PolishOrigins(TM) Forum

Re: Help with Lubgens

marcelproust — Wed Jan 08, 2020 5:25 am

Author: marcelproust

Posted: Wed Jan 08, 2020 5:25 am

dano wrote:

I am trying to determine my 3 rd set of grandparents. When I insert my second set of grandparents into Lubgens for their marriage record it does not come up with a scan but has an AKT.
I was wondering if there is anything more I can do to determine their parents names from the marriage record.

This is what comes up:

Pietraszek, Wawrzyneic Kolodziej, Marianna Zakrzowek AKT 19 1870 Sulow (nothing else)

Appreciate any help.

Here is this marriage act:
19
Sułów
Wawrzyniec Pietraszek

It happened in the village Zakrzówek on the 16th/28th day of February 1870, at 1 p.m.
We make it known that in the presence of the witnesses: Franciszek Lemiech, 46 years old and Michał Kowalczyk, 46 years old, peasants living in the village Zakrzówek, a religious marriage was concluded, between:

Wawrzyniec Pietraszek, 19 years old, a single man, farmer, born and living in the village Rudnik, son of Franciszek Pietraszek and his wife Agnieszka nee Paciorek, peasants living in the village Rudnik

and

Marianna Kołodziej, a miss, born in the village Sułów, daughter of late parents: Antoni Kołodziej and his wife Agnieszka nee Krawiecka, 24 years old, living in the village Sułó.

This marriage was preceded by the 2 banns of marriage announced in local parish church on: 8th/20th and 15th/27th day of February of the current year. There was dispensation from the 3rd bann given by The Consistory of the Lublin Diocese, dated 23rd day of February of the current year, number 340 and 33.

Groom's parents, present at the writing this marriage act, gave oral permission to this marriage.
Newlyweds declared they did not make prenuptial agreement.

Religious marriage ceremony celebrated by the priest Aleksander Słomczyński, Zakrzówek parish parson.
This act was read to the illiterate present and signed only by Us.

Priest Słomczyński's signature.

Help with Lubgens

dano — Tue Jan 07, 2020 7:08 pm

Author: dano

Posted: Tue Jan 07, 2020 7:08 pm

I am trying to determine my 3 rd set of grandparents. When I insert my second set of grandparents into Lubgens for their marriage record it does not come up with a scan but has an AKT.
I was wondering if there is anything more I can do to determine their parents names from the marriage record.

This is what comes up:

Pietraszek, Wawrzyneic Kolodziej, Marianna Zakrzowek AKT 19 1870 Sulow (nothing else)

Appreciate any help.

Re: Search of Grandparents Polish past

mcdonald0517 — Thu Oct 03, 2019 12:24 am

Author: mcdonald0517

Posted: Thu Oct 03, 2019 12:24 am

Hi Mike,

Frank, Leon, and Victoria were all born in New Jersey. The Family Search records prove that without a doubt. Check the links I provided.

You really don’t know the exact year of Stanislaw’s arrival in the US. Without a passenger list, you have to go by the 1910 census which says 1892 and the 1920 census which says 1900. Census information is not always accurate. If the death certificates of the two children I found are really his children, then they were in the US before 1898. I would tend to believe the 1910 census because it is the earliest record and therefore the dates would be fresher in their minds than in 1920. Also, the 1910 census has more detail regarding their marriage. If you go by the 1910 census, he arrived in US around 1892, married in 1895, and had his first child (Bronislaw or Pelagia) shortly after.

To pin down the date and place of his marriage, I would suggest getting copies of the death certificates for Bronislaw and Pelagia from both the county of Hudson, NJ and the sacramental burial record from the diocese of the Catholic Church the family attended. Both of those sources - civil and church - might have the dates and place of the children’s births in the death records. The church would almost certainly have the baptismal date noted in the burial record. This will tell you if Bronislaw and Pelagia were born in the US and more specifically, if they were born in NJ or in NY. If they were born in NY, then he was also likely married in NY. If they were born in NJ, then he was likely married in NJ. At this point, you have to follow these new clues backwards step by step to find Stanislaws marriage date and location, i.e., NJ or NY.

Good luck and happy hunting!
Cynthia

Search of Grandparents Past

dano — Wed Oct 02, 2019 10:35 pm

Author: dano

Posted: Wed Oct 02, 2019 10:35 pm

Cynthia

Thanks for your work and finding some new information for me.

Frank’s daughter (Irene Matuszewski Laffey) is still living. She thought her father was born in NYC but it could be that he just lived there as a small child before moving to NJ. We may to ask Irene to look at her own birth certificate (1932 Jersey City) to see if it lists her father’s place of birth.

You have a keen eye. I looked a closer at the records on our genealogy.com family tree and see that Frank’s siblings list their father’s place of birth as New Jersey on census records. So you may be correct.

Amazing you found the death records for the other two children (Boleslav and Pegalia)of Stanislaw and Catherine!

My thoughts on the year and place of Stanislaw’s marriage are not clear. Wouldn’t that make them married before they emigrated? The Matuszewski family were long time members of a roman catholic church in Jersey City called Our Lady of Czestochowa at 120 Sussex Street. Irene was married in this church in 1956.

Thank you for delving in to this and shading some new light on the facts as they related to Stanislaw.

Sincerely,
Mike

Re: Search of Grandparents Polish past

mcdonald0517 — Wed Oct 02, 2019 2:50 pm

Author: mcdonald0517

Posted: Wed Oct 02, 2019 2:50 pm

Hi Mike,

Question: what leads you to believe that Stanislaw Matuszewski lived in NY for a while? Is it because of the census, or do you have other corroborating clues?

The reason I ask, is that I was looking around in Family Search and found the index for the births of all three children in Jersey City, Hudson, NJ. The surname is not spelled correctly, but the rest of the information in the records match. The images of the actual records are restricted, so you have to view them from a Family Research center:

Frank 1899:
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:FCYG-MX2

Leon 1901:
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:QPSB-X889

Victoria 1903:
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:QP34-68NZ

Also, the 1910 census indicates they were married for 15 years which places the approximate date of marriage to be around 1895. The census also indicates they had 5 children total but only 3 are living as of 1910.

I may have found the death records for the 2 children who died before the census in 1910. Again, the surname is spelled incorrectly. The actual record images are not available online; you have to view the entire record at a Family Research center before we can be sure. The dates of death and/or ages at time of death line up pretty well especially for Pelagia:

Boleslav death 1898:
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:FZQK-5M6

Pegalia death 1899:
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:FZD5-M3Y

So, if you don't have other evidence that he lived in New York for a while, I am thinking that they likely married in Hudson County, New Jersey. Thoughts?

Cynthia

Search of Grandparents past

dano — Tue Oct 01, 2019 8:42 pm

Author: dano

Posted: Tue Oct 01, 2019 8:42 pm

Cynthia,

Thanks for your work. A couple of comments, we do have both census and the gravestone. As for the ship's manifest, the age doesn't match up. The manifest states Stanley is is 33 years old in 1899. According to the gravestone he was born in 1874 which is a difference of 8 years. His destination of Bayonne NJ is adjacent to Jersey City, which is good however we think he lived in NY for awhile. We do know one son was born in NY and the other two children were born in NJ.

I did try searching the few Polish search engines for all four and have come up empty handed!

thanks much,

mike

Re: Search of Grandparents Polish past

mcdonald0517 — Tue Oct 01, 2019 1:09 pm

Author: mcdonald0517

Posted: Tue Oct 01, 2019 1:09 pm

1910 census if you don’t have it

Cynthia

Re: Search of Grandparents Polish past

mcdonald0517 — Tue Oct 01, 2019 1:01 pm

Author: mcdonald0517

Posted: Tue Oct 01, 2019 1:01 pm

1920 census in case you didn’t have it. Interesting to note that their first 2 children were born in New York and the third in New Jersey.

Cynthia

Re: Search of Grandparents Polish past

mcdonald0517 — Tue Oct 01, 2019 12:58 pm

Author: mcdonald0517

Posted: Tue Oct 01, 2019 12:58 pm

Have you seen this image of gravestone?

https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/98161755

Cynthia

Re: Search of Grandparents Polish past

mcdonald0517 — Tue Oct 01, 2019 11:39 am

Author: mcdonald0517

Posted: Tue Oct 01, 2019 11:39 am

Hi Mike,

Attached is the 1899 passenger list for Stanislaw Matuszewski. His destination is to his brother in law in Bayonne NJ. I can’t quite make out his residence in Poland. It looks like Wuledroza and second page suggests Powiat Plonsk. However, I cannot find a village of that name in Plonsk. Perhaps someone else in the community can decipher it. Also, the passenger list shows his status as married although he is traveling alone.

It is a beginning. I will search more later.

Best,
Cynthia

Search of Grandparents Polish past

dano — Mon Sep 23, 2019 2:25 pm

Author: dano

Posted: Mon Sep 23, 2019 2:25 pm

Having a difficult time researching my spouses grandparents past. They all immigrated to the New Jersey area from Poland around the turn of the century. We can't find naturalization papers nor marriage records. We do have an approximate birth year for each.

thank you for your help

Stanley Matuszewski 1873
Catherine Urbanski 1868

John Szelfer 1878
Constance Olewinska 1881