PolishOrigins(TM) Forum

Re: This Latin has me stumped!

dnowicki — Tue Jan 29, 2013 12:06 pm

Author: dnowicki

Posted: Tue Jan 29, 2013 12:06 pm

The word in question is actually "hujus" which in Classical Latin is written "huius". It is the Genitive Singular of the demonstrative pronoun hic. haec, hoc: this. Transcribed the record reads in Latin: Franciscus Jung maritus derelicatae Julianae nata Gotzin sutor hujus. Translation: Francis (Franciszek) Jung the husband of the surviving Julianna born Gotzin a shoemaker of this (place). His age is listed as 40 and the cause of death as tuberculosis (phtysis) (phtisis).

Re: This Latin has me stumped!

Ute — Sun Apr 10, 2011 2:17 am

Author: Ute

Posted: Sun Apr 10, 2011 2:17 am

zolkie wrote:

Hmmm....now I'm wondering if I'm mistaken in my assessment of the first letter...could it be a 'Z' and some derivation of the Polish word for alive? i.e. Zujatem or Zujatis?

Zolkie,
It could also be kujatis = of what country?, kujus = whose? (the first letter should actually be a c, but I’ve also seen it it with k) -- Kolonista kujatis = Colonists of unknown origin, shoemaker of unknown origin), see links:

http://books.google.de/books?id=8VoSAAAAIAAJ&pg=PA741&lpg=PA741&dq=cujas+%2B+Latin+%2B+translation%22%22&source=bl&ots=aOgvgYLlkP&sig=W8Nq6_gOg8mio_TDluuxuXB600s&hl=de&ei=-jqhTc6wAonfsgaC7rn4AQ&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=7&ved=0CEsQ6AEwBjgK#v=onepage&q=cujas&f=false

http://books.google.de/books?id=8VoSAAAAIAAJ&pg=PA741&lpg=PA741&dq=cujas+%2B+Latin+%2B+translation%22%22&source=bl&ots=aOgvgYLlkP&sig=W8Nq6_gOg8mio_TDluuxuXB600s&hl=de&ei=-jqhTc6wAonfsgaC7rn4AQ&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=7&ved=0CEsQ6AEwBjgK#v=snippet&q=cujatis&f=false

http://books.google.de/books?id=8VoSAAAAIAAJ&pg=PA741&lpg=PA741&dq=cujas+%2B+Latin+%2B+translation%22%22&source=bl&ots=aOgvgYLlkP&sig=W8Nq6_gOg8mio_TDluuxuXB600s&hl=de&ei=-jqhTc6wAonfsgaC7rn4AQ&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=7&ved=0CEsQ6AEwBjgK#v=snippet&q=sutor&f=false

I'm not a Latin expert -- just another thought …
Ute

Re: This Latin has me stumped!

zolkie — Fri Apr 08, 2011 5:44 pm

Author: zolkie

Posted: Fri Apr 08, 2011 5:44 pm

Ute- Could the translation be "....husband of widowed Julianna born Gotz"? That would make more sense because Franz died before Julianna.

Hmmm....now I'm wondering if I'm mistaken in my assessment of the first letter...could it be a 'Z' and some derivation of the Polish word for alive? i.e. Zujatem or Zujatis?

Re: This Latin has me stumped!

zolkie — Fri Apr 08, 2011 5:42 pm

Author: zolkie

Posted: Fri Apr 08, 2011 5:42 pm

Thanks everyone for the input. I absolutely appreciate it! Unfortunately, I'm not sure that any of the current theories pan out. Below is the death record in question. You'll notice that many of the other death acts have this particular word associated with them. It seems to follow either the occupation (Sutor) or the word "Colonista".
Does this help?

Re: This Latin has me stumped!

Ute — Fri Apr 08, 2011 6:37 am

Author: Ute

Posted: Fri Apr 08, 2011 6:37 am

zolkie wrote:

Recently found Death records from a parish serving Josephsdorf, Galicia. One entry has the following notation:

'Francisus Jung maritus derelicto consortis Julianna nata Gotz, Sutor Lujas'

My translation is: "Franz Jung husband of the deceased Julianna born Gotz, shoemaker ________"

What the heck does that last word mean? I also see versions of it (Lujatis) listed in other death records... I can't find the translation anywhere! Grrrr.

I finally found a translation for the verb lujar: Lujar (article & verb transitive) = 1. To rub; To smooth the sole of a shoe; To luxate, to dislocate. (Medical).
My guess is that Franz Jung was a shoe polisher or a cobbler/shoemaker who was smoothing damaged leather shoe soles (perhaps for soldiers) or everything together. The version "Lujatis" probably refers to a person who is practicing this profession.
Ute

Re: This Latin has me stumped!

MDuplaga — Fri Apr 08, 2011 3:47 am

Author: MDuplaga

Posted: Fri Apr 08, 2011 3:47 am

zolkie,

I went to a Latin translator and put in Sutor Lujas
the reply is:
Shoemaker;
Lujas-assume this is Capitalized Proper name/abbr.
My guess is that Franz was a shoemaker possibly working for or under a Mr. Lujas.
My Ggrandfather was a shoemaker and another witness on a document also was-neither has the added term "Lujas" after Sutor.
It's the only thing I could find other than considering if the word Lujas is spelled incorrectly?
MaryAnne

Re: This Latin has me stumped!

Ute — Fri Apr 08, 2011 2:59 am

Author: Ute

Posted: Fri Apr 08, 2011 2:59 am

zolkie wrote:

Familysearch.org has a Latin Genealogical Word List at http://www.familysearch.org/eng/Search/Rg/guide/WLLatin.asp#s
I couldn't find the word "Lujas" in the list, are you sure it is "Lujas" or could it also be "locus"? In this case my translation would be: Franciscus Jung widowed husband of Julianny Gotz, local cobbler/shoemaker.
Ute

This Latin has me stumped!

zolkie — Thu Apr 07, 2011 9:14 pm

Author: zolkie

Posted: Thu Apr 07, 2011 9:14 pm

Recently found Death records from a parish serving Josephsdorf, Galicia. One entry has the following notation:

'Francisus Jung maritus derelicto consortis Julianna nata Gotz, Sutor Lujas'

My translation is: "Franz Jung husband of the deceased Julianna born Gotz, shoemaker ________"

What the heck does that last word mean? I also see versions of it (Lujatis) listed in other death records... I can't find the translation anywhere! Grrrr.