PolishOrigins(TM) Forum

Re: Surnames Franckiewicz and Harko

Skrumpie — Thu Mar 05, 2015 10:02 am

Author: Skrumpie

Posted: Thu Mar 05, 2015 10:02 am

Since the information I got from my new, young friend and possible relative indicates that two of my possible relatives are buried in the cemetery in Nielisz I tried to look up cemeteries there but got nowhere. However, I did come up with three Roman Catholic Churches in that Parish (?), and I was wondering if anyone has had any luck writing for information to churches in Poland. I know I tried to write the Church I know my relatives attended in Cleveland, Ohio, and they said they could not release any information. In any event, below are the churches, and if anyone could give me the language to write to them for information, I would appreciate the help:

Christ the King
Zlojec
Nielisz 22-413 Poland VIEW FULL LISTING >
St. John the Baptist
Staw Noakowski
Nielisz 22-413 Poland VIEW FULL LISTING >
St. Woiciech and Holy Mary of Rosary
Nielisz 196
Nielisz 22-413 Poland VIEW FULL LISTING >

http://www.thecatholicdirectory.com/directory.cfm?fuseaction=search_directory&country=PL&absolutecity=Nielisz

Re: Surnames Franckiewicz and Harko

Skrumpie — Tue Mar 03, 2015 6:45 pm

Author: Skrumpie

Posted: Tue Mar 03, 2015 6:45 pm

I did not know that, but I went to his profile and found this:

Zamość is a city in southeastern Poland with 66,633 inhabitants , situated in the south-western part of Lublin Voivodeship , about 90 km from Lublin, 247 km from Warsaw and 60 km from the border with Ukraine. About 20 kilometres from the town is the Roztocze National Park.

Re: Assistance with relationships

PolishLibrarian — Tue Mar 03, 2015 5:09 pm

Author: PolishLibrarian

Posted: Tue Mar 03, 2015 5:09 pm

Skrumpie wrote:

However, about a month ago I looked for the surname Harko on Facebook. Although Ellis Island records show the families last place of residence as Lublin, family lore says that Jozef was actually born in Zamosc. I found a young man with the surname Harko born and living in Zamosc, and wrote to him. Yesterday he answered me thus:

Which Zamosc does this young man live in? There is one 50 mi. SE of Lublin and there is one outside of Warsaw that is about 100 mi. from Lublin. Just curious if you know...maybe important. ~PL

Assistance with relationships

Skrumpie — Tue Mar 03, 2015 4:41 pm

Author: Skrumpie

Posted: Tue Mar 03, 2015 4:41 pm

Hello again everybody. Since your last assistance I have searched for family in Poland without much luck. However, about a month ago I looked for the surname Harko on Facebook. Although Ellis Island records show the families last place of residence as Lublin, family lore says that Jozef was actually born in Zamosc. I found a young man with the surname Harko born and living in Zamosc, and wrote to him. Yesterday he answered me thus:

Joseph Harko had a brother, Paul, and their father was Nicholas. Nicholas and Joseph are buried in the cemetery of Nielisz. Joseph Harko probably had a wife Sophie. They had children: Michael, Angela and third child died. Joseph's wife died and he married Marianna. they had four children: Janina, Leokadia, Leonia and Anthony. Harko Angela worked as a maid in the family Łysiów. The family lived in Siedliska. Soon after the Second World War, in which the family Łysiów served Angela went abroad, taking her with him. The family was taught because they had two sons who were teachers, and after leaving a trace of them stopped. From the second marriage alive only: Leocadia and instead Leonia, Janina and Anthony are no longer alive. Harko Anthony Felix took to wife who came from a family Koczwarów. They had seven children: Stanislaw (one son), Joseph (deceased had no wife or children), Krzysztof (a daughter and has a granddaughter), Irena (has two children and three grandchildren), Zbigniew (deceased, has four children), Adam (one son) and Anna (he has five children and lives with Felix).

I realize HIS Joseph Harko and my Joseph Harko are two different people, because my Joseph immigrated to the U.S. in 1906 with his family. However, I am wondering if the people he is talking about could possibly be cousins. I have tried searching all the names on ancestry.com with no luck, and was wondering if any of you, who have been so kind to me in the past, have any idea where I might look further. This is the first time I have had any luck whatsoever with this name outside of my immediate family, and this young man was so kind to inquire of his grandmother, and take the time (because he told me his English was not good) to formulate this response to me.

Of course there are names in common---my Joseph had a son Michael, who died in the United States, young. Baptism records for Zofia (Sophie), which Elzbieta was so kind to translate/explain to me some time ago, indicate that Joseph's parents were Timoteuz Pioti Charko and Maryanna nee Smyk), and since this young man's grandmother is probably old (not to be unkind, it happens to the best of us),I am wondering if the Marianna she is referring to was perhaps not a wife but Joseph's mother……

I hope I am not confusing anyone to the degree that I myself am currently confused…In any event, if anyone has any ideas, I would appreciate any assistance you might be able to provide. Oh, the young man I am communicating with is the great grandson of HIS Joseph Harko.

Re: Surnames Franckiewicz and Harko

Elzbieta Porteneuve — Tue May 07, 2013 9:05 am

Author: Elzbieta Porteneuve

Posted: Tue May 07, 2013 9:05 am

Skrumpie,

I would not forget Frankiewicz, there is a number of them in Poland, and very few in Lomza http://www.moikrewni.pl/mapa/kompletny/frankiewicz.html

You were lucky to receive an answer from Lomza, try the second time with Frankiewicz (writing like they request).

No more ideas.

Best,
Elzbieta

Re: Surnames Franckiewicz and Harko

Skrumpie — Mon May 06, 2013 2:12 pm

Author: Skrumpie

Posted: Mon May 06, 2013 2:12 pm

Elzbieta Porteneuve wrote:

Barbara,

First, they do not have any record related to Pan Michał Frąckiewicz.

Second, they remind that every electronic inquiry shall (must) indicate who is asking, and what is asked.

Inside your email, the text shall start like in ordinary paper correspondence:

First and Lastname
Complete postal address (i.e. postal code, city name, street, street number, country)
Subject of inquiry.

Best,
Elzbieta

Ah, I gave my name and email, but not the rest. However, since they don't have a record of him, would I send them another inquiry anyway? Where does one go from here? The only homeplace I have for him is Lomza.......I am stumped!

Re: Surnames Franckiewicz and Harko

Elzbieta Porteneuve — Mon May 06, 2013 1:34 pm

Author: Elzbieta Porteneuve

Posted: Mon May 06, 2013 1:34 pm

Barbara,

First, they do not have any record related to Pan Michał Frąckiewicz.

Second, they remind that every electronic inquiry shall (must) indicate who is asking, and what is asked.

Inside your email, the text shall start like in ordinary paper correspondence:

First and Lastname
Complete postal address (i.e. postal code, city name, street, street number, country)
Subject of inquiry.

Best,
Elzbieta

Re: Surnames Franckiewicz and Harko

Skrumpie — Mon May 06, 2013 12:21 pm

Author: Skrumpie

Posted: Mon May 06, 2013 12:21 pm

Hello again. I have received an email from Poland, and need some help in translating it. Zenon was kind enough to provide me with the original inquiry. Thanks in advance:

Archiwum Państwowe w Białymstoku Oddział w Łomży uprzejmie informuje, że w przechowywanych w naszym zasobie aktach stanu cywilnego Parafii Rzymskokatolickiej w Łomży, wśród urodzonych w roku 1892 nie odnaleziono aktu urodzenia Pana Michała Frąckiewicza.
Jednocześnie informujemy, że korespondencja otrzymywana pocztą elektroniczną, powinna spełniać wymogi określonych w art. 63 § 2 ustawy z dnia 14 czerwca 1960 r. Kodeks Postępowania Administracyjnego (Tekst jednolity: Dz. U. z 2000 r. Nr 98, poz. 1071 ze zm. ). Oznacza to, że treść kierowanej korespondencji powinna zawierać wskazanie:
- osoby (imienia i nazwiska), od której pochodzi,
- adresu (kodu pocztowego, miejscowości, ulicy i nr domu) tej osoby,
- przedmiotu sprawy, której dotyczy.
W przypadku ewentualnej dalszej korespondencji, prosimy o uzupełnienie powyższych danych.

p.o. Kierownika Oddziału
mgr Danuta Bzura

Re: Surnames Franckiewicz and Harko

Skrumpie — Tue Apr 30, 2013 2:02 pm

Author: Skrumpie

Posted: Tue Apr 30, 2013 2:02 pm

Thank you, I have just now written and will keep you informed.

Re: Surnames Franckiewicz and Harko

Zenon — Tue Apr 30, 2013 12:29 pm

Author: Zenon

Posted: Tue Apr 30, 2013 12:29 pm

Barbara,

The crucial foothold necessary for you to move forward for you is to find birth record of your grandfather where you will find names and ages of his parents.

I checked that if he indeed was born in Łomża (not in any neighboring parishes to this big town) in roman catholic or protestant or eastern orthodox church family, birth records from this town and for 1890s are to find in the State Archive branch in Łomża.

As many of our other members already tried (including myself) you can contact the Łomża Archive directly by email: lomza AT bialystok.ap.gov.pl (replace AT with @). You can shortly write in Polish:

---
Szanowni Panstwo,

Jestem zainteresowana przeprowadzeniem kwerendy genealogicznej dot. mojej rodziny Frąckiewicz, ktora pochodziła z Łomży. Oto znane mi szczegóły dot. mojego dziadka: Michal Frackiewicz, rodzony 6 grudnia 1892 prawdopodobnie w Łomży, ochrzczony w parafii rzymsko-katolickiej

Bede wdzieczna za wszelka udzielona pomoc zobowiązuję się do pokrycia wszelkich kosztów zwiazanych z przeprowadzeniem poszukiwan oraz wykonaniem skanow odnalezionych aktow.

Z powazaniem

your name and surname

---end
This should be enough for them to start reseach. I assumed and wrote that your Michal was roman catholic (please write me his religion and I will translate it for you if he wasn't roman catholic). Also, from the map of distribution of surnames in today's Poland (look at the map: http://www.moikrewni.pl/mapa/kompletny/fr%25C4%2585ckiewicz.html , there are about 144 Frąckiewiczs living in Łomża now, no Frankiewiczs)I assumed that correct spelling of your grandfather surnames was Frąckiewicz.

I don't have any experience in remote cooperation with this branch (only personal, very positive) but most of the Polish State Archive branches throughout Poland respond to such inquiries.

You can read more about experience of 'remote' research in Polish State Archives in this article: http://polishorigins.com/document/archives_practical_hints as well as in one Forum discussions: http://forum.polishorigins.com/viewtopic.php?t=23 .

Please share with us if it worked

Re: Surnames Franckiewicz and Harko

Skrumpie — Tue Apr 30, 2013 7:28 am

Author: Skrumpie

Posted: Tue Apr 30, 2013 7:28 am

Oops! Just reread this, and Michael Frankiewicz is my PATERNAL grandfather, not maternal.

Re: Surnames Franckiewicz and Harko

Skrumpie — Tue Apr 30, 2013 7:23 am

Author: Skrumpie

Posted: Tue Apr 30, 2013 7:23 am

Hello everybody. Again, thank you so very much for all the help you have given me. Since last we spoke, I have unfortunately uncovered nothing new about either the Frankiewicz or Harko surnames/families, and so I ask again for your assistance. I have recently contacted Zenon with inquiries, and he suggested I put these questions to those of you here on this board, so here goes:

I have only my maternal grandfather's name, as I knew it to be, which is Michael Frankiewicz. I don't know if the spelling of his first name was americanized from Michal, and I believe it was Gilberto that said it would also have been Nicolas, but I can't remember why. I know from his WWI Enlistment papers that he stated he came from Lomza, Russia, although in other documents he named Lomza, Poland. (I understand that Poland at some time came under Russian rule, hence the anomaly) The U.S. Census for 1930 for Bedford, Cuyahoga County, Ohio indicates that he immigrated in 1909 from Poland, (he is listed on that record with his adopted last name of Franks) but the first record I can find of him in the United States, or really anywhere, is his Army Enlistment papers for 1917, which gave his name as Mike Fronckewc, a spelling I had never before seen, and indicates his place of birth as Russia. That record is the Ohio Military Men, 1917-18, and of course these records I found on www.ancestry.com.

I have an older cousin who seems to remember that he immigrated to Canada first, and worked as a logger, but I have been unable to find anyone who I think would be a match for him on any of the manifest lists, nor have I been able to find him through Ellis Island. That same cousin believes he worked in some kind of underground project in New York or Pennsylvania, so I have checked coal mining records but come up empty handed. So this is what I know of him:

Born Poland, maybe Lomza, December 6, 1892.
Died May 17, 1966 Bedford (Cleveland), Cuyahoga County, Ohio
Married to Sophia Harko, May 17, 1920

The marriage records spell his last name as Frackiewicz. That record is Cuyahoga County, Ohio, Marriage Records and Indexes, 1810-1973, again on Ancestry.

I do not know his parents, my great grandparents, names nor where they originated from. I do not know if he had any siblings, though my older cousin told me last night she thought he had a sister, whose name may have started with a B, and who may have wound up somewhere on the east coast of the United States, maybe Rhode Island, running a beachside hotel with her husband, whose name is also unknown to me. I do know that it is believed he (Michael) sponsored a nephew, Kasey Frankiewicz, when he immigrated to the states, which I believe was in the 1920's or 30's. I think his name was probably Kazimir, and I do know that he returned to Poland about 15 years ago, but I don't know where. So this is just one person I would be greatly interested in knowing something about (Michael Frankiewicz) , and then there is his wife, my paternal grandmother, Sophia Harko, who is the one Elzbieta and Gilberto helped me discover a tiny bit about.

Zenon has indicated that he believes the actual Polish spelling of the last name I know as Frankiewicz is Frackiewicz. Again, I appreciate any assistance that anyone can provide.

Re: Surnames Franckiewicz and Harko

Anonymous — Fri Nov 23, 2012 3:42 pm

Author: Anonymous

Posted: Fri Nov 23, 2012 3:42 pm

Elzbieta Porteneuve wrote:

Skrumpie,

....His place is (something, Zavalevich???) from Tomaszowski (Ujazd? it seems like a generic name to designate a district/area; the same word is in line 18, where is a place of his wife, Lijnoweskiego ... ).

Elzbieta

Elzbieta,

Under russian rule and for a certain time: Gubernia and uyedz = wojwodztwo and powiat.

Gilberto

Re: Surnames Franckiewicz and Harko

Skrumpie — Fri Nov 23, 2012 11:57 am

Author: Skrumpie

Posted: Fri Nov 23, 2012 11:57 am

PolishLibrarian wrote:

Skrumpie~ I went looking for your grandmother’s (and family’s) arrival on Ellis Island (free to register and search). With the note posted previously about the name Charko being pronounced like Harko, I searched for last name sounds like Charko and arrival in 1906 and I found them! (I have a Hudoba relation whose name was originally spelled Chudoba)

I will list here how the family names are indexed. They arrived Oct. 21, 1906 from Hamburg on the ship Amerika. Traveling together were Josef Charko (age 40, farmer), wife Michelina (33), daughters Sofia (6), Stanislawa (4), son Michal (3) and daughter Iadeoiga (I think this looks like Jadwiga on the manifest) (7 months). All are listed as nationality - Russia, race or people - Polish, last residence - Lublin. They were going to a brother-in-law Ignacy Cicilinski in Lilly PA. This could be Josef’s sister’s husband or I suppose it could be Michelina’s sister’s husband. Seems likely it is not Michelina’s brother (not correct surname). Are these the names of Sophie's siblings?

Hope this helps. ~PolishLibrarian

Oh my goodness, how it helps! Thank you so very much. Yes, those are the names I have been seeking, and the last name is in fact Jadwiga or Jedwiga. I sincerely hope that brother-in-law's name is correct, because it may finally lead me to more family that could have some information. I am told immigrants had a tendency to lift information that wasn't really theirs so as to gain entrance when they were unsponsored.

I have also been told that someone in the family (male) worked on the Holland Tunnel, but that cannot be due to the dates of the Tunnel's construction, but it could very well be that Josef worked the coal mines of Pennsylvania (Lilly) before migrating down to the Cleveland, Ohio area.

Gosh, this is a task, isn't it? Again, thank you and thanks to all who have helped. I hope you know how much this has been appreciated!

Re: Surnames Franckiewicz and Harko

Skrumpie — Fri Nov 23, 2012 11:49 am

Author: Skrumpie

Posted: Fri Nov 23, 2012 11:49 am

Elzbieta Porteneuve wrote:

Skrumpie,

I looked up Harko name in Birth records
- chrzest, chrzty means baptismal records -
https://sites.google.com/site/wszswwawametrykalia/Home/dane-2/chrztyurodzeniagotowe

I took
1866-1900 : ods ok 1852KB - dokument Open Office
(and downloaded Open Office to my Windows PC)

It is like Excel file, but Open Office.

Your records are in line 5212, with Harko being changed to Charko (Polish spelling of both is very similar, and one shall add Cyrillic used at that time in Poland under Russian rules).

1899 2523 Charko Zofia Józef Michalina Wilmanska
She is your paternal grandmother, Sophie Harko, born 1899.

With fields:
Rok Akt Nazwisko Imię lub Imiona Imiona ojca Imiona matki Nazwisko rodowe matki

In English:
Rok=Year
Akt=Record Number
Nazwisko=Last Name
Imie=First Name
Imię lub Imiona=First Name(s)
Imiona ojca=Father First Name(s); ojciec=Father
Imiona matki=Mother First Name(s); matka=Mother
Nazwisko rodowe matki=Mother Name (name when she was born, usually her Father name)

With Gilberto's method you should be able to get original Cyrillic birth certificate from Wszystkich Swietych Church.

Elzbieta

Thank you so much for taking the time. I wonder if you have any idea----family lore says that the name Harko was adopted from the village the family was from, and was not their actual last name. Does that sound at all possible or logical to you or anyone else? Would Jozef have married and baptised his daughter, Sophie, under the name of a town?

I am having trouble opening that link, I guess because I work on a Mac computer, but I'll try to get my husband to figure it out for me sometime during the week. Do you know if there are any records earlier than 1866? I thought there might be a way to trace Timoteuz Harko and MaryAnna Smyk, the parents of Josef Harko. I'm estimating their births in 1835-50, based on Josef's date of birth of 1868 or thereabouts. I guess I'd be looking at Warsawa, as that is where I've always been told they hailed from.

Can you tell I'm lost? Thanks again!!!

Re: Surnames Franckiewicz and Harko

Skrumpie — Fri Nov 23, 2012 11:49 am

Author: Skrumpie

Posted: Fri Nov 23, 2012 11:49 am

Elzbieta Porteneuve wrote:

Re: Surnames Franckiewicz and Harko

PolishLibrarian — Thu Nov 22, 2012 1:48 pm

Author: PolishLibrarian

Posted: Thu Nov 22, 2012 1:48 pm

Skrumpie~ I went looking for your grandmother’s (and family’s) arrival on Ellis Island (free to register and search). With the note posted previously about the name Charko being pronounced like Harko, I searched for last name sounds like Charko and arrival in 1906 and I found them! (I have a Hudoba relation whose name was originally spelled Chudoba)

I will list here how the family names are indexed. They arrived Oct. 21, 1906 from Hamburg on the ship Amerika. Traveling together were Josef Charko (age 40, farmer), wife Michelina (33), daughters Sofia (6), Stanislawa (4), son Michal (3) and daughter Iadeoiga (I think this looks like Jadwiga on the manifest) (7 months). All are listed as nationality - Russia, race or people - Polish, last residence - Lublin. They were going to a brother-in-law Ignacy Cicilinski in Lilly PA. This could be Josef’s sister’s husband or I suppose it could be Michelina’s sister’s husband. Seems likely it is not Michelina’s brother (not correct surname). Are these the names of Sophie's siblings?

Hope this helps. ~PolishLibrarian

Re: Surnames Franckiewicz and Harko

Elzbieta Porteneuve — Thu Nov 22, 2012 1:02 pm

Author: Elzbieta Porteneuve

Posted: Thu Nov 22, 2012 1:02 pm

I might have decypher the place of Wilmańska Michalina in her marriage record with Jozef Harko.

Line 18, cyrillic letters are:

во Вяловиержины Липнов...

Which makes:

w Białowieżynie, (gmina) Lipno

It's here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bia%C5%82owie%C5%BCyn

Re: Surnames Franckiewicz and Harko

Elzbieta Porteneuve — Thu Nov 22, 2012 11:00 am

Author: Elzbieta Porteneuve

Posted: Thu Nov 22, 2012 11:00 am

Skrumpie,

Just asked for help a native Russian speaker from my lab, and showed him Jozef Harko marriage certificate - but for him handwritten old documents are not easy (like latin handwritten for us ...).

I do not have russian keyboard, so I will use Polish spelling to write cyrillic.

The record gives dates in two calendars: Russian and Polish. Polish is the universal one, the one we use today. The Russian has 12 days of difference - twelve days backward. First date is given in Russian calendar, then in Polish, in brackets.

Year is 1899 (not written here, but we know from archives).

The first line seems be a standart : It did happen in Warsaw in ... (I guess Church Wszystkich Swietych)

In the second line we have Russian date 17 January - w semnadcat -, then in brackets a date of January 29th - dwadcat dewiatowo - denia janwaria.

In the 5th line, we have names of witness: Anton Leszek and ? (unable to decypher, ? Krieg?).

In 9th line, we have age of Jozef - tridcati odnowo goda - 31. His place is (something, Zavalevich???) from Tomaszowski (Ujazd? it seems like a generic name to designate a district/area; the same word is in line 18, where is a place of his wife, Lijnoweskiego ... ).

The age of his wife Michalina is 27 (line 17 - dwadcat sem).

Prior to the marrage some acts were done. In 23rd line: - 3 announcements - tri oblaszczenia - published in (?), two have dates 22 January - dwadcat wtora... - and 29 January - dwadcat dewiat... janwaria sevo goda - January this year.

It ends by - niegramotnoje - which means somewhone who does not know how to write.

===

Re: village Harko or similar

I looked up villages names in Poland, and found Hurko
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hurko close to Przemysl, South-East corner of Poland.

Re: the place of Jozef half-decyphered from Russisan record of his marriage

There are at least two Tomaszow in Poland, which are called *today* more precisely Tomaszow Mazowiecki (region of Lodz) and Tomaszow Lubelski. You mention "Joseph, born February 2, 1874 in Zamosjsce, Poland" - if it is Zamosc, then maybe Tomaszow Lubelski. South-East corner of Poland.

===

I looked up for "Prośba o tłumaczenie z j.rosyjskiego" - request to translate records from Russian, by people skilled in genealogy, and found many volounteers doing it. I am quite sure you can give them the URL of Jozef Harko marriage, and someone will help you.
http://genealodzy.pl/modules.php?op=modload&name=PNphpBB2&file=viewtopic&p=146001

I also found a big gem: old maps from Central Europe, it allow to see names from 1900.
http://lazarus.elte.hu/hun/digkonyv/topo/3felmeres.htm

Elzbieta

Re: Surnames Franckiewicz and Harko

Elzbieta Porteneuve — Wed Nov 21, 2012 6:49 pm

Author: Elzbieta Porteneuve

Posted: Wed Nov 21, 2012 6:49 pm

Skrumpie,

I looked up Harko name in Birth records
- chrzest, chrzty means baptismal records -
https://sites.google.com/site/wszswwawametrykalia/Home/dane-2/chrztyurodzeniagotowe

I took
1866-1900 : ods ok 1852KB - dokument Open Office
(and downloaded Open Office to my Windows PC)

It is like Excel file, but Open Office.

Your records are in line 5212, with Harko being changed to Charko (Polish spelling of both is very similar, and one shall add Cyrillic used at that time in Poland under Russian rules).

1899 2523 Charko Zofia Józef Michalina Wilmanska
She is your paternal grandmother, Sophie Harko, born 1899.

With fields:
Rok Akt Nazwisko Imię lub Imiona Imiona ojca Imiona matki Nazwisko rodowe matki

In English:
Rok=Year
Akt=Record Number
Nazwisko=Last Name
Imie=First Name
Imię lub Imiona=First Name(s)
Imiona ojca=Father First Name(s); ojciec=Father
Imiona matki=Mother First Name(s); matka=Mother
Nazwisko rodowe matki=Mother Name (name when she was born, usually her Father name)

With Gilberto's method you should be able to get original Cyrillic birth certificate from Wszystkich Swietych Church.

Elzbieta