Posted: Thu Jul 21, 2016 6:10 pm
Post subject: Delevia / Nachka -- Locations or corrections?
Hello All:
The amount of assistance I've received here has been amazing. So many helpful posts and lots of experts! Really thankful for your insight.
I'm revisiting a dead-end in my research... I had an answer from an associate of mine, on two village names (which also happened to be near each other) for where my 3x great-grandparents were born.
I can't verify the information -- as the suspected villages records were destroyed during the war.
I wanted a second opinion (or several) however.
I don't want to state what his suggestions were, as I don't want to lead anyone's thoughts.
I'm attaching a delayed birth record for their son.
My 3x great-grandfather was Steven Vilinski in the US. He disappeared and his US record trail, beyond his wife's obituary, is virtually non-existent. I know the correct surname is Wiliński.. And I assumed his first name to be Szczepan or Stefan.. But his daughter's marriage record (in latin) does list him as Stanislei. All other mentions are Steven. I do not have an estimated birth date for him. In the attached document, it states his birth village to be 'Delevia'.
My 3x great-grandmother was Anna Camlet. I've seen the last name spelled Cimlet on some records. Celimet (on the attached) is the only time I've seen it that way.
She was born 28 Sep 1881. Her obituary states she came to the United States in 1896. Her parents were Jacob and Rosella. I had found a passenger list I thought was hers, but she immediately settled in WV and this had her going to the NE. It also conflicted with the timeframe presented in her obituary. The attached document states her birth village to be "Nachka".
1. It would be amazing to find/confirm the actual birth villages.
2. Also would be great to find correct passenger lists for these two. They had a daughter in 1902 in Cleveland. I assumed they had settled first in Wheeling, WV but cannot be certain. Passenger lists with destinations of Ohio, West Virginia, Western PA and Northern Kentucky could be contenders.
(PS: I've also attached the marriage record for Anna's daughter Mary, where it states the father's name was possibly Stanislei not Stefan.. Not that it's a big lead, but it is one of the earlier records I have that mentions his name).
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delayed birth record for Anna's son, stating the parental birth towns in question. |
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obituary for Anna Camlet Wilinska Mytnik. |
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wedding record referencing 'Stanislei' not 'Stefan'. |
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_________________ Newcomer to Polish genealogy. Currently researching: Nowakowski, Markuszewski, Stachyra, Wiliński, Mirczak, and Ciscoń.
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Magroski49PO Top Contributor & Patron
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Posted: Thu Jul 21, 2016 8:42 pm
Post subject: Re: Delevia / Nachka -- Locations or corrections?
oncemore wrote: | Hello All:
I do not have an estimated birth date for him. In the attached document, it states his birth village to be 'Delevia'.
2. Also would be great to find correct passenger lists for these two. They had a daughter in 1902 in Cleveland. nders.
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According to this birth record, Steven was born in 1877.
I can only think of Delawa, then Galicia, now Ukraine.
The birth record mentions the couple had 3 other children. Did you check US Census for 1910 in PA? Did you check E-Services in Westmoreland County for their marriage?
Gilberto
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Posted: Thu Jul 21, 2016 9:10 pm
Post subject:
Hi Gilberto!
Thanks for your response.
I've looked at that before, and am hesitant to accept it as a solid number.
Anna is listed as 27 at time of birth, but if I calculate between Her birthdate and Virgils in 1906, it is 24 years and 9 months.
I think it's probably safe to safe Steven was born somewhere between 1877 and 1879.
I have not been able to find a 1910 or 1920 census for the family, as of yet. I only have 1930 & 40 (with Steven already deceased).
I have poked there before.. But I don't think a record would be in westmoreland. in 1902 -- their eldest daughter was born in Cleveland Ohio. As of yet, I have been unable to find any marriage record there.
I am going to send you a separate PM!
_________________ Newcomer to Polish genealogy. Currently researching: Nowakowski, Markuszewski, Stachyra, Wiliński, Mirczak, and Ciscoń.
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PolishLibrarianPO Top Contributor
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Posted: Thu Jul 21, 2016 10:42 pm
Post subject: Delevia / Nachka -- Locations or corrections?
Oncemore~ What we know:
1. Daughter Mary born in Jan 1902 in Cleveland, son Virgil born in 1906 in PA (at this point there were apparently 4 living children, if so then Mary probably isn't the oldest).
2. Annie Mytnik's will has her leaving her estate to her daughter Genevieve Vilinsky, and in Annie's obituary in 1947 Genevieve was still unmarried. The same year Annie died Genevieve married August Mitan, widower. SSDI says Genevieve Vilinksi was born 25 Aug 1910 (no location). Genevieve Mitan's FindAGrave record shows a Dec. 3, 1912 birth date in Dillonvale, Jefferson County, OH.
3. If Steven died 32 years before Annie, then he died in 1915-16 and according to Virgil's birth cert, he died in Pond Creek, KY.
4. 1930 census for Joe & Anna Mitnik in Pease Township, Jefferson County, OH has son Steve Vilinsky, age 18, born in PA.
They certainly did move around. Ideally you need to find the church record for Annie and Steven's marriage which would hopefully give their birth villages – if Mary is first child, then perhaps the marriage is in Cleveland as well. Too bad there are no Catholic church records from Cleveland on FamilySearch (like there is for Chicago). Good Luck. ~PL
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Posted: Thu Jul 21, 2016 11:00 pm
Post subject:
Hello PL
--
Thanks for your response!!
Yes, would hopefully be a help if I could find the missing wedding record..
It could also very well be that Anna married young in Poland. If her obituary is to be believed, she came to America around age 15.
This has been a difficult family to track, however.
I believe that Steven moved about in his work as a coal miner, and I don't think it was a very stable home situation.
I do believe that might be the reason it's proven impossible to find them in the 1910 census.
From a cousin of mine, I had heard that Steven had abandoned the family shortly after the youngest was born... And Anna had to put them In a children's home for a few years. She later took them back.
This cousin had seen the orphanage record (which has since gone missing according to the archives it should be at) and on the record it said Steven had fled because he was wanted for murder. Who knows what the true story was. That would have been around 1914-15, so who knows of Steven was really deceased. He could have just disappeared for the rest of his life.
But I attribute that to issues tracking them in the 1920 census as well. Only Mary appears as she is 18 and married.
I think the delayed birth record is misleading. It is supposed to be info 'as of the date of birth' but it appears they blended some facts.
There were 5 total children, ranging from 1902-1913. I am attaching a snapshot.
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_________________ Newcomer to Polish genealogy. Currently researching: Nowakowski, Markuszewski, Stachyra, Wiliński, Mirczak, and Ciscoń.
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dnowickiPO Top Contributor
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Posted: Fri Jul 22, 2016 12:11 pm
Post subject: wilinski
Oncemore & All,
I believe that the most accurate form of Stephen's given name is found in Mary's marriage record. It appears most likely that his given name was Stanislaw rather than Szczepan/Stefan. His name in the marriage record is written as Stanislai (the Genitive of Stanislaus, which is the Latin version of Stanislaw). This seems to be the most accurate version of his given name based on the fact that it appears that his family, like many immigrants and their American born children, substituted American names for their actual Polish names. If you look at the bottom (certificate section) of the attached record of "Virgil's" marriage, the priest who witnessed the marriage recorded the name of the groom as Wladislaw (Virgil) Vilinski. It seems that the priest took the Wladyslaw [proper Polish spelling] from the baptismal certificate produced by the groom prior to the wedding. On the baptismal cert. his name would most likely have appeared in Latin as Ladislaus, which is the Latin version of Wladyslaw. In the Chicago area many men whose Polish name was Wladyslaw used "Walter/Wally" as their name. It appears that where the Wilinski family settled the substitute of choice was "Virgil" rather than "Walter". Again, in Chicago men whose name was Stanislaw used "Stanley" in English. The only thing the English names of choice have in common with the actual Polish names is a degree of similarity in sound. It is not much of a a stretch to believe that a Stanislaw in Ohio, Pennsylvania, or West Virginia would adopt a name which may have been common in the area, Stephen, as a substitute for Stanislaw.
The attached records may provide the info needed to obtain copies of the actual church records of baptism for "Virgil" since the marriage record states that he was born in Beaver Falls, PA. There was a Polish parish (Holy Trinity) in Beaver Falls but it was founded in 1910 so he probably would have been baptized in one of the other Catholic churches there.
The delayed birth cert. of "Stella" (whose Polish given name was probably Stanislawa) provides the name of the Catholic grammar school she attended so it may be possible to obtain info from the school records (which were available when she obtained her delayed birth cert. in 1972. (She attended St. Ladislaus school in 1921.)
The marriage record for Genevieve from St. Alphonsus Church in 1947 also may provide some clues. As a side note, the civil marriage record indicates that she had been divorced. For a Catholic who was divorced to marry in church in 1947 either their former spouse had to have died or the person had to have the prior marriage annulled. At that time, although various grounds for annulments existed, the most common and easiest to prove was lack of canonical form. Catholics were bound to marry in the presence of a priest and two witnesses (canonical form) for the marriage to be recognized by the Catholic Church as valid. In other words, if, for example, a Catholic got married civilly by a justice of the peace and that marriage ended in divorce it was only a question of providing the documentation that it was merely a civil marriage and that marriage could be declared null and the individual was free to marry someone else in church.
These clues may not provide the info about where the parents were from in Poland, but they may get you a bit closer by at least confirming the actual Polish name of "Stephen". If you were trying to learn where Mary's husband was born in Poland, the record gives both the village where he was born and the parish where he was baptized. Too bad that everything can't be that easy.
Wishing you success,
Dave
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Posted: Fri Jul 22, 2016 5:54 pm
Post subject:
Hello Dave:
Thank you for your response!
Interesting thought regarding the names.. Most all of my polish ancestors americanized their name upon immigration... I guess I just always thought it was weird that he wouldn't of chosen the 'correct' corresponding english version... I have a few Stanislaw's and to a T they all became Stanleys haha.
I'll dig into the baptismal record -- thanks for the thought there.
RE: the attached "Genevieve" wedding record. That was a tricky one... Genevieve's brother, Steven A. Vilinski.. Actually married a Genevieve Dudzinski in 1944, and then divorced sometime before her marriage to Mitan in 1947. So that isn't his sister Genevieve being married, but rather his ex-wife. The 'real' Genevieve Vilinski died in 1994 having never married.
Re: Stella's school record.. St. Ladislaus was the predominant polish church in wheeling at the time. After it later closed down, the records eventually made their way to the diocesan archives. I've tried to work w/ them in the past to receive the records when the kids where in the children's home (which was run by the parish) and other records I thought might have clues -- but to date the only record that has surfaced was the marriage record for Mary that I attached.
I'm still a little shocked on the Delevia/Nachka town names. Anna was definitely alive at the time Virgil applied for that delayed birth certificate. Even if they didn't know the proper spelling -- I haven't had any luck shaking out any good suggestions for what they might have been phonetically.
I guess I can now throw out my friend's suggestion..
There is 1 passenger list we found for Anna Camlet. The timeline is a few years off of her obituary immigration date, and she's headed to Massachusetts instead of towards the midwest US... But I suppose it could be her. The father's name also matches. It lists a birth town of Nasiadki. So I think he correlated Nachka to Nasiadki. And then nearby to that there is Dylewo.. Which he equated to Delevia in the birth record.
Unfortunately, the years i'd need vital records for to corroborate, are missing due to destruction.
Re; Mary's husband the Stachyras -- I have had much success tracing that line!
_________________ Newcomer to Polish genealogy. Currently researching: Nowakowski, Markuszewski, Stachyra, Wiliński, Mirczak, and Ciscoń.
Last edited by oncemore on Fri Jul 22, 2016 6:07 pm; edited 2 times in total
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Posted: Fri Jul 22, 2016 5:58 pm
Post subject:
Also -- it Seems there is yet another spelling of 'Camlet' in the wedding record you attached for Virgil.. But I can't quite make it out.. Any thoughts?
_________________ Newcomer to Polish genealogy. Currently researching: Nowakowski, Markuszewski, Stachyra, Wiliński, Mirczak, and Ciscoń.
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PolishLibrarianPO Top Contributor
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Posted: Sat Jul 23, 2016 9:41 am
Post subject: Wiliński
Oncemore~ I see Czamlit as Mary's surname on Virgil's marriage record. If you check www.moikrewni.pl/mapa, Czamlet is a Polish surname, although there are not many & they're not in the “right” area of Poland. Whereas Camlet occurs most frequently in Ostrołęcka which is where Nasiadki and Dylewo are located. Wiliński, although not heavily concentrated in Ostrołęcka, does occur there. On the marriage record, the surname was most likely recorded the way it sounded when Virgil said it (possibly with an accent since he probably spoke Polish as his first language). Interesting that Virgil's marriage record of 1927 says he was born in Beaver Falls NW of Pittsburgh and his delayed birth cert. says he was born in Lowber, SE of Pittsburgh (definitely a mining area).
If you are using Anna's obituary, which states she lived in the Wheeling area for 50 years, as the basis for her immigrating straight to WV, I would take that info with a grain of salt. It is based on info provided by her surviving children. The further from the event the information is provided the more likely it is incorrect in some way.
I think the passenger record having her come to a brother in Mass. could very well be her. My great uncle came to his brother-in-law in rural IL (100 mi. from Chicago) first, but by 4 years later when his wife arrived, he had settled in a small Polish community in NE Mpls. (who knows why he didn't go to Chicago where there were so many Poles, his brother-in-law went there to get married). People often came to a relative and then moved on to another place where there might be more opportunities for them or more people from their Polish village/area.
As to the suggested Polish villages for the spellings Delevia and Nachka, have you tried putting the suggested village names Dylewo and Nasiadki into Google translate and listening to how they sound in Polish? To my ear (don't speak Polish) they sound very similar to the Delevia and Nachka spellings.
I wouldn't throw out your friend's suggestions yet. I would still try to find Anna & Steven's marriage record and a baptismal record for Mary. I would try the Cleveland Diocese for records for the church that was “the” Polish church – apparently that is St. Stanislaus (founded 1883), although Sacred Heart of Jesus (founded 1889) and then St. Casimir (founded 1891) were created before Steven and Anna probably arrived see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shrine_Church_of_St._Stanislaus Don't know how helpful the Diocese is in these matters, but if you have a birth date for Mary, I would start with that and work backward for the marriage.
Also this site is interesting because it mention why the various Polish neighborhoods were estabalished – indicating where the jobs were https://sites.google.com/site/clevelandanditsneighborhoods/home/ethnic-groups-in-cleveland/poles ~PL
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