PolishOrigins(TM) Forum

Re: Help Locating Dahlmann / Sawatsca / Pafska Records

mm_88 — Fri Aug 19, 2022 4:28 am

Author: mm_88

Posted: Fri Aug 19, 2022 4:28 am

Hello,
I don't know if you have already seen this, but there is Joanna'a family tree on MyHeritage https://www.myheritage.pl/research?s=159524052&formId=master&formMode=1&useTranslation=1&exactSearch=&p=1&action=query&view_mode=card&qname=Name+fn.joanna+fnmo.1+ln.pawska%2F3dahlmann+lnmsrs.false&qevents-event1=Event+et.birth+ey.1874&qevents-any/1event_1=Event+et.any+ep.bie%C5%84k%C3%B3wka+epmo.similar&qevents=List

Re: Help Locating Dahlmann / Sawatsca / Pafska Records

tubson — Wed Aug 17, 2022 3:15 pm

Author: tubson

Posted: Wed Aug 17, 2022 3:15 pm

Thank you, that's helpful. After looking at the records a bit more closely, I believe the village that Johanna was born in is actually Bienkowko which was in Berent. If you look at the map of West Prussia on the Wikipedia entry for Kreis Berent (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kreis_Berent), you'll see that Tuchel and Berent are quite close geographically. This would make more sense in explaining Jacob and Johanna's marriage from a geographic point of view.

The birth records for Jacob's siblings are indexed on FamilySearch, (but not viewable) so I've requested copies to hopefully extract more clues.

Re: Help Locating Dahlmann / Sawatsca / Pafska Records

mm_88 — Tue Aug 16, 2022 2:41 pm

Author: mm_88

Posted: Tue Aug 16, 2022 2:41 pm

tubson wrote:

Thank you again! It's very exciting to finally be chipping away at a longstanding brick wall. I had seen baptismal records for Elisabeth and Rosalia on FamilySearch but I had no previous way of establishing a likely connection between Jacob and Elisabeth / Rosalia. The geographic proximity of Jacob's birth location to Elisabeth and Rosalia certainly increases the odds they're related. A few questions, if you know the answers - given the record information, would I reach out to the parish for a copy? Is there any connection between the indexes and FamilySearch scans? Searching for marriage records on the site using Soundex, the name Dolny / Dolna pops up. Is Dolna a feminine form of Dahlmann?

I also think that Jacob, Elisabeth and Rosalia were siblings. There is also birth record for Franzisca born in 1869 in Osterwick (Ostrowite).

Here http://www.ptg.gda.pl/index.php/certificate/action/main/ and here https://parafie.genealodzy.pl/ you can check where you can find metrical books. I have never asked for a copy from the parish, so maybe somebody else could give you some advice about it. Metrical records for Jeleńcz and Ostrowite are also here https://diecezja-pelplin.pl/instytucje/archiwum-diecezjalne (archiwum@diecezja-pelplin.pl), but unfortunately for Jeleńcz they only have these birth records: 1596-1831, 1901-1920.

I can't find any marriage record for Lucas Dahlman and Anna or Jacob and Joanna. I don't think that Dolny/Dolna have something in common with Dahlman. Usually the marriage records should be in the same parish where the bride was born. So for Jacob and Joanna you should find the right parish for village Bieńkówka - not sure but I think it is Starogród https://parafie.genealodzy.pl/index.php?op=pr&pid=8079
https://www.szukajwarchiwach.gov.pl/en/zespol?p_p_id=Zespol&p_p_lifecycle=1&p_p_state=normal&p_p_mode=view&_Zespol_javax.portlet.action=zmienWidok&_Zespol_nameofjsp=serie&_Zespol_id_zespolu=103482

Re: Help Locating Dahlmann / Sawatsca / Pafska Records

Trish — Tue Aug 16, 2022 10:35 am

Author: Trish

Posted: Tue Aug 16, 2022 10:35 am

mm_88 wrote:

Hello Tubson

You should try to search Dahlman and Pawska in West Prussia / Germany On FamilySearch. There are some records for Lucas Dahlman and Anna Sawatzki/Zawadzka. There is also birth record for Johanna Pawski born 25 Nov 1874 in Bieńkówka, Chełmno county. https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:6FB3-WNHQ

If you will be able to confirm that this is Joanna you are looking for, than you should probably focus on this area.

Hi Monika, Tubson, and Sophia,

Just wanted to post the record that Monika found for Joanna from familysearch.org.

Hope this helps some.
Trish

Re: Help Locating Dahlmann / Sawatsca / Pafska Records

tubson — Mon Aug 15, 2022 5:44 pm

Author: tubson

Posted: Mon Aug 15, 2022 5:44 pm

Thank you again! It's very exciting to finally be chipping away at a longstanding brick wall. I had seen baptismal records for Elisabeth and Rosalia on FamilySearch but I had no previous way of establishing a likely connection between Jacob and Elisabeth / Rosalia. The geographic proximity of Jacob's birth location to Elisabeth and Rosalia certainly increases the odds they're related. A few questions, if you know the answers - given the record information, would I reach out to the parish for a copy? Is there any connection between the indexes and FamilySearch scans? Searching for marriage records on the site using Soundex, the name Dolny / Dolna pops up. Is Dolna a feminine form of Dahlmann?

Re: Help Locating Dahlmann / Sawatsca / Pafska Records

mm_88 — Sun Aug 14, 2022 2:05 pm

Author: mm_88

Posted: Sun Aug 14, 2022 2:05 pm

Hi,

this website can be very useful for your further research http://www.ptg.gda.pl/index.php/default/lang/en-utf-8/

When you choose "Baptisms" on PomGenBase (on the left side) you should complete names: Jacob, Lucas, Anna (without surnames) and enter a range of years and you will find the record you are looking for.

Some info about parish Jeleńcz https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jele%C5%84cz,_Kuyavian-Pomeranian_Voivodeship
In West Prussia Tuchola was called Tuchel and Kęsowo was called Kensau. That would be "Tucken" and "Kensog" from Jacob's documents.

Good luck in your research!

Re: Help Locating Dahlmann / Sawatsca / Pafska Records

tubson — Sat Aug 13, 2022 10:31 pm

Author: tubson

Posted: Sat Aug 13, 2022 10:31 pm

Wow, thank you both! That is extremely helpful.

Jacob's son, Paul Anthony Dahlman, listed his uncle (also named Paul Dahlman) as the next of kin on his WWI draft card. Based on that, it's possible that Jacob's brother in Cleveland was Paul. Unfortunately, I can't find any death certificates for a Paul Dahlman in Ohio that had the same parents listed as Jacob (Lucas and Anna)

Re: Help Locating Dahlmann / Sawatsca / Pafska Records

mm_88 — Sat Aug 13, 2022 10:45 am

Author: mm_88

Posted: Sat Aug 13, 2022 10:45 am

Hello Tubson

in this immigration record you can see that Jacob was travelling to his brother. Do you know anything about Jacob's family that was in Cleveland, Ohio before 1896?

In this record https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3QSQ-G98X-FFPY?i=3909&cc=2173933&personaUrl=%2Fark%3A%2F61903%2F1%3A1%3AQV9F-7S2K Jacob's last residence is Baranowo W/PR which could be abbreviation for West Prussia (present-day Pomeranian and Kuyavian-Pomeranian voivodship that Sophie mentioned).

You should try to search Dahlman and Pawska in West Prussia / Germany On FamilySearch. There are some records for Lucas Dahlman and Anna Sawatzki/Zawadzka. There is also birth record for Johanna Pawski born 25 Nov 1874 in Bieńkówka, Chełmno county. https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:6FB3-WNHQ

If you will be able to confirm that this is Joanna you are looking for, than you should probably focus on this area.

Re: Help Locating Dahlmann / Sawatsca / Pafska Records

Sophia — Sat Aug 13, 2022 5:17 am

Author: Sophia

Posted: Sat Aug 13, 2022 5:17 am

tubson wrote:

I'm hitting a brick wall trying to find the Polish records for Jacob Dahlmann and Johanna Pafska. I know that Jacob was born on 21 July 1872 and immigrated to the US on 3 July 1896. The ship transcript lists their last residence as Baranowo. The record for that ship transcript is here:
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:QK6L-2XWD

From there, the records I have are a bit murky. Jacob's social security application and death certificate list his parents as Lucas Dahlmann and Anna Sawatsca. The social security application lists his place of birth as "Kansog" in Germany, which does not appear to be an actual place. Jacob's naturalization record appears to list a different location as his place of birth. I can't make out the name of the town/region (Tucken?), though. That record is here:
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3QS7-L996-GGNJ?i=218&cc=1987615

While Johanna never applied for a social security number, her death certificate lists her date of birth as 25 November 1874 and her father as Ignatz Pafski. Her birthdate is confirmed on other records.

Census records indicate that Jacob and Johanna were married in 1896.

Any help identifying where I could look for their Polish records would be very appreciated!

Hi Tubson,
I have some ideas about the Polish spellings of names, to assist you in your search.
The Dahlmann spelling is fine (German rather than Polish), but I think you have "Pafska" and "Sawatsca" spelled phonetically.
I would suggest Pawska (the feminine form is Pawska, the masculine form is Pawski) and Sałacka (this surname also has a feminine form, Sałacka, and a masculine form, Sałacki).
Here is the surname distribution map for Pawski:
https://nazwiska-polskie.pl/Pawski
Here is the surname distribution map for Sałacki:
https://nazwiska-polskie.pl/Sa%C5%82acki
Figuring out the places is the next step. There are many places in Poland with the name Baranowo:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baranowo
I might focus first on the one that is in present-day Kuyavian-Pomeranian voivodship (Kujawsko Pomorskie wojewodztwo). Both of your surnames appear on an index of records there.
Here is Sałacka:
https://geneteka.genealodzy.pl/index.php?op=gt&lang=pol&bdm=B&w=02kp&rid=B&search_lastname=Sa%C5%82acka+&search_name=&search_lastname2=&search_name2=&from_date=&to_date=&exac=1
Here is Dahlmann:
https://geneteka.genealodzy.pl/index.php?op=gt&lang=pol&bdm=B&w=02kp&rid=B&search_lastname=Dahlmann&search_name=&search_lastname2=&search_name2=&from_date=&to_date=&exac=1
Keep in mind that Geneteka has by no means a complete index of records. It is a volunteer effort. I am just using this as a way to help narrow down where we can find the towns that interest you.
Best of luck in your search,
Sophia

Help Locating Dahlmann / Sawatsca / Pafska Records

tubson — Fri Aug 12, 2022 1:42 pm

Author: tubson

Posted: Fri Aug 12, 2022 1:42 pm

I'm hitting a brick wall trying to find the Polish records for Jacob Dahlmann and Johanna Pafska. I know that Jacob was born on 21 July 1872 and immigrated to the US on 3 July 1896. The ship transcript lists their last residence as Baranowo. The record for that ship transcript is here:
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:QK6L-2XWD

From there, the records I have are a bit murky. Jacob's social security application and death certificate list his parents as Lucas Dahlmann and Anna Sawatsca. The social security application lists his place of birth as "Kansog" in Germany, which does not appear to be an actual place. Jacob's naturalization record appears to list a different location as his place of birth. I can't make out the name of the town/region (Tucken?), though. That record is here:
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3QS7-L996-GGNJ?i=218&cc=1987615

While Johanna never applied for a social security number, her death certificate lists her date of birth as 25 November 1874 and her father as Ignatz Pafski. Her birthdate is confirmed on other records.

Census records indicate that Jacob and Johanna were married in 1896.

Any help identifying where I could look for their Polish records would be very appreciated!