PolishOrigins(TM) Forum

St. Florian Church, Brzesec Poland

kmille02 — Sat Jun 04, 2016 3:29 pm

Author: kmille02

Posted: Sat Jun 04, 2016 3:29 pm

Elizbieta, Henryk, Dave,
Oh my goodness you have made my day, I have been busy and not able to get back to this website all week. I would never have dreamed that I could have gotten so much information from one post. I love this website and the people who own it, Zen is a wonderful researcher and tour guide. This just makes it so real that when I come back to Poland in 2018 I will definitely have places to go and see for myself where my ancestors are from on my mother's paternal side of the family.

I retire in January and plan to learn some Polish so when I return I can really ask some of the questions myself without an interpreter.

Bless all of you and have a wonderful weekend. I can't wait to plug all this into my genealogy program.
Karen

Re: St. Florian Church- Brzesec Poland

dnowicki — Fri Jun 03, 2016 9:01 pm

Author: dnowicki

Posted: Fri Jun 03, 2016 9:01 pm

Elzbieta,

I guess no garden is not so bad in the grand scheme of things. 1 meter of water can do quite a bit of damage to a house. I hope that all the artwork that was vulnerable in the Louvre was transferred to safety. A gardener's fond hope always is that next year will be better.

I found one more record for Karen---the birth of Franciszka Ulanska. Everything matches with the marriage record you translated except the spelling of the surname but I'm confident that it is her record.
An interesting thing about the 1857 Witowo records is that the branch archive in Wloclawek has both the civil transcripts in Polish and the sacramental records in Latin. I'll translate the Latin version for Karen and then it should be time for her have the pleasure of discovering records for herself. After all, we wouldn't want to deprive her of fun.

Hoping the planets align for dryer weather in Paris,

Dawid

Latin text of B & B of Franciszka Ulanska:

Pscininek #7
Anno Domini ut supra die 10 Februarii baptisavi infantem nomine Franciscam filiam Michaelis et Mariannae de Ziolkowskich legitimorum conjugum Ulinskich molendarii de Pscininek die 7 ejusdem mensis et anni natam patrini fuere Blasius Lewandowski et Maryanna Gurdys.

Translation:

(Village of) Pscininek #7
In the year of Our Lord as above (i.e. 1857) on the 10th day of February I baptized an infant by the name of Franciszka, the daughter of the legitimate marriage of Michal and of Maryanna nee Ziolkowska Ulinski, a miller from Pscininek, born on the 7th day of the same month and year. The sponsors were Blazej Lewandowski and Maryanna Gurdys.

Re: St. Florian Church- Brzesec Poland

Elzbieta Porteneuve — Thu Jun 02, 2016 5:17 pm

Author: Elzbieta Porteneuve

Posted: Thu Jun 02, 2016 5:17 pm

dnowicki wrote:

Hi Elzbieta, Karen, etc.,

The planets must be aligned today----a good day to find records on the less than user friendly sight. Based on Franciszka's age in the record Elzbieta just translated I thought that her marriage must have taken place within one or two years of Jan's birth. As luck would have it, here is the marriage record---Radziejow 1877 image 50.

Now it is time to return to the garden.

Dave

Dave,

The planets are aligned in flooding France and Germany .... no garden for me. But I am not complaining, some people in Paris area have 1 meter high of water inside their houses, and no electricity.
Chambord Castle is our new Mont St Michel
http://www.lefigaro.fr/culture/2016/06/01/03004-20160601ARTFIG00265-le-chateau-de-chambord-noye-sous-les-eaux.php
You can find plenty of pictures of Paris, and River Seine with water level higher than in 1910 (the worst until 2016), i.e.
Petit diaporama: https://www.facebook.com/mhaton/posts/10209015689129957?pnref=story … #Seine #inondations

Best,
Elzbieta
==

Here is the next record, marriage from 1877.

==PO310:
https://www.genealogiawarchiwach.pl/#query.facetQuery.city=Radziej%25C3%25B3w&query.page=2&query.suggestion=false&query.thumbnails=false&query.facet=true&query.sortMode=DEFAULT&modal=293807561&goComments=false&searcher=big&query.query

71/232/0/51 (50) - 1877
Radziejow 29 [county Nieszawa]
It happened in the village Radziejow on /14/25/ November 1877, at 12:00 noon

MARRIAGE: religious, in the village Radziejow on /14/25/ November 1877, at 12:00 noon
GROOM: Jozef Jędrzejewski, young man, 33 years old, day laborer, born and residing in the village Broniszewo [NOTE] with his mother
GROOM-PARENTS: son of late Wojciech? and Katarzyna spouses Jędrzejewski
BRIDE: Franciszka Ulańska, Miss, 20 years old, born in Pścininek parish Witowo, residing in the village Radziejow, with her mother
BRIDE-PARENTS: daughter of the late Michal and Marianna, spouses Ulański,
WITNESSES: Jozef Szalek, 39 years old, and Jozef Nowakowski, 39 years old, both day laborers residing in the village Radziejow
BANNS: /30 October/11/; /6/18/; /13/25/ November 1877, in parish church in Radziejow and in Broniszewo
NOTE: I think it should be Broniszewo, county Konin, community Wierzbinek – old church https://pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Broniszewo_(powiat_koni%C5%84ski)

==
NOTE: geography of all records, with map:
Miechowice,+Poland/Brześć+Kujawski,+Poland/Nieszawa,+Poland/Radziejow,+Poland/Skaszyn,+Poland/Izbica+Kujawska,+Poland/Kolo,+Poland/Witowo,+Poland/Pścininek,+Poland/Broniszewo,+Wierzbinek,+Poland

==

Re: St. Florian Church- Brzesec Poland

dnowicki — Thu Jun 02, 2016 1:17 pm

Author: dnowicki

Posted: Thu Jun 02, 2016 1:17 pm

Hi Elzbieta, Karen, etc.,

The planets must be aligned today----a good day to find records on the less than user friendly sight. Based on Franciszka's age in the record Elzbieta just translated I thought that her marriage must have taken place within one or two years of Jan's birth. As luck would have it, here is the marriage record---Radziejow 1877 image 50.

Now it is time to return to the garden.

Dave

Re: St. Florian Church- Brzesec Poland

Elzbieta Porteneuve — Thu Jun 02, 2016 12:41 pm

Author: Elzbieta Porteneuve

Posted: Thu Jun 02, 2016 12:41 pm

Dave, Karen, all,

You are great.

Here is translation. In this birth record the original Polish names are recorded, which helps me to correct "Franciszka born Ulianska" from marriage record in 1902, to "Franciszka born Ulańska".

Best,
Elzbieta

==PO310:
http://polishorigins.com/forum/files/thumbs/t_jan_birth_248.jpg
Radziejow N76, 1879 [county Nieszawa]
It happened in the village Radziejow on /14/26/ August 1879, at 4 pm.
DAY-of-ACT: /14/26/ - 26 August 1879, at 4 pm, in the village Radziejow
FATHER: Józef Jędrzejewski, 34 years old, поденщик=day laborer, residing in the village Radziejow
MOTHER: Franciszka born Ulańska, 22 years old, his wife
KTO: Jan Jędrzejewski born /14/26/- 26 August 1879, at 11 am, in the village Radziejow
WITNESSES: Franciszek Depta, 36 years old, and Kacper Milczarek, 30 years, both day laborers, residing in the village Radziejow
GODPARENTS: Franciszek Depta and Antonina Malecka
NOTE: the spelling Jędrzejewski and Jendrzejewski are close; recovering this name from entirely Cyrillic script (such as the marriage record from 1902) will always get “Jendrzejewski”, unless the scribe added the original Polish Latin script version inside Cyrillic record (as in this birth record from 1879)

==

Re: St. Florian Church- Brzesec Poland

dnowicki — Thu Jun 02, 2016 8:25 am

Author: dnowicki

Posted: Thu Jun 02, 2016 8:25 am

Elzbieta, Karen, etc.,

I looked for Jan & Stanislawa's birth records and found Jan's (Radziejow 1879 image 20). Stanislawa should have been recorded in Izbica in the year 1882. Unfortunately, Izbica's records for that year have not been published online yet---all the surrounding years, but not 1882. Hopefully it will appear in the near future as has happened with missing years for other parishes.
Elzbieta, I completely agree that the site is not easy to deal with but am extremely grateful that the records are available since the site has given me the opportunity to locate family records from the last quarter of the 19th Century which were not available on microfilm. Previously, the way to obtain records from those years required requesting the records from the archive which was even less user friendly. But enough of that.

Anyway, I thought that I would post Jan's birth record.

The best to all,
Dave

Re: St. Florian Church- Brzesec Poland

Elzbieta Porteneuve — Wed Jun 01, 2016 5:13 pm

Author: Elzbieta Porteneuve

Posted: Wed Jun 01, 2016 5:13 pm

Dave, Karen, Henryk, all,

Yes, succes! It is indeed the marriage record Jendrzejewski - Dolatowska, on 11 November 1902.

Thanks David for showing me it is page 84 year 1902 (for the record number 43), as navigating in the very specific and slow system is rather not friendly.
Hats off to the scribe for providing full administrative civil hierarchy of places, as well as giving parish name.

Here it is:

https://www.genealogiawarchiwach.pl/#query.query=Jendrzejewski&query.city=Brze%25C5%259B%25C4%2587+Kujawski&query.dateFrom=1902&query.dateTo=1902&query.suggestion=false&query.thumbnails=false&query.facet=true&query.sortMode=DEFAULT&modal=257858398&goComments=false&searcher=big

Parish in Brześć Kujawski,1902
Kolonia Miechowice
It happened in the town Brześć on /29 October/11 November/ 1902, at 6 pm.

MARRIAGE: religious, in the town Brześć Kujawski on /29 October/11 November/ - 11 November 1902, at 6 pm
GROOM: Jan [scibe: Joann, in Polish Jan] Jendrzejewski, young man, carpenter, 23 years old, born in the village Radziejow, ujezd=county Nieszawa, residing in the town and ujezd=county Wloclawek,
GROOM-PARENTS: son of the living citizens Jozef and Franciszka born Ulańska, (?) spouses Jendrzejewski, residing in the village Radziejow, county Nieszawa
BRIDE: Stanislawa Dolatowska, Miss, 20 years old, born in the village Skaszyn, parish Izbica, county Koło, governorate Kalisz, residing in Kolonia Miechowice, local parish, county Wloclawek, staying with her parents
BRIDE-PARENTS: daughter of the living farmers Jan [scibe Joann, in Polish Jan, signature: Jan] Dolatowski and Marianna born Kimasiewicz, spouses Dolatowski,
WITNESSES: Adam Grabowski, 42 years old, and Andrzej Jasinski, 60 years old, both farmers residing in Kolonia Miechowice
BANNS: /29 September/11 October/; /6/19/; /13/26/ October 1902, in parish in Brzesc and in Wloclawek
SIGNATURE: Jan Dolatowski

NOTE: The signature is Jan Dolatowski, therefore Joann or alike is scribe’s own method. I am attaching the end of record with Jan Dolatowski signature.

==

Best,
Elzbieta

CORRECETED: Ulianska to Ulańska (birth record from 1879 with Polish names in Latin script)

Re: St. Florian Church- Brzesec Poland

dnowicki — Wed Jun 01, 2016 11:35 am

Author: dnowicki

Posted: Wed Jun 01, 2016 11:35 am

Henryk & Elzbieta & Karen,

I believe I may have found the scan of the marriage but not from St. Florian parish but St. Stanislaus Bishop & Martyr in Brzesc Kujawski.

Henryk,

Brzesc Litewski was part of the Russian Empire but it was not in the Congress Kingdom (Krolestwo Polskie). It was on the east side of the Bug River which at the time marked the eastern border of Russian Poland as today it marks the border between Poland and Ukraine. Brzesc was on the wrong side of the river. However, Brzesc Kujawski was in what is commonly referred to as Russian Poland since it was part of powiat Wloclawski of the Congress Kingdom. My maternal grandfather frequently used to speak about going to Brzesc Kujawski since it was one of the closest large towns to my great grandparents farm.

Elzbieta,

I believe the attached is the scan of the correct marriage. Despite my poor ability with Cyrillic, I believe the date and names of the couple are correct. If you would have the time to check the names of the bride and groom I'm sure it would help Karen's research to move forward.

Karen,

If Elzbieta verifies that this is the correct marriage record, the attached is a picture of the parish church where your great grandparents were married. If your great grandmother was born in the same locality you should be able to find the record of her birth online at the site genealogiawarchiwach.pl

Greetings to all on a rainy morning in Michigan City,

Dave

Re: St. Florian Church- Brzesec Poland

Henryk — Tue May 31, 2016 6:35 pm

Author: Henryk

Posted: Tue May 31, 2016 6:35 pm

For parishes in 1934 (see jpg).:
http://www.wbc.poznan.pl/dlibra/docmetadata?id=12786
Brześć Kujawski had been in the German Partition.
Brześć Litewski, later Brześć na Bugiem, had been in the Russian Partition.
None of the Parishes are St Florian.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brest,_Belarus
Information on Brześć Litewski

https://familysearch.org/search/catalog/1652220?availability=Family%20History%20Library
LDS records:
Metrical books, 1700-1914
Roman Catholic Church. Brest Litovskiĭ (Brest) (Main Author)
Format: Manuscript/Manuscript on Film
Language: Polish Russian Latin
Publication: Salt Lake City, Utah : Filmed by the Genealogical Society of Utah, 1995-2009
Physical: on 19 microfilm reels ; 35 mm.
Notes
Microreproduction of original manuscripts at the National Historical Archives of Belarus, Minsk, at the National Historical Archives of Belarus, Grodno (formerly known as State Historical Archives of Belarus, Grodno) and in the Lithuanian State Historical Archives in Vilnius.

Roman Catholic Church records (births, marriages, deaths, communions) for Brest Litovskiĭ, Brest, Grodno, Russia; later Brześć (Brześć), Polesie, Poland; later Brėst, Brėst, Brėst, Belarus. Text in Polish, Latin and Russian.

Record group 473, series 1, files 1-4, 7-23 -- Record group 604, series 11, files 23, 33 -- Record group 604, series 13, file 80 -- Record group 1781, series 46, files 2-33

Re: St. Florian Church- Brzesec Poland

Elzbieta Porteneuve — Tue May 31, 2016 8:29 am

Author: Elzbieta Porteneuve

Posted: Tue May 31, 2016 8:29 am

kmille02 wrote:

My great grandparents John Jendrzejewski and Stanislawa Dolatowski were married in the church on November 11, 1902. I was hoping to see if someone could help me find the church. It is my understanding that Stanislawa was born in Brzesec, Russia Poland. Maybe you can help me find the area in which the town she was born in is located.

Karen

Karen,

The compedium of all Polish parishes in 2006, with city name, parish name, postal address, etc. (a real treasure), 894 pages,
http://www.marszal.nazwa.pl/wykaz_parafii/e-kat_parafii.pdf
does not have any single match (Brzes*, Florian).

Searching for Brześć (and any other place starting with Brzes*, diacritics included) in the old geography book 1880-1900 (that means much more than today Poland) gives 8 pages starting here:
http://dir.icm.edu.pl/Slownik_geograficzny/Tom_I/398
I did not see any Florian church (but I did not read the whole 8 pages).

Trying to get some help from distribution of names (in today Poland):
Dolatowski/Dolatowska are the correct last names (582+631 cases), with the center in Wloclawek
http://www.moikrewni.pl/mapa/kompletny/dolatowski.html
http://www.moikrewni.pl/mapa/kompletny/dolatowska.html

Going back to the compedium of all Polish parishes in 2006, and making a selection of "Św. Floriana" (mostly by looking on the map, and correlating with name's distribution, too much work for too little):
Chodzież,+Poland/
Żnin,+Poland/
Żychlin,+Bedlno,+Poland/
Radzanowo,+Poland/
Chamsk,+Poland/
Wiry,+Poland/
Poznań,+Poland

I did not see any name like Brze* (Brzesec) within the above places (have been searching for villages listed for each town).

No help, not enough information.
Do you have any copy of the original Polish record from 1902? Nothing noted about the source?

Best,
Elzbieta

St. Florian Church- Brzesec Poland

kmille02 — Mon May 30, 2016 6:27 pm

Author: kmille02

Posted: Mon May 30, 2016 6:27 pm

My great grandparents John Jendrzejewski and Stanislawa Dolatowski were married in the church on November 11, 1902. I was hoping to see if someone could help me find the church. It is my understanding that Stanislawa was born in Brzesec, Russia Poland. Maybe you can help me find the area in which the town she was born in is located.

Karen