PolishOrigins(TM) Forum

Re: What exactly is a ksiazka meldunkowa?

jozefs — Fri Jan 07, 2011 5:33 pm

Author: jozefs

Posted: Fri Jan 07, 2011 5:33 pm

Records of birth, marriages and deaths
Example:

http://baza.archiwa.gov.pl/sezam/pradziad.php?l=en&miejscowosc=Nowy+Targ&gmina=&wojewodztwo_id=0&wyznanie_id=0&rodzajaktu_id=0&search=search

http://baza.archiwa.gov.pl/sezam/pradziad.php?l=en&miejscowosc=Szaflary&gmina=&wojewodztwo_id=0&wyznanie_id=0&rodzajaktu_id=0&search=search

Re: What exactly is a ksiazka meldunkowa?

Bill Rushin — Fri Jan 07, 2011 2:24 pm

Author: Bill Rushin

Posted: Fri Jan 07, 2011 2:24 pm

I now have Lesńica, and I have a gravestone pic of a relative Maria Rusin that said Rusińow on it. So I tried it as there is a Rusinow weirch near our home. Look what came up- the oldest record so far "Rusinowo village taxpayers' 1773 list! Woo Hoo!

Re: What exactly is a ksiazka meldunkowa?

Bill Rushin — Fri Jan 07, 2011 2:06 pm

Author: Bill Rushin

Posted: Fri Jan 07, 2011 2:06 pm

I found Banska with a few older records, but I can't get anything on Białka Tatrzańska. Tried several combos, nothing?? BTW I'm translating each page and saving them as a text files.

Re: What exactly is a ksiazka meldunkowa?

Ute — Fri Jan 07, 2011 1:52 pm

Author: Ute

Posted: Fri Jan 07, 2011 1:52 pm

Bill Rushin wrote:

WOW! Dziękuę Bardzo Jozef and Ute! This is wonderful, found 53 records for Nowy Targ and I want to see all of them. And just discovered 20 from Gronków and Grón. I see all the records have been moved to Spytkowice, which is half way between Auschwitz and Kraków. Now I wonder if they have been moved to Nowy Targ Historical site. Ute-I sent them a email, still no answer after a week. I have a friend near Tarnow, maybe he can call and check if they are there. Wow, just alot of stuff I would love to see. You guys made my day!

Bill
I also found a link for Szaflary (for the villages Groń, Leśnica, Banska -- but only from 1925 on)

http://baza.archiwa.gov.pl/sezam/ela.php?l=en&s[m1]=Szaflary&s[s1]=&soperator=and&s[s2]=&s[symbol]=&search=search

Ute

Re: What exactly is a ksiazka meldunkowa?

Bill Rushin — Fri Jan 07, 2011 1:44 pm

Author: Bill Rushin

Posted: Fri Jan 07, 2011 1:44 pm

WOW! Dziękuę Bardzo Jozef and Ute! This is wonderful, found 53 records for Nowy Targ and I want to see all of them. And just discovered 20 from Gronków and Grón. I see all the records have been moved to Spytkowice, which is half way between Auschwitz and Kraków. Now I wonder if they have been moved to Nowy Targ Historical site. Ute-I sent them a email, still no answer after a week. I have a friend near Tarnow, maybe he can call and check if they are there. Wow, just alot of stuff I would love to see. You guys made my day!

Re: What exactly is a ksiazka meldunkowa?

Ute — Fri Jan 07, 2011 1:32 pm

Author: Ute

Posted: Fri Jan 07, 2011 1:32 pm

jozefs wrote:

Read and check your city...
http://www.archiwa.gov.pl/lang-en/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=389&catid=107&Itemid=184

Thanks Jozef! That's what I was looking for. (I already tried the www.archiwa.gov.pl website this morning, but got messed up too).

Bingo!

Ute — Fri Jan 07, 2011 1:08 pm

Author: Ute

Posted: Fri Jan 07, 2011 1:08 pm

Bill Rushin wrote:

Many Thanks Jozef, I tried but I get lost in all the question boxes presented. What should I use for example to search Nowy Targ + search marriages? Nowy Targ and Nowy Sacz- and what etc? Everything I tried comes up empty.

Bill,
try this link for Nowy Targ:

http://baza.archiwa.gov.pl/sezam/ela.php?l=en&search=1&s[m1]=Nowy%20Targ&soperator=and&f=0

Re: What exactly is a ksiazka meldunkowa?

Bill Rushin — Fri Jan 07, 2011 12:30 pm

Author: Bill Rushin

Posted: Fri Jan 07, 2011 12:30 pm

Many Thanks Jozef, I tried but I get lost in all the question boxes presented. What should I use for example to search Nowy Targ + search marriages? Nowy Targ and Nowy Sacz- and what etc? Everything I tried comes up empty.

Re: What exactly is a ksiazka meldunkowa?

jozefs — Fri Jan 07, 2011 12:05 pm

Author: jozefs

Posted: Fri Jan 07, 2011 12:05 pm

Read and check your city...
http://www.archiwa.gov.pl/lang-en/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=389&catid=107&Itemid=184

Re: What exactly is a ksiazka meldunkowa?

Bill Rushin — Fri Jan 07, 2011 11:37 am

Author: Bill Rushin

Posted: Fri Jan 07, 2011 11:37 am

I just love your curious mind! Yes you are right, I had no idea, I thought Bubak went to all the parishes for his info. I spent 3 hrs. looking around the Natl. Archives with double Google translation tabs open. Got sidetracked and went back to sleep...will browse again later.

Re: What exactly is a ksiazka meldunkowa?

Ute — Fri Jan 07, 2011 1:42 am

Author: Ute

Posted: Fri Jan 07, 2011 1:42 am

Bill Rushin wrote:

Ute, I'm sure that is Polish for "Registration book". Sort of a hotel register for boarders and over night guests just like they have today. They would be nice to have but I doubt anyone saved them.

Bill,
Thanks for responding to my query. My curious mind wouldn't leave me alone and I searched the internet a little more. From the little information I was able to find online in English, it seems to be a book that included all residents of a community plus non-permanent residents for population mobility control. Here is an excerpt of the posting I mentioned in my query: " that's a correct spelling as it's what I have in the 'Ksiazka Meldunkowa' (Registration Book) which each household had to have and enter all persons living in that household or visiting for more than 24hrs ".

I also found the following at http://www.rtrfoundation.org/webart/Ksiegi_Syllabus_2006_copy.pdf
"Until recently, it has been difficult to find out which Books of Residents have been preserved for particular towns and what dates are covered by them. However, the Polish State Archives now offers this information, both on a CD-Rom that can be purchased and on their website ...."
"Registration Books (Księgi Meldunkowe/Księgi Rejestru) or Books for Population Mobility Control
(Księgi Kontroli Ruchu Ludności). These books replaced the Księgi Ludności, beginning in 1932. They contain information similar to the Books of Residents, except that they are organized by surname rather than by house number or address and include all residents of a community, not just those who have their permanent legal residence there. These volumes are also housed in regional state archives".

Since Jozef Bubak used these Ksiazka Meldunkowa (books of residents) when he researched the history of family names in the Nowy Targ district in 1971, they must have been saved and he must have had access to them. It might be interesting to pursue that subject further.

Re: What exactly is a ksiazka meldunkowa?

Bill Rushin — Thu Jan 06, 2011 4:32 pm

Author: Bill Rushin

Posted: Thu Jan 06, 2011 4:32 pm

Ute, I'm sure that is Polish for "Registration book". Sort of a hotel register for boarders and over night guests just like they have today. They would be nice to have but I doubt anyone saved them.

What exactly is a ksiazka meldunkowa?

Ute — Thu Jan 06, 2011 12:17 pm

Author: Ute

Posted: Thu Jan 06, 2011 12:17 pm

I came across the word ksiazka meldunkowa several times when I was doing lookups in the books by Jozef Bubak on the history of surnames in the district of Nowy Targ. My ancestors' family name Rol/Roll, for example, was listed in the ksiazka meldunkowa' in five Podhale villages (Bor, Czarny Dunajec, Maruszyna, Miedzyczerwienne, and Zab). According to a message at Rootsweb it was a registration book that each household had to have and had to enter all persons living in that household or visiting for more than 24hrs. If this is correct, it would be an important source of information besides church records. Is it possible to obtain a copy of such a registration book?