village Dzietrzkowice
WITNESSES: Ludwik Trzeciak, farmer, 36 years old, and Michal Woytas, 67 years old, both peasants residing in Łubnice on [polrolka] [size of land]
KTO: Katarzyna Olek [Olcyna –name derived from Olek, to design his wife], died 7 May 1844, at 3 am, [polrolnica] [size of land], 78 years old, peasant residing in the village Łubnice on [polrolek],
WIDOW: leaving behind a widowed husband Kacper Olek, peasant in the village Łubnice on [polrolku] settled
Łubnice 22
Dzialo sie w wsi Dzietrzkowicach dnia 8 maja 1844 roku, o godzinie 7 z rana. Stawili sie Ludwik Trzeciak, rolnik liczacy lat 36, tudziez Michal Woytas, majacy lat 67, obydwaj wloscianie w Łubnicach, na polrolkach zamieszkali, i oswiadczyli nam, ze dnia 7 miesiaca i roku biezacych, o godzinie 3 z rana umarla Katarzyna Olcyna, polrolnica, majaca lat 78, wloscianka w wsi Łubnicach na polrolku zamieszkala, zostawiwszy po sobie owdowialego meza Kacpra Olka, wloscianina, w wsi Łubnicach na polrolku osiadlego. Po przekonaniu sie naocznie o smierci Katarzyny Olcyncey. Akt ten stawajacym i swiadkom przeczytany, ktorzy nie umieja pisac, przez nas zostal podpisany. X. Adrian Nysik
Translated:
It happened in the village Dzietrzkowice on 8 May 1844, at 7 am. Appeared in Ludwik Trzeciak, farmer, 36 years old, and Michal Woytas, 67 years old, both peasants residing in Łubnice on [polrolka] [size of land], and declared us that on 7 th day current month and year, at 3 am died Katarzyna Olek [Olcyna –name derived from Olek, to design his wife], [polrolnica][size of land], 78 years old, peasant residing in the village Łubnice on [polrolek], leaving behind a widowed husband Kacper Olek, peasant in the village Łubnice on [polrolku] settled. After visual conviction that Katarzyna Olek [Olcyna] passed away. This act was read to the present and witnesses, who do not know how to write, by us was signed.
Priest Adrian Nysik
==
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Elzbieta PorteneuvePO Top Contributor
Joined: 09 Nov 2012
Replies: 3098
Location: Paris, FranceBack to top |
Posted: Fri Feb 12, 2016 7:06 pm
Post subject: Re: Franciszka Wierzchowska d.1815
fopuszyn wrote: |
Elzbieta,
I have been searching for Piotr's wife and located this 1815 death record for a Franciszka Wierzchowska from Grabina. I suspect this woman might be my 5G GM, Piotr's wife. I believe her age at death was 78 years.
Record is not the best to read. I do see that Tomasz Lopuszynski (my 4G GF) was a witness. Not sure if record mentions who Tomasz was in relation to Franciszka.
Thanks!
Frank |
Frank,
Here it is. I cannot decipher well Leon's name, looks similar to Wierzchowski, but it is not - otherwise the scibe would said something.
Best,
Elzbieta
==
==PO278:
http://polishorigins.com/forum/files/ta_wierzchowska_franciszka_d1815_p1_411.jpg
Grabina, Miesiac Pazdziernik
DATE-of-ACT: 5 October 1815, in Chrostkowo, county Lipno, department of Plock
WITNESSES: Mikolaj Jablonski and Leon Wierzchoski? and declared to us, along with their neighbors expressed below
NEIGHBORS: 1. Xxx Tomasz Lopuszenski 2. Xxx Woyciech Detmer
KTO: Franciszka Wierzchowska, died 3 October 1815, at 4 am, widow residing in Grabina with her son-in-law expressed above, at house number 3, 78 years old, reason of death: old age
NOTE: who is son in law? Mikolaj Jablonski?
84
Roku panskiego 1815, dnia 5 miesiaca pazdziernika. Przed nami proboszczem Chrostkowskim, sprawujacym obowiazki urzednika Stanu Cywilnego gminy Chrostkowskiej, powiatu Lipienskiego, departamentu Plockiego. Stawil sie Mikolaj Jablonski i Leon Wierzchoski? i oswiadczyli nam, wraz z sasiadami swoimi nizej wyrazonymi, ze dnia 3 miesiaca pazdziernika roku biezacego o godzinie 4 z rana umarla Franciszka Wierzchowska, wdowa na Grabinie u ziecia wzwyz wyrazonego pod numerem 3 zamieszkalego, majaca lat 78, na starosc. Opatrzona wszystkimi sakramentami swietymi, pochowana jest na cmentarzu przy kosciele parafialnym Chrostkowskim, tego samego dnia i roku jak wyzej. Po czem oswiadczajacy podpisali
http://polishorigins.com/forum/files/ta_wierzchowska_franciszka_d1815_p2_726.jpg
z nami niniejszy akt, po przeczytaniu onego przeze mnie. Xsiadz Stanislaw Poznanski, proboszcz parafii Chrostowskiej, sprawujacy obowiazki urzednika Stanu Cywilnego
Signatures: 1. Xxx Tomasz Lopuszenski 2. Xxx Woyciech Detmer jako swiadkowie
Translated:
Year of our Lord 1815, on 5 th day of the month of October. Before us pastor in Chrostkowo, exercising duties of officer of Civil Vital Records Registry for the community Chrostkowo, county Lipno, department of Plock. Appeared in Mikolaj Jablonski and Leon Wierzchowski? and declared to us, along with their neighbors expressed below, that on the 3 rd day of the month of October of the current year at 4 am died Franciszka Wierzchowska, widow residing in Grabina with her son-in-law expressed above, at house number 3, 78 years old, reason of death: old age. She received all the saint sacraments, and was buried in the cemetery of the parish church Chrostkowo, on the same day and year as above. Then the declarants have signed
() with us this Act, after it was read by me. Priest Stanislaw Poznanski, pastor in Chrostowo, exercising duties of officer of Civil Vital Records Registry
Signatures: 1. Xxx Tomasz Lopuszenski 2. Xxx Woyciech Detmer as witnesses
==
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EANWhitsonPO Top Contributor
Joined: 18 Apr 2012
Replies: 370
Back to top |
Posted: Fri Feb 12, 2016 7:39 pm
Post subject:
Another record for birth of a child. Here is what I could translate. Please correct what I missed and help me with correct spelling of place and names.
Akt. No. 52. Osiechowa. It came to pass in parish Poręba day 23, April, 1858, at the 12th hour, afternoon, presented himself Kacper Zapisek, 36, peasant dayworker? In Oszechow? residing and presence of Kazimierz Zidryszeryka? 66 and Adam Kuleszy, 66, not relatives, living in Tozuanie Rolni in Oszichow residing.and showing us child sex male, born in Osciekow day before yesterday ? hour in he evening. Wife Anna Winnicka, 26, for child this Christening performed today given the name Leon. Godparents Kazmierz Zgdryozeryk and Maryanna Szydliczka. Akt entered by the one present and read to witnesses as they do not know how to write.
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fopuszyn
Joined: 31 Aug 2014
Replies: 177
Location: Connecticut USABack to top |
Posted: Fri Feb 12, 2016 8:06 pm
Post subject: Re: Franciszka Wierzchowska d.1815
Elzbieta Porteneuve wrote: | fopuszyn wrote: |
Elzbieta,
I have been searching for Piotr's wife and located this 1815 death record for a Franciszka Wierzchowska from Grabina. I suspect this woman might be my 5G GM, Piotr's wife. I believe her age at death was 78 years.
Record is not the best to read. I do see that Tomasz Lopuszynski (my 4G GF) was a witness. Not sure if record mentions who Tomasz was in relation to Franciszka.
Thanks!
Frank |
Frank,
Here it is. I cannot decipher well Leon's name, looks similar to Wierzchowski, but it is not - otherwise the scibe would said something.
Best,
Elzbieta
==
==PO278:
http://polishorigins.com/forum/files/ta_wierzchowska_franciszka_d1815_p1_411.jpg
Grabina, Miesiac Pazdziernik
DATE-of-ACT: 5 October 1815, in Chrostkowo, county Lipno, department of Plock
WITNESSES: Mikolaj Jablonski and Leon Wierzchoski? and declared to us, along with their neighbors expressed below
NEIGHBORS: 1. Xxx Tomasz Lopuszenski 2. Xxx Woyciech Detmer
KTO: Franciszka Wierzchowska, died 3 October 1815, at 4 am, widow residing in Grabina with her son-in-law expressed above, at house number 3, 78 years old, reason of death: old age
NOTE: who is son in law? Mikolaj Jablonski?
84
Roku panskiego 1815, dnia 5 miesiaca pazdziernika. Przed nami proboszczem Chrostkowskim, sprawujacym obowiazki urzednika Stanu Cywilnego gminy Chrostkowskiej, powiatu Lipienskiego, departamentu Plockiego. Stawil sie Mikolaj Jablonski i Leon Wierzchoski? i oswiadczyli nam, wraz z sasiadami swoimi nizej wyrazonymi, ze dnia 3 miesiaca pazdziernika roku biezacego o godzinie 4 z rana umarla Franciszka Wierzchowska, wdowa na Grabinie u ziecia wzwyz wyrazonego pod numerem 3 zamieszkalego, majaca lat 78, na starosc. Opatrzona wszystkimi sakramentami swietymi, pochowana jest na cmentarzu przy kosciele parafialnym Chrostkowskim, tego samego dnia i roku jak wyzej. Po czem oswiadczajacy podpisali
http://polishorigins.com/forum/files/ta_wierzchowska_franciszka_d1815_p2_726.jpg
z nami niniejszy akt, po przeczytaniu onego przeze mnie. Xsiadz Stanislaw Poznanski, proboszcz parafii Chrostowskiej, sprawujacy obowiazki urzednika Stanu Cywilnego
Signatures: 1. Xxx Tomasz Lopuszenski 2. Xxx Woyciech Detmer jako swiadkowie
Translated:
Year of our Lord 1815, on 5 th day of the month of October. Before us pastor in Chrostkowo, exercising duties of officer of Civil Vital Records Registry for the community Chrostkowo, county Lipno, department of Plock. Appeared in Mikolaj Jablonski and Leon Wierzchowski? and declared to us, along with their neighbors expressed below, that on the 3 rd day of the month of October of the current year at 4 am died Franciszka Wierzchowska, widow residing in Grabina with her son-in-law expressed above, at house number 3, 78 years old, reason of death: old age. She received all the saint sacraments, and was buried in the cemetery of the parish church Chrostkowo, on the same day and year as above. Then the declarants have signed
() with us this Act, after it was read by me. Priest Stanislaw Poznanski, pastor in Chrostowo, exercising duties of officer of Civil Vital Records Registry
Signatures: 1. Xxx Tomasz Lopuszenski 2. Xxx Woyciech Detmer as witnesses
== |
Elzbieta
Yes, I agree it is unclear who son-in-law is... Mikolaj? Her age and villiage (Grabina) appears to somewhat align with Piotr's death record. Piotr would have been ~11 years older than this Franciszka and that's reasonable.
Perhaps the fact that Tomasz is also referenced in this record lends credence that he too had close relationship (another son-in-law?) to this Franciszka.
Who knows?!! Maybe Wojciech Detmer is a third son-in-law!
Frank
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johnkril
Joined: 12 Feb 2016
Replies: 11
Location: AustraliaBack to top |
Posted: Sat Feb 13, 2016 1:32 am
Post subject:
Hello Elzbieta,
thank you so much for the translation of the document which proved to be the marriage certificate of my parents made immediately after the war. It is wonderful to have this connection to their lives while they were still young and in Europe before resettling and spending the remainder of their lives in Australia.
I intend to make further investigation of my Polish heritage but am not certain exactly how to do this at the moment. My plan is to gradually make some investigations which can provide me information from which I can then obtain the birth certificate of my mother and possibly even my father.
With this in mind can I please ask you to assist with the translation of these two headstones? The one for Marianna is my maternal grandmother. The one for Jozef is my maternal grandfather.
I wonder too if you might be able to identify anything from the pictures which gives information of the cemetery or the location generally that they are in. Of course it would be useful to know where they are buried because then I could make application for a death certificate which would also assist with proving my Polish heritage.
One again - Thank you so very much for your assistance.
John Kril
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Elzbieta PorteneuvePO Top Contributor
Joined: 09 Nov 2012
Replies: 3098
Location: Paris, FranceBack to top |
Posted: Sat Feb 13, 2016 5:05 am
Post subject:
johnkril wrote: | Hello Elzbieta,
thank you so much for the translation of the document which proved to be the marriage certificate of my parents made immediately after the war. It is wonderful to have this connection to their lives while they were still young and in Europe before resettling and spending the remainder of their lives in Australia.
I intend to make further investigation of my Polish heritage but am not certain exactly how to do this at the moment. My plan is to gradually make some investigations which can provide me information from which I can then obtain the birth certificate of my mother and possibly even my father.
With this in mind can I please ask you to assist with the translation of these two headstones? The one for Marianna is my maternal grandmother. The one for Jozef is my maternal grandfather.
I wonder too if you might be able to identify anything from the pictures which gives information of the cemetery or the location generally that they are in. Of course it would be useful to know where they are buried because then I could make application for a death certificate which would also assist with proving my Polish heritage.
One again - Thank you so very much for your assistance.
John Kril |
John,
This time I started to search for distribution of Jaślan name in Poland, and it was Good Thing. It helped me to make corrections.
Best
Elzbieta
==
Today distribution of the name Jaślan, 152 persons [little is good, you have more chances to find them]:
http://www.moikrewni.pl/mapa/kompletny/ja%25C5%259Blan.html
The red spot on the east side of Poland is in Opatów, above it the yellow spot in Ostrowiec Świętokrzyski
https://pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ostrowiec_%C5%9Awi%C4%99tokrzyski
Close look at “Powiat opatowski (1867-1975)” - click on [pokaż]=show
Very Good! I have Lasocin in item “Miasta”=Towns, and have to remove my incorrect NOTE2 and put a right one. [will be DONE now]
Lasocin:
https://pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lasocin_%28powiat_opatowski%29
Lasocin is part to “gmina”=community Ożarów
https://pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/O%C5%BCar%C3%B3w_%28gmina%29
Back to Lasocin_(powiat_opatowski):
Under „Zabytki”, you have an item about cemetery:
* Cmentarz parafialny założony w XIX w. etc. // Parish cemetery created in 19 century.
Then in „Zobacz też” an URL to the parish in Lasocin
Parafia św. Michała Archanioła w Lasocinie
https://pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parafia_%C5%9Bw._Micha%C5%82a_Archanio%C5%82a_w_Lasocinie
Postal address:
Lasocin
27-530 Ożarów
Poland
and description on Diocezja Sandomierska site:
http://www.diecezjasandomierska.pl/parafie/dekanaty/17-24/zawichost/341-lasocin-%C5%9Bw-micha%C5%82a-archanio%C5%82a.html
Very well done, with telephone number written in international way, an email, and names of priests: the pastor in charge of the parish, and the one taking care of the website – that is precious.
That website have a link to its Facebook at https://www.facebook.com/DiecezjaSandomierskaPL/
See a short youtube showing the cemetery in your Lasocin (beware: several Lasocin, yours is in Swietokrzyskie voievodship) on 1 November 2012 “Lasocin cmentarz woj. Świętokrzyskie”
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xEdulJ-0UXM
Your pics from cemetery:
http://polishorigins.com/forum/files/grandmother_maternal__marianna_jaslan_zoom_129.jpg
http://polishorigins.com/forum/files/grandmother_maternal__marianna_jaslan_931.jpg
Top: Ś P surrounding a cross is the most used on Polish graves, it means Świętej Pamięci, literally Holy Memory
MARIANNA JAŚLAN
żyła lat 90 // she lived 90 years
zm (zmarła) 21.I.1973 // died 21 January 1973
prosi o Zdrowaś Maria // she asks for Ave Maria prayer
BIRTH-ESTIMATE: 1893
NOTE1:
Very often the month is in Roman numbers, as on your graves
http://polishorigins.com/forum/files/grandfather_maternal__jozef_jaslan_zoom_632.jpg
http://polishorigins.com/forum/files/grandfather_maternal__jozef_jaslan_188.jpg
Top: Ś P surrounding a cross is the most used on Polish graves, it means Świętej Pamięci, literally Holy Memory
JÓZEF JAŚLAN
żył lat 55 // he lived 55 years
zm (zmarł) 28.V.1928 // died 28 May 1928
BIRTH-ESTIMATE: 1873
This table in stone is in central part of the grave, which was probably created for a family, with initially two white tables, on the left and on the right side.
The name on the left side is:
Ś P
STANISŁAWA TABOR
żyła lat 87 // she lived 87 years
zm (zmarła) 21.VII.1990 // died 21 July 1990
pokój jej duszy // peace of her soul
BIRTH-ESTIMATE: 1903
Below this left table is the smaller one, definitely older one, maybe in iron, with the same inscription. I think that initially in 1990 Stanisława Tabor’s grave was just in the ground with a wooden cross on which the initial small description was attached (it is the normal stage when you have to burry someone, and his family does not have a gravestone). But Józef’s gravestone is older, probably existing in 1990. Why so? Anyway Tabor are connected to Jaślan.
Either Stanisława Tabor was married, Tabor is her husband name, her initial grave was in other village, and moved later here, or maybe the family needed to agree. There is no Mr Tabor in that grave, maybe left in his village, or killed during WWII, or something else.
Or Stanisława Tabor died unmarried, and Tabor is her maiden name.
Józef Jaślan [BIRTH-ESTIMATE: 1873] DEATH=1928, AGE=55
Marianna Jaślan [BIRTH-ESTIMATE: 1893] DEATH=1973, AGE=90
Stanisława Tabor [BIRTH-ESTIMATE: 1903] DEATH=1990, AGE=87
It is possible Marianna Jaślan and Stanisława Tabor were sisters, 10 years of difference. The death record of Stanisława Tabor could clarify.
From the marriage record of your mother Helena, we know your grandmother's maiden name was "z Hudłów" or something similar. After checking for existence of Hudł*, I am sure it is not H at the begging, but rather K, "z Kudłów" => Kudła? CORRECTION
In 1922, Józef Jaślan is 49. If Maria Kudła is Marianna Jaślan, then she is 29 giving birth to Helena, and widow when 35.
Do not worry about the apparent difference Marianna and Maria.
Quote: |
Name: Jaślen Helena
Occupation: no
Faith: Roman-Catholic
Status: Miss [unmarried]
Birth date: 10 October 1922
Birth place: Ożarów
(birth place) County: Opatów
(birth place) Voievodship: Kielce
Names of parents and maiden name of mother: Józef and Maria born CORRECTION: "z Hudłów" -> no, rather "z Kudłów" => Kudła?
|
Another question comes to mind: why Marianna Jaślan and Józef Jaślan do not share the same grave? Marianna survived her husband by 45 years.
The two graves, the one of Marianna Jaślan, and the big one of Józef Jaślan and Stanisława Tabor, are identical in design, which let think about the same stonecutter, and the same time both graves were created: many years after the death of Józef.
Maybe a family conflict between Marianna and Stanisława? Or something else?
Last question: who moved the grave of Stanisława Tabor to the grave with Józef Jaślan name? Family living in Lasocin?
Today distribution of the name Tabor, quite popular, 4697 names:
http://www.moikrewni.pl/mapa/kompletny/tabor.html
Today distribution of the name Kudła, 4306 names:
http://www.moikrewni.pl/mapa/kompletny/kud%25C5%2582a.html
==
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fopuszyn
Joined: 31 Aug 2014
Replies: 177
Location: Connecticut USABack to top |
Posted: Sat Feb 13, 2016 11:50 am
Post subject: Wojciech Wierzchowski d.1810
Elzbieta Porteneuve wrote: | fopuszyn wrote: | Elzbieta
Attached is 1809 death record for a Anna Wierzchowska (born Lopuszynska) from parish Chrostkowo (Lipno). I suspect she might be some how related to my 4G GF Tomasz Lopuszynski (d.1817) from Adamowo. Maybe Tomasz's sister?
Looking for the smallest of clues on who she is - parents, birthplace, etc. Looks like she was ~40 years when she died so she was born ~1769. Tomasz was born ~1757.
Thanks in advance...
Frank |
Frank,
Here it is. It is only said "married", which implies her husband is surviving her (otherwise "widow"). No information about her husband.
Best,
Elzbieta
==
==PO268:
http://polishorigins.com/forum/files/ta_wierzchowska_anna_d1809_137.jpg
DATE-of-ACT: 14 March 1809, in Chrostkowo in the department of Plock county Lipno
WITNESSES: Wawrzeniec Detmer, shepherd, 50 years old and Pawel Rybarkewicz, innkeeper, 40 years old, neighbors, both living in Chrostkowo
KTO: Anna born Lopuszynska spouse Wierzchowska, died 14 March 1809, 6 am, in Chrostkowo, 40 years old, married
Roku 1809 dnia 14 miesiaca marca. Przed nami ksiedzem Kapelanem kosciola Chrostkowskiego sprawujacym obowiazki urzednika Stanu Cywilnego gminy Chrostkowskiej w departamencie Plockim powiecie Lipinskim. Stawili sie Wawrzeniec Detmer, owczarz lat 50 liczacy i Pawel Rybarkewicz, karczmarz majacy lat 40, sasiedzi, obydwaj mieszkajacy w Chrostkowie, i oswiadczyli nam iz dnia 14 marca roku biezacego o godzinie 6 z rana umarla Anna z Lopuszynskich Wierzchowska w Chrostkowie, lat 40 majaca, mezata. Po czem akt niniejszy oswiadczajacym przeczytany i od nas podpisany zostal, gdyz oswiadczajacy pisac nie umieli.
Xsiadz Anzelm Gowinski, Karmelita Kapelan kosciola Chrostkowskiego, sprawujacy obowiazki Urzednika Stanu Cywilnego
Translated:
Year 1809, day 14 of the month of March. Before us, priest chaplain of the church in Chrostkowo exercising duties of the officer of Civil Vital Records Registry for the community Chrostkowo in the department of Plock county Lipno. Appeared in Wawrzeniec Detmer, shepherd, 50 years old and Pawel Rybarkewicz, innkeeper, 40 years old, neighbors, both living in Chrostkowo, and declared to us that on 14 March of the current year at 6 am died Anna born Lopuszynska spouse Wierzchowska in Chrostkowo, 40 years old, married. Then this act was read to the declarant and by us was signed, because declaring did not know how to write.
Priest Anzelm Gowinski, Carmelite chaplain of the church in Chrostkowo, exercising duties of the officer of Civil Vital Records Registry
== |
Elzbieta,
Attached in 1810 death record from Chrostkowo parish for a Wojciech Wierzchowski. I can't decipher record too well but I suspect this person is either the husband of Anna (born Lopuszynska) or her chilld? Anna died in 1809. I know Anna was married to a Wojciech Wierzchowski so this might him... not clear to me.
I'm always looking for new clues to validate data I already have....
Frank
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fopuszyn
Joined: 31 Aug 2014
Replies: 177
Location: Connecticut USABack to top |
Posted: Sat Feb 13, 2016 2:50 pm
Post subject: Grzegorz Wierzchowski d.1815
Elzbieta,
This is so confusing, hurts my head. Found a 1815 death record for a Grzegorz Wierzchowski age 50 years. I see that name Franciszka Wierzchowska - not sure who she is? His mother from your previous translation? That woman was 78 when she died in 1815. Both Grzegorz and Franciska died in 1815, not sure who died first.
Not sure who Grzegorz is? Maybe Wojciech (previous submitted post) and Grzegorz were brothers? Both sons of Piotr and Franciszka?
Maybe Grzegorz also had a wife named Franciszka?
Frank
UPDATE: Looks like Grzegorz married Franciszka born Lewandowska in 1796.
http://www.geneteka.genealodzy.pl/index.php?rid=S&from_date=1796&to_date=1796&search_lastname=wierzchowski&search_lastname2=&rpp1=0&bdm=S&w=02kp&op=gt&lang=pol
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johnkril
Joined: 12 Feb 2016
Replies: 11
Location: AustraliaBack to top |
Posted: Sat Feb 13, 2016 7:42 pm
Post subject:
Wow Izbieta,
this is all amazing and I am so grateful to you for opening up this window to my heritage. I am in awe at the skills that you posess that enable you to search with the skill that you do.
Now though it seems that we have some good information from which to do archival searches for records about:
Jozef Jaslan
Maria Jaslan (ne Kudlow or Kudla) wife of Joseph
Stanislawa Tabor
I am a little confused though on one matter. Quoting from the wedding certificate there is mentioned the voievodship of Kiielce but from Google Earth I see that the region of my mothers birth is in the Swietokrzyskie voievodship. Can you explain?
Also can you tell me where records for the towns of Ozarow, Opatow and Lasocin might be found? I imagine that there would be archives for the Swietokrzyskie voievodship and I wonder if this is where I should look.
And one more thing please. I have attached another photograph of a headstone which is also a piece of the puzzle and which will probably help when I make search in archives.
Thank you so very much
John
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fopuszyn
Joined: 31 Aug 2014
Replies: 177
Location: Connecticut USABack to top |
Posted: Sat Feb 13, 2016 8:13 pm
Post subject: Kacper Lopuszynski m.1810
Elzbieta
Attached is 1810 marriage record from Chrostkowo parish for Kacper Lopuszynski and Elzbieta Wisniewska.
Looking for more new clues...
Frank
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johnkril
Joined: 12 Feb 2016
Replies: 11
Location: AustraliaBack to top |
Posted: Sat Feb 13, 2016 10:17 pm
Post subject:
Sorry Elzbieta for the misspelling in my earlier request.
Regards
John
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