PolishOrigins(TM) Forum

Re: Zieliński/Fagasiński families from Ciążeń and Trąbczyn

rmcdonough — Mon Jan 26, 2026 2:37 pm

Author: rmcdonough

Posted: Mon Jan 26, 2026 2:37 pm

Thank you, thank you, thank you, Barb! I don’t recognize the godparents at this point, but will keep them for possible later reference. Ι really appreciate all your tips and outright work in this leg of my genealogy research. I am sharing it directly with family, as well as Family Search.

Re: Zieliński/Fagasiński families from Ciążeń and Trąbczyn

BarbOslo — Fri Jan 23, 2026 9:21 am

Author: BarbOslo

Posted: Fri Jan 23, 2026 9:21 am

The translation follows.

It happened in Grabienice, on October 27th/ November 8th, 1885, at 6 p.m.
Appeared Jan Zieliński, 47 years old, a peasant from Kuchary Borowe, in the presence of Andrzej Mijalski 40 years old and Majcher Czapczyk 38 years old, both peasants from Kuchary Borowe and presented Us a newborn male child, who was born in Kuchary Borowe on October 20th / 31st of the current year, at 12 p.m. to his legal wife, Julianna nee Farasińska, 42 years old.
At The Holy Baptism, held today, the child was given the name Bronisław and his godparents were Michał Rogacki and Stanisława Rabecka. This act was read to the declarant and the witnesses, who were illiterate, and it was signed by by Us only.

Regards,
-Barb

Re: Zieliński/Fagasiński families from Ciążeń and Trąbczyn

rmcdonough — Fri Jan 23, 2026 12:24 am

Author: rmcdonough

Posted: Fri Jan 23, 2026 12:24 am

Thank you Barb, Sophie, and Anna!

I did not see your replies when I posted my "progress" two days ago. And apparently, my eyesight is not so great. I should have seen his name in the 1885 births index despite his family name being partially cut off by the book fold.

Thank you for sticking with me. I am in tears right now. So, his family correctly knew his birthday was in October when he died! they were just off a few years, which is understandable for the time.

My last step will be getting the whole entry translated, in case it reveals further info about the family. I am still curious about why his birth occurred in Kuchary Borowe.

Dziękuję bardzo!

Re: Zieliński/Fagasiński families from Ciążeń and Trąbczyn

BarbOslo — Wed Jan 21, 2026 3:47 pm

Author: BarbOslo

Posted: Wed Jan 21, 2026 3:47 pm

Hi,
He has been found. See post above. Bronislaw was born on October 31, 1885 in Kuchary Borowe.
-Barb

Re: Zieliński/Fagasiński families from Ciążeń and Trąbczyn

rmcdonough — Wed Jan 21, 2026 2:56 pm

Author: rmcdonough

Posted: Wed Jan 21, 2026 2:56 pm

Just as an update: I checked with one of the Tuliszków cousins I met last year; I asked him about Tomaszów. He shared that perhaps the record should be read as Tomaszew, a village northwest of Tuliszków, midway between the Wojnarowski family farm in Kisiewy + Julianna Zieliński's place of death (Dryja) and Kuchary Koscielne, the parish where Bronisław's birth was supposedly registered.

Another member of A Polish Genealogy FB group where I asked about adoption vs church records suggested another strategy for verifying that the birth record for Bronsiław Miedzińśki is/is not that of my Bronisław is to look for that name, not just his parents' names, in other parish records.

Re: Zieliński/Fagasiński families from Ciążeń and Trąbczyn

BarbOslo — Tue Jan 20, 2026 5:46 pm

Author: BarbOslo

Posted: Tue Jan 20, 2026 5:46 pm

That's him, Anna. He was born on October 31, 1885 in Kuchary Borowe.
-Barb

Re: Zieliński/Fagasiński families from Ciążeń and Trąbczyn

anna_p — Tue Jan 20, 2026 4:47 pm

Author: anna_p

Posted: Tue Jan 20, 2026 4:47 pm

Hi everyone,
I think this is the act you're looking for - it's from Grabienice parish 1885, act number 97 (first on top). But just to be sure, you can ask in archive (where you found his marriage certificate) if they have allegats, so there also should be his birth certificate.

regards
anna

Re: Zieliński/Fagasiński families from Ciążeń and Trąbczyn

Sophia — Tue Jan 20, 2026 7:37 am

Author: Sophia

Posted: Tue Jan 20, 2026 7:37 am

Hi Rosanne and Barb,

In answer to your question, I have not used the Family Search chat function and am not aware of what restrictions there may be. Barb is probably correct, though, that the people you are trying to reach are not active, or else they do not want to chat.

Sophia

Re: Zieliński/Fagasiński families from Ciążeń and Trąbczyn

BarbOslo — Mon Jan 19, 2026 11:37 am

Author: BarbOslo

Posted: Mon Jan 19, 2026 11:37 am

1.Jozef Zieliński (husband of Katarzyna Zielińska nee Klijewska and father of Krystian Zieliński) died in Michalinów parish Trąbczyn on October 15, 1854. Act no.18.
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3Q9M-CSXJ-FS8C-D?cat=koha%3A186250&i=136&lang=no

2. Agnieszka Zielińska nee Stanisławska (widow of Krystian Zieliński) died in Holendry Łazińskie parish Trąbczyn, on November 10, 1877. She was 70 years old. Act no. 22.
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3Q9M-CSXJ-FSGK-Y?cat=koha%3A186250&i=151&lang=no

It would be interesting for us to see Bronislaw's age and the place he came from when he arrived in the US (Manifest). And the same information from other documents (e.g. naturalization).

-Barb

Re: Zieliński/Fagasiński families from Ciążeń and Trąbczyn

BarbOslo — Mon Jan 19, 2026 10:53 am

Author: BarbOslo

Posted: Mon Jan 19, 2026 10:53 am

Hi,
I have read the birth record you linked to (scan 153, record 27).
The child was a girl named Bronisława, not Bronisław. Therefore, there is no need to research her parents.

Regarding your FamilySearch account: if you created it, you can continue working on it. If someone else created it, I recommend making your own page.
It is often difficult to contact other owners, not because of restrictions, but because they may no longer be active or do not receive email notifications.

-Barb

Re: Zieliński/Fagasiński families from Ciążeń and Trąbczyn

rmcdonough — Mon Jan 19, 2026 2:04 am

Author: rmcdonough

Posted: Mon Jan 19, 2026 2:04 am

The FamilySearch user who entered the data for the Zieliński family members whose records needed editing/adding is a person I am unable to use the FS chat function with, presumably b/c that feature is not offered to members in countries w/ strict data privacy laws. Do you encounter this issue also, Barb and Sophia?

Re: Zieliński/Fagasiński families from Ciążeń and Trąbczyn

rmcdonough — Mon Jan 19, 2026 12:18 am

Author: rmcdonough

Posted: Mon Jan 19, 2026 12:18 am

Sophia - thank you for the information about the cholera study. that sounds very interesting and I have bookmarked it for later study. I also appreciate your idea of researching each Bronisław in the Kuchary and Grabienice parish books and look for potential parent deaths. So far, I have found a birth in 1886, village of Główiew, Kuchary Kosciele parish. I think the infant's name is Bronisław Miedziński. I will need to investigate potential parent deaths tomorrow.

https://www.szukajwarchiwach.gov.pl/skan/-/skan/9f0f1be689bdaf55ecdc509b890ba7476269e48581c8c85b466ca066e6859c4e scan 153 act 27

Barb - many thanks to you as well for the date and name corrections. Yes, Bronisław's death date was based on information provided by his family for his government-issued death certificate, based on best guess, I imagine. Some of the others have data entered by other folks whose work I have not checked thoroughly. Some of them are likely my errors as well. I have some homework to do!

Re: Zieliński/Fagasiński families from Ciążeń and Trąbczyn

BarbOslo — Sun Jan 18, 2026 2:49 pm

Author: BarbOslo

Posted: Sun Jan 18, 2026 2:49 pm

Attached new dates that I don't see in your family tree.

1.Widower Krystian Zieliński married Agnieszka Stanisławska, October 3, 1847 in the parish of Trąbczyn. Krystian mother's maiden name was Katarzyna Klijewska. Act no.3.
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3Q9M-CSXJ-Z9LV-X?cat=koha%3A186250&i=808&lang=no

2.You recorded Anna Łozińska as Krystian’s wife. This is incorrect. The error is due to a mistake in the indexing, where the indexer entered her surname as Łozińska instead of Sapikowska. Please see the marriage record of Krystian and Anna from 1832, which confirms her correct surname. Act no.2.
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3Q9M-CSXJ-Z9P4-V?cat=koha%3A186250&i=68&lang=no

3. Krystian and Agnieszka had two daughters. These were half-siblings of Jan:
Florentyna Zielińska was born on May 17, 1848 in Michalinów parish Trąbczyn. Act no.15.
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3Q9M-CSXJ-Z9PC-L?cat=koha%3A186250&i=841&lang=no

4. Kornelia Zielińska was born on February 23, 1850 in Michalinów parish Trąbczyn. Act no. 9.
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3Q9M-CSXJ-Z9LC-M?cat=koha%3A186250&i=933&lang=no

5. Krystian Zieliński died in Michalinów parish Trąbczyn on September 26, 1862. Act no.17.
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3Q9M-CSXJ-FSHQ-M?cat=koha%3A186250&i=549&lang=no

6. Katarzyna Zielińska nee Klijewska. She was the mother of Krystian. You have entered her death date incorrectly. She died on February 2, 1863 in Michalinów parish Trąbczyn. Act no. 3.
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3Q9M-CSXJ-FSZK-6?cat=koha%3A186250&i=598&lang=no

-Barb

Re: Zieliński/Fagasiński families from Ciążeń and Trąbczyn

BarbOslo — Sun Jan 18, 2026 12:17 pm

Author: BarbOslo

Posted: Sun Jan 18, 2026 12:17 pm

Hello,
Good to hear from you, Sophia.
Rosanne, it is true that the church books had copies, one or two. For the area we are interested in, I have no knowledge of whether these still exist in the archives. If they do exist, I do not believe they will be digitized in the first round. There are many other priorities.

I have seen that your tree on FamilySearch lists Bronislaw’s date of birth as October 1883. I assume this information was taken from some of his American documents. The Polish marriage record, however, gives an estimated year of birth around 1886 and states the place as Kuchary Borowe. None of the parishes I have searched have produced any results.
If he was born in 1883, then in my opinion he is the youngest of the siblings. If he was born closer to 1886, this suggests that there may have been a brother or sister between the last confirmed birth, which took place in the parish of Tuliszki in 1881. The same marriage record states that Kuchary Borowe belonged to the parish of Kuchary Kościelne. I investigated this and was told that it was actually the parish of Grabienice.
I went one step further and tried to find traces of Jan and Julianna in these two parishes. I wanted to see whether the two of them appeared as witnesses or godparents for family members or neighbors, which was very common at the time. It was not unusual to see the same person acting as a witness at several baptisms on the same day. To my surprise, they did not appear in either Kuchary Kościelne or Grabienice. I should emphasize that I have not read through all the records.
I did find a Jan Zielinski who was a miller in the parish of Kuchary Kościelne, but he was younger than your Jan, and eventually I discovered that his wife’s name was Marianna. This allowed us to almost rule out these two parishes as the most likely ones, but only… almost.
It takes a lot of time, but checking neighboring parishes for Jan and Julianna may have given some results. Or Sophia's suggestion to search for the first name Bronislaw. Fortunately, this is not a popular first name, which may make it easier to find.

-Barb

Re: Zieliński/Fagasiński families from Ciążeń and Trąbczyn

Sophia — Sun Jan 18, 2026 8:03 am

Author: Sophia

Posted: Sun Jan 18, 2026 8:03 am

Hi Rosanne and Barb,

Since you are immersed in records from the Tuliszkow parish, you might find it interesting that those parish records were analyzed for a study which was published in a journal of epidemiology, regarding the cholera epidemic of 1831. This link will take you to the article in both English and Polish:

https://www.przeglepidemiol.pzh.gov.pl/pdf-180928-101491?filename=Analiza%20zgonow%20w%20parafii.pdf

Aside from the statistics provided in the article, there are other interesting points such as which archives they obtained records from (see the "Materials and Methods" section) as well as an explanation of cholera including what was known then versus what is known now.

For Jan Zielinski, who was born in 1838, this epidemic must have meant that he grew up surrounded by people who had lived through it and he probably knew children who had been orphaned by it. Could that have influenced him at a later age to take in an orphan? Perhaps. Rosanne, you'd have to go back to the records and look for any child named Bronislaw who was born in the right time frame, and see if his parents subsequently died, if you wanted to explore the orphan idea. On the whole, though, I tend to agree with Barb that he was not an orphan but rather his birth was either not recorded or perhaps recorded with an error. I do see in Tuliszkow that the name Żyliński also was present. Not sure if that helps you.

I hope you are able to find your Bronislaw.
Sophia

Re: Zieliński/Fagasiński families from Ciążeń and Trąbczyn

rmcdonough — Sat Jan 17, 2026 11:11 am

Author: rmcdonough

Posted: Sat Jan 17, 2026 11:11 am

Dzień dobry, Barb!

That is incredible! I had found a few of these records and saved them for later study, but you have put them all into context. It is interesting to me that three of the Zielińskis married Kurzawiński family members and that I had not noticed the existence of a half sibling.

I too had gone looking in other parishes for Bronisław's record...in case the Tuliszków parish priest/scribe had gotten confused and written in the wrong parish name. I looked through all the extant records from parishes within the area circled by Ciązen, Zbiersk, Turek, and Konin. I have quite a stack of notes!

Do I understand correctly that parishes in this region made in late 1800s/early 1900s at least one copy of their sacramental books to be held in a diocesan archive? If so, is it possible to request access to that copy? It would be helpful to know if his birth was just missed as a copying error, or not. When I first started my genealogy research, I reached out to the archives in Rzeszów due to lack of accessible church books for a different great-grandparent's parish in that area, and received a very unfriendly response...

I really can not thank you enough for all the data you have located and suggestions you have shared.

- Rosanne

Re: Zieliński/Fagasiński families from Ciążeń and Trąbczyn

BarbOslo — Sat Jan 17, 2026 8:02 am

Author: BarbOslo

Posted: Sat Jan 17, 2026 8:02 am

Hi,
I am still searching for Bronisław’s birth record. I have checked many neighboring parishes, but so far without success. Unfortunately, it appears that the priest may have forgotten to record his birth. The annexes to the marriage records would have been very helpful, but unfortunately they either do not exist or are not available online.

However, I can contribute some dates that I do not see in your chart.

1. Jan Zieliński married Julianna Fagasińska, May 27, 1863 in the parish of Ciążeń.
scan no.28, act no.4
https://www.szukajwarchiwach.gov.pl/en/jednostka/-/jednostka/1825520?_Jednostka_delta=20&_Jednostka_resetCur=false&_Jednostka_cur=2&_Jednostka_id_jednostki=1825520

2. Barbara Zielińska (sister of Bronisław) died in Żuchała parish Tuliszków on May 4, 1879.
scan no.158, act no.109
https://www.szukajwarchiwach.gov.pl/en/jednostka/-/jednostka/1832686?_Jednostka_delta=20&_Jednostka_resetCur=false&_Jednostka_cur=8&_Jednostka_id_jednostki=1832686

3. Roman Zieliński (brother of Bronisław) married Michalina Zawal, November 25, 1895 in the parish of Królików.
scan no.108, act no.32
https://www.szukajwarchiwach.gov.pl/en/jednostka/-/jednostka/2105142?_Jednostka_delta=20&_Jednostka_resetCur=false&_Jednostka_cur=6&_Jednostka_id_jednostki=2105142

4. Jan Zieliński (brother of Bronisław) married Ludwika Kurzawińska, May 3, 1895 in the parish of Tuliszków.
scan no.80, act no.105
https://www.szukajwarchiwach.gov.pl/en/jednostka/-/jednostka/1832703?_Jednostka_delta=20&_Jednostka_resetCur=false&_Jednostka_cur=5&_Jednostka_id_jednostki=1832703

5. Julianna Zielińska nee Fagasińska died in Dryja parish Tuliszków on January 15, 1901.
scan no.70, act no.10
https://www.szukajwarchiwach.gov.pl/en/jednostka/-/jednostka/1835573?_Jednostka_delta=20&_Jednostka_resetCur=false&_Jednostka_cur=4&_Jednostka_id_jednostki=1835573

6. Widower Jan Zieliński married Leokadia Kurzawińska, October 11, 1903 in the parish of Tuliszków.
scan no.195, act no.50
https://www.szukajwarchiwach.gov.pl/en/jednostka/-/jednostka/3118485?_Jednostka_delta=20&_Jednostka_resetCur=false&_Jednostka_cur=10&_Jednostka_id_jednostki=3118485

7. Joanna Zielińska (half-sister of Bronisław) was born on July 24, 1904 in Tuliszków parish Tuliszków.
scan no.489, act no.179
https://www.szukajwarchiwach.gov.pl/en/jednostka/-/jednostka/1931816?_Jednostka_delta=20&_Jednostka_resetCur=false&_Jednostka_cur=25&_Jednostka_id_jednostki=1931816

Jan died sometime between 1906-1930 and I assume it happened in the parish of Tuliszków. I checked the death records in the parish of Tuliszków up to 1919 but couldn't find him.

Regards,
-Barb

Re: Zieliński/Fagasiński families from Ciążeń and Trąbczyn

rmcdonough — Fri Jan 16, 2026 2:55 pm

Author: rmcdonough

Posted: Fri Jan 16, 2026 2:55 pm

Yes, BarbOslo. That is the question: why was Bronisław born in a different location than the other two groups of siblings? And why is his record not found in the parish records indicated by his marriage record? A distant cousin who lives in Tuliszków but who I found through Facebook hosted me on my first visit to Poland last year. We visited the archives in Konin and found Maryanna and Bronisław's marriage record there b/c at the time, the scans were not available online for that book. We also visited the Kisiewy family farm from which all of Maryanna's family originated in the Tuliszków area. My cousin recalled a vague memory of a relative that had married long ago a hired hand who had been taken on at the farm b/c he was in some way lacking parents. That was the extant of the story.

It occurred to me yesterday that perhaps this could help explain Bronisław's odd birth/baptism record situation. If he were the orphaned niece/nephew/friend's child of Julianna and Jan Sr., or perhaps an illegitimate child of a friend or relative, could they have simply taken him into their family and given him their family name? I have seen a few other Zieliński births in one or both of the Kuchary parishes, but none with the first name Bronisław, unfortunately. If this is what had occurred, could they also have given him a new name altogether, e.g., Stanisław Kowalski >>> Bronisław Zielińśki? Were such changes formally recorded in civil records somewhere or going on informally, do you know?

You asked about Family Search. Yes, I have maintained my family tree there as best I could, but only recently, discovered that there were duplicates in the system, and merged several, including Jan and Julianna Zieliński, which led to the discovery that another person, namely Szymon Kurzawiński, had also been adding Zieliński family members. I added Władysław and Bołesław yesterday after you shared their info with me. He had not added my Bronisław. I am guessing that he is a descendant of Władysława Zielińska Kurzawiński. I am not able to establish a chat with him in FamilySearch, I am guessing b/c that function is disabled for users in Poland due to data protection laws, so I have left a few notes in FamilySearch and The Poznań Project. I was not able to find a good FB profile, so I have asked my Tuliszków cousins about him and posted general interest in the Zieliński/Fagasiński families in local announcements groups. But no hit so far. I no longer pay for access to Ancestry or MyHeritage.

I knew nothing about Jan and Julianna in Tomaszów until I ran across Wladyślawa's marriage record a few days ago that includes some strange wording about her being born in żuchala and living there with her parents, but in the next line, it mentions that her parents live in Tomaszów, which seems to be a VERY long way off from Tuliszków at a late time in their lives. Perhaps a location changed names? I will ask the Tuliszków cousins more about this.

Thanks again for all your help!!!

- R

Re: Zieliński/Fagasiński families from Ciążeń and Trąbczyn

BarbOslo — Fri Jan 16, 2026 7:28 am

Author: BarbOslo

Posted: Fri Jan 16, 2026 7:28 am

rmcdonough wrote:

Wow. Using the names and dates you provided, BarbOslo, I was able to locate Władysława's birth/baptism record (with handwriting that threw me off) and the surprise sibling records in the Tuliszków parish books. I would never have known to go looking for them otherwise.

My primary interest, Bronisław Zieliński, however, remains in hiding still. I discovered that the Kuchary Borowe records are stored as Grabienice village records; I carefully looked through those as well as the Kuchary Koscielne ones (1874-1890) at least twice, but without success. On his 1906 wedding record, he is listed as being 20 years old, but I tried to allow for error anyways.

If he was an orphan or an abandoned child that they took in, that would not be reflected in any parish books, would it?

Hi,
Sorry, I misread. Your great-grandfather was not Jan, but Bronisław.

Yes, it is correct that Kuchary Borowe at that time belonged to the parish of Grabienice. However, his marriage record states that the place belonged to the parish of Kuchary Kościelne. I have checked both parishes thoroughly, allowing a good margin for both first and last names. He was born around 1886.

It appears that the family moved from Wierzbocice in the parish of Ciążeń sometime after 1874. Already in 1877 they were living in Żuchała, parish of Tuliszków. There, Władysława, Władysław, and Bolesława were born. In Żuchała, the daughter Barbara and the mother Julianna also died. It was also there that both Władysława and Bronisław got married. Therefore, I would assume that the family lived there for a longer period of time.

The question then is: why was Bronisław born in a different place? Did the family move from Żuchała to Kuchary Borowe and then back again? I find it difficult to believe that he was an orphan or an abandoned child that they took in. If he was indeed born in 1886, we can also assume that at least one child was born between Bolesława and him.

What traces of the family do you have in Tomaszów, as you mention in your first post?

Was it you who created this family tree on FamilySearch?
https://www.familysearch.org/no/tree/pedigree/fanchart/LDHM-B7F

Regards,
-Barb

Re: Zieliński/Fagasiński families from Ciążeń and Trąbczyn

rmcdonough — Fri Jan 16, 2026 12:51 am

Author: rmcdonough

Posted: Fri Jan 16, 2026 12:51 am

Wow. Using the names and dates you provided, BarbOslo, I was able to locate Władysława's birth/baptism record (with handwriting that threw me off) and the surprise sibling records in the Tuliszków parish books. I would never have known to go looking for them otherwise.

My primary interest, Bronisław Zieliński, however, remains in hiding still. I discovered that the Kuchary Borowe records are stored as Grabienice village records; I carefully looked through those as well as the Kuchary Koscielne ones (1874-1890) at least twice, but without success. On his 1906 wedding record, he is listed as being 20 years old, but I tried to allow for error anyways.

If he was an orphan or an abandoned child that they took in, that would not be reflected in any parish books, would it?