PolishOrigins(TM) Forum

Re: Research Dead End

BarbOslo — Sat Apr 12, 2025 12:51 pm

Author: BarbOslo

Posted: Sat Apr 12, 2025 12:51 pm

It seems that Katarzyna nee Pyszczynska died in 1875. She left behind her husband Stanislaw and 2 sons: Antoni and Jozef.
Stanislaw remarried and had at least 6-7 children with his new wife. You mentioned in one of your first posts that Antoni had a sister Anna. It seems that they were half-siblings.
-Barb

Re: Research Dead End

roblewsky — Sat Apr 12, 2025 12:27 pm

Author: roblewsky

Posted: Sat Apr 12, 2025 12:27 pm

Thank you again. This research has gotten very interesting with the different name variations. A few months ago I had very little information on my family and now I have gotten so much further. It wouldn't have been possible without your help.

Re: Name Change

BarbOslo — Sat Apr 12, 2025 9:52 am

Author: BarbOslo

Posted: Sat Apr 12, 2025 9:52 am

roblewsky wrote:

I was researching the Pyszyńska line in my tree and noticed something on Geneteka that caught my attention. I noticed in the list of results that a couple names, locations, and dates matched however instead of the surname being wroblewski it was Wierebiej. I did some more looking and found a record for my 4th great grandparents Wawrzyniec and Eleonora. It showed a marriage year of 1810, Wawrzyniec was a widower and the locations matched but the surname was again Wierebiej instead of Wroblewski. My 4th great grandmothers maiden name did match though. I was just curious if anyone had run across this before.What would be a possible explanation for a surname change? Is this or was this common?

Hi,
Here is also confirmation that Wierabiej and Wroblewski are used interchangeably. In addition, the surnames Hrablewski and Grablewski appear in other documents.

-Barb

Re: Research Dead End

BarbOslo — Sat Apr 12, 2025 9:16 am

Author: BarbOslo

Posted: Sat Apr 12, 2025 9:16 am

roblewsky wrote:

It may have been wishful thinking on my part to attribute that record to my Antoni Wroblewski. The index on the record in family search shows the name as Antoni Verebeev and the father as stanislaw verebeev, and mother as Katerina Pyshinskaya. I can't remember now, what I was looking up in Family Search but it the name associated with another record was веребеев which translated to Verebey.

Hi
You're right. My mistake. I read the last name on the left. And I read the first letter as P, not W. Now I read the entire record and parents are listed as Werebiej and Pyszczynska.
He was born on June 13, 1873.
-Barb

Re: Research Dead End

roblewsky — Sat Apr 12, 2025 9:04 am

Author: roblewsky

Posted: Sat Apr 12, 2025 9:04 am

It may have been wishful thinking on my part to attribute that record to my Antoni Wroblewski. The index on the record in family search shows the name as Antoni Verebeev and the father as stanislaw verebeev, and mother as Katerina Pyshinskaya. I can't remember now, what I was looking up in Family Search but it the name associated with another record was веребеев which translated to Verebey.

Re: Research Dead End

BarbOslo — Sat Apr 12, 2025 2:00 am

Author: BarbOslo

Posted: Sat Apr 12, 2025 2:00 am

roblewsky wrote:

I believe I may have found the metric book entry for Antoni Wroblewski, the surname highlighted in yellow appears to be his mothers maiden name.

Hi,
What is highlighted in yellow is the surname of the person who was baptized. Here the child's surname is Perebiejejow.
Wroblewski in Russian is written as: Врублевский.

Regards,
-Barb

Re: Research Dead End

roblewsky — Fri Apr 11, 2025 6:23 pm

Author: roblewsky

Posted: Fri Apr 11, 2025 6:23 pm

I believe I may have found the metric book entry for Antoni Wroblewski, the surname highlighted in yellow appears to be his mothers maiden name.

Re: Research Dead End

BarbOslo — Wed Apr 09, 2025 1:14 pm

Author: BarbOslo

Posted: Wed Apr 09, 2025 1:14 pm

Sophia, you are BRILLIANT! That I, who knows Russian, did not think of this. Yes in Russian "воробей" (worobiej) means "wróbel". In Belarusian it is even closer - "верабей" (wierabiej). The surname Wróblewski absolutely come from the word "wróbel". If everything else fits, then we cannot / should not disregard that it is the correct finding.
-Barb

Re: Research Dead End

roblewsky — Tue Apr 08, 2025 8:57 am

Author: roblewsky

Posted: Tue Apr 08, 2025 8:57 am

Sophia, Thank you for your response. That is very interesting, I agree that google translate isnt always the most accurate but this seems to be the best explanation of the different names. I'll look into the different languages and meanings as well but I think this is probably the reason for the different names. Thank you again.

Re: Research Dead End

Sophia — Tue Apr 08, 2025 4:21 am

Author: Sophia

Posted: Tue Apr 08, 2025 4:21 am

Hi Roblewsky and Barb,

I would prefer to have a source other than Google translate to handle this question, but here is what I found. If I enter the word sparrow and ask for it to be translated into Polish, it says wróbel. If I ask for sparrow to be translated into Belarusian, it says верабей which it then represents in our alphabet as vierabiej. There is no letter V in the Polish language, so Wierobiej is a reasonable spelling for it, in my opinion.

If you know someone who speaks Belarusian, it would be helpful to confirm this connection to the word for sparrow.

Many thanks to Trish who asked me, off-forum, to consider the possibility that these are just two forms of the same surname. Barb, I agree with what you said, that Wierobiej is not an earlier form of Wróblewski, rather it is a translation from one language to another.

Best regards,
Sophia

Re: Research Dead End

roblewsky — Sun Apr 06, 2025 6:52 pm

Author: roblewsky

Posted: Sun Apr 06, 2025 6:52 pm

I'm not sure exactly where Jerzy fits yet. This new rabbit hole started looking at the Pyszynskas. Wawrzyniec and Eleonora had a son named Wawrzyniec and he married Krystyna Pyszynska in Wawiorka. Wawrzyniec was from Kotowicze as you know. In Geneteka it shows Wawrzyniec and Krystyna Wierebiej had a son named Jerzy born in 1847 in Kotowicze. Geneteka shows Jerzy Wroblewski from Kotowicze married in 1872 with parents Wawrzyniec and Krystyna Wroblewski, and Jerzy was from Kotowicze. I hope I explained all that ok, its becoming a challenge to keep everyones names and places straight. I believe all of these people are the same, I may be wrong, but just perplexed as to why the surname would have changed.

Re: Research Dead End

BarbOslo — Sun Apr 06, 2025 10:53 am

Author: BarbOslo

Posted: Sun Apr 06, 2025 10:53 am

One of the witnesses is named Jerzy Wierebiey. Does he match the rest?
-Barb

Re: Research Dead End

roblewsky — Sun Apr 06, 2025 10:49 am

Author: roblewsky

Posted: Sun Apr 06, 2025 10:49 am

So do you believe then that this is not the correct Wawrzyniec and Eleonora? I did find a couple children with the same surname that show up with the same birth years and locations as well. That doesn't automatically mean that it makes them the right people, could just be a coincidence. I thought maybe it was a transcription error but since the document does show the surname was entered as Wierebiej that couldnt be the case. I did do a little searching on the meaning and origin of the Wierebiej name and I agree it is not a form of Wroblewski, I just found it curious that a surname would change to a completely different name, assuming they are the same people.

Re: Research Dead End

BarbOslo — Sun Apr 06, 2025 4:27 am

Author: BarbOslo

Posted: Sun Apr 06, 2025 4:27 am

hi Christian,
Surnames often change through generations. Since I have researched your Wroblewskis previously, I do not believe that Wierebiej is an earlier form of the surname Wroblewski.

-Barb

Name Change

roblewsky — Sat Apr 05, 2025 11:23 pm

Author: roblewsky

Posted: Sat Apr 05, 2025 11:23 pm

I was researching the Pyszyńska line in my tree and noticed something on Geneteka that caught my attention. I noticed in the list of results that a couple names, locations, and dates matched however instead of the surname being wroblewski it was Wierebiej. I did some more looking and found a record for my 4th great grandparents Wawrzyniec and Eleonora. It showed a marriage year of 1810, Wawrzyniec was a widower and the locations matched but the surname was again Wierebiej instead of Wroblewski. My 4th great grandmothers maiden name did match though. I was just curious if anyone had run across this before.What would be a possible explanation for a surname change? Is this or was this common?

Keep at it

ossnhughie — Fri Feb 21, 2025 5:29 pm

Author: ossnhughie

Posted: Fri Feb 21, 2025 5:29 pm

Research dead ends can be so frustrating yet when you finally get that break.. there's nothing quite like it. One of the things I've found (and I'm sure others here have had similar circumstances) is a lot of times records that are indexed are either spelled wrong or if they're taking the name from a manifest that comes from say Germany the names will be Germanized.
Some of my relatives that departed from Hamburg like the Michalkiewicz family had the name spelled on the German departure list as Michakewitz and the indexer that looked at the arrival list at New York saw the name as Hichalkewica.

Research is very rewarding buy sometimes it drives you nuts

That's what makes this community of fellow researchers and family history gurus so priceless.

Happy hunting.

Hugh

Re: Research Dead End

roblewsky — Fri Feb 21, 2025 5:14 pm

Author: roblewsky

Posted: Fri Feb 21, 2025 5:14 pm

Barb,

This is amazing thank you so much. This will be very helpful in my research. This is great information, I can't thank you enough for doing this for me.

Thank you,

Christian

Re: Research Dead End

BarbOslo — Thu Feb 20, 2025 3:10 pm

Author: BarbOslo

Posted: Thu Feb 20, 2025 3:10 pm

roblewsky wrote:

Sophia and Barb,

It is very reassuring, Thank you both for you help. I have been able to trace back to my fourth great grandparents with your help. Interestingly the Wroblewski name shows as both Grablewski and Hrablewski, but then in a metric book going back to 1824 it goes back to Wroblewski. I'll have to look into why this happens, I guess it must be the difference between the Polish and Russian languages.

Christian

Hi Christian,
Look at this. I tried to build a small "branch". Maybe it would help you with further searches.

-Barb

Re: Research Dead End

roblewsky — Sun Feb 16, 2025 4:54 pm

Author: roblewsky

Posted: Sun Feb 16, 2025 4:54 pm

Sophia and Barb,

It is very reassuring, Thank you both for you help. I have been able to trace back to my fourth great grandparents with your help. Interestingly the Wroblewski name shows as both Grablewski and Hrablewski, but then in a metric book going back to 1824 it goes back to Wroblewski. I'll have to look into why this happens, I guess it must be the difference between the Polish and Russian languages.

Christian

Re: Research Dead End

Sophia — Fri Feb 14, 2025 8:02 am

Author: Sophia

Posted: Fri Feb 14, 2025 8:02 am

BarbOslo wrote:

Hi Sophia,
I have checked these Bocian-Pietrusewicz and Pietrusewicz-Bocian records. In all cases the names are written next to each other, as if there were two surnames.
-Barb

Hi Barb,
Nice work. That is reassuring.
It puzzles me why an indexer would not simply index them the way they are shown in the record, rather than relying on that "i" feature. I am also curious about whether the indexer is working from an original church book or a duplicate church book. That's genealogy, right, being curious about everything? But at some point you just accept what your research and your logic show you.
At least Christian now has added confidence that these people are part of the family.
Best,
Sophia