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Latin records translations
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dnowicki
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Joined: 28 Dec 2011
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Post Posted: Mon Sep 22, 2014 3:17 pm      Post subject:
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Bob,

The suffixes -owa and -owna were added the surnames of females to signify the woman's marital status. The first showed that she was married ("the wife of Krampic) and the second showed that she was not married (the daughter of Krampic). The letters "tz" are not a combination found in Polish and so you are correct that the a Pole hearing the sound of "tz" would use the letters in Polish which would most closely approximate the sound and "c" fits that bill. I think that it is important to keep in mind that farmers in Poland (both ethnic Germans and ethnic Poles) were for the most part illiterate so they couldn't tell the priest/minister/official how their name was spelled. (As a side note, my nephew asked me to research the genealogy of his daughter to complete the info I had given him on the Polish side. My late sister-in-law, his mother, was partly of German descent but while researching her ancestry I found that her German ancestors were listed as being from Russia. As it turns out, they were part of the "Volga Germans", colonists who had been invited to settle along the Volga River by Catherine the Great. I'm sure that their Germanic surnames were very different when they appeared in Cyrillic. Changes in spelling certainly was not limited to immigrants coming to America via Ellis Island.)

I'm no expert on the Polish titles for Evangelical ministers in 19th Century Poland but I very much doubt that they would have been called "priest". In the 19th Century dictionary of the Polish Language commonly called "Slownik Warszawski" ("The Warsaw Dictionary") one of the meanings listed for "ksiadz" is "pastor" and in later dictionaries the word also means "clergyman". It would be my guess that an Evangelical minister signing a record with either the abbreviation "X" or "Ks." would understand the word to mean "pastor". Polish has a number of ways to refer to a "priest". In the USA Catholic and Orthodox priests are called "father" but Polish distinguishes between secular (diocesan) priests and those who belong to a religious order (like Franciscans or Dominicans). A religious priest is addressed as "ojciec" ("father") but a secular priest is addressed as "ksiadz" ("priest"). At least that was the way things were when I was in Catholic parochial grammar school. The priests in our parish were diocesan so in Polish they were always called "ksiadz" while in English we would address them as "father". So anyway, I believe that you should understand the title "ksiadz" when applied to an Evangelical minister as meaning "pastor" or perhaps "Reverend" but probably not "priest".

Dave
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BobK
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Post Posted: Mon Sep 22, 2014 4:59 pm      Post subject:
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Thanks for the explanation Dave..
Another piece to the puzzle.

FYI - Re: Those Germans from Russia. I learned long ago that my German grandfather was born in 'Russia'. I wasted years (pre-Google) trying to find his records in the "Germans from Russia" society's books. Then I discovered Steve Morse's front end to Ellis Island, with it I found his badly mis-interpreted name in an E.I. Manifest. He'd left from "Plock, Poland". I paid a researcher for his records and learned he was born near Lipno Poland, eventually I found his wife, my grandmother, was born some 15 miles from his village. Both had came to the U.S. independently, and both gave correct Polish village names, but country - Russia.
When I'd originally learned he was from Russian, about 50 years ago, my father warned me to never bring that up around them (my Guess? - The 'Red Scare' had begun by then.) To all their grandchildren, they both claimed to be from Germany. Wanting to learn more took a lot of false trails to finding the facts.

Digging into Easter European history (that bored me in school), I learned of the partitions of Poland in the 18th century. Russia controlled most of Poland for over a century. After an uprising around 1850, Russia cracked down and informed the people they were now "Russians" and living in Russia, and they had to begin using Russian as their language.
My grandfather and his 10 siblings' birth documents, were done in an Evangelic chuch in their tiny village. Those records were sent to the central church for their area, Lipno. After the Germans were expelled from E.Europe post WWII. all the records that survived were sent to an archive in Berlin. What I received from the researcher was all in handwritten cyrillic. Had a time getting them translated.
My grandparents had given "Russia" as country of origin, not only on their immigration manifests, but also on their 1910 Fed. Census, in 1920 and thereafter - Poland.
Russian, Polish and Latin records - but I've yet to find one in German..

There were large minorities of Germans throughout all Eastern Europe: Poland, Checzechoslovakia, etc .. and was one of reasons given for Germany's invasion, starting WWII.

SGGEE.ORG covers all Germans from Eastern Europe, both Poland and Volhanyia (the Volga Germans - area in Eastern Czechoslovakia). Stevemorse.org has the front end to Ellis Island searches that allows wildcard name searchs to find mangled surnames, even all
emmigrants from a village.

This was supposed to be a short one or two lines Wink but verbosity struck!
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rsowa



Joined: 09 Nov 2013
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Location: Dundee, Michigan, USA

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Post Posted: Wed Sep 24, 2014 11:35 am      Post subject: Polek Baptism Translations
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I erroneously posted this as a separate thread, then figured out how to copy/paste here, where it belongs. Sorry for any confusion.

I broke down and ordered an LDS microfilm of the parish registers for Lipnica Murowana, Galicia and managed to get the attached images after a morning's searching. The quality of the image is poor, mostly because the microfilm reader at the library isn't very good. But at least I got what I think I needed...baptismal records for Antoni Polek, b: 15 December 1860 and Szymon Polek b: 3 December 1864. I would like the two records translated, at your convenience.

I included an image of the page header to show what all the columns refer to.

From Helen Kuc's death certificate in 1930, I knew that her parents' names were Anton Kuc and Rosalia Jaroszyriski, but that was based on her daughter as the informant. Both Andrew and Helen (Kuc) Polek immigrated to America around 1886.

Thanks in advance,
Richard



1860 Antoni Polek Baptism.jpg
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1864 Simon Polek Baptism-2.jpg
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dnowicki
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Post Posted: Thu Sep 25, 2014 9:18 am      Post subject:
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Richard,

Here are the translations of the two records you posted. For the birth and baptism of Antoni Polek I was unable to list the month of birth and baptism because that data was not found on the scan. The month should appear earlier on the page, either at the top or before the record where the month changes. Szymon was given two names at his baptism, Simon and Stephen. Stephen would be what we would call his middle name. There are two Polish versions of that name, Szczepan and Stefan. I listed both since there is no way to determine which was the favored form in his case.

Dave



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Translation Birth & Bapt. Szymon Szczepan Polek.jpg
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rsowa



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Post Posted: Thu Sep 25, 2014 9:51 am      Post subject:
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dnowicki wrote:
For the birth and baptism of Antoni Polek I was unable to list the month of birth and baptism because that data was not found on the scan.


Sorry about that...the month was December. I spent so much time trying to get a decent image, that I just ignored the rest of the page.

Thanks so much for the translations.
Richard
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rsowa



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Post Posted: Fri Sep 26, 2014 6:07 pm      Post subject:
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I have two more items that need translation.

In the first one for Victoria Polek (highlighted), the names of parents and grandparents are the same as before...Andrew's parents were Antoni Polek and Tekla Biedrowski (or Biedronski). Helen parents were Antoni Kuc and Rolalia Jarosinski. What I can't read are the names of the Godparents, and what is written in the last "Conditio" column.

In the second one for Marianna Polek, the same parents are listed, and I can read the Godparents as Vincent Jarosinski and Elizabeth Polek. But what has me baffled is the annotation on the left side... "+17/8 1927" Does that mean that she died on that date?

I will be posting a few more at a later time.

Thanks,
Richard



1866 Victoria Polek Baptism Lipnica Murowana.jpg
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1871 Marianna Polek Baptism.jpg
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dnowicki
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Post Posted: Sat Sep 27, 2014 9:40 am      Post subject:
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Richard,

The sponsors of Wiktoria were in Latin Adalbertus Medrek (first e with diacritical mark) and Catharina Paczynska or in Polish their names are Wojciech Medrek and Katarzyna Paczynska. The handwriting in the first word entered in the final column is illegible to me, but the next two words are "de Tworkowa" ("from Tworkowa). Tworkowa is a village about 13 kilometers (8 miles) to the east of Lipnica Murowana. The handwriting of the priest who entered the records in this scan is rather cramped and not consistent in the way letters are formed. The usual method to determine letters which are doubtful in a manuscript is to look for comparable letters in known words. There is no comparable for the first letter of the initial word in the last column and the remaining letters are far from clear so I can't tell what the word is.

The notation under the name Marianna is the date of her death. The word entered in the next two columns is the name of the priest who baptized her but I didn't note it in the translation because it is not legible to me. I used your interpretation of the surname of her male sponsor since you have the original image. However, his surname does not appear the same as the surname of her maternal grandmother. The priest formed the letter "s" in two distinct ways in the grandmother's maiden surname but the letter "s" appears in only one form in sponsor's surname.

Here are the translations. Sorry that I could not read the handwriting for each word in the records.

Dave



Translation birth & baptism Wiktoria Polek.jpg
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rsowa



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Post Posted: Sat Sep 27, 2014 10:30 am      Post subject:
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dnowicki wrote:
However, his surname does not appear the same as the surname of her maternal grandmother. The priest formed the letter "s" in two distinct ways in the grandmother's maiden surname but the letter "s" appears in only one form in sponsor's surname.


Interesting observation. I looked over the entire page where that record came from, and found several cases of exactly the same differences. It's almost like the priest (or the scribe) didn't try very hard for consistency. The vast majority of "s" shaped like and English cursive "f" appear in "ska" and "ski" suffixes. Just about everywhere else, he wrote them like a traditional English cursive "s".

Thanks for the translations help...I really appreciate the efforts.
Richard
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rsowa



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Post Posted: Sun Sep 28, 2014 2:40 pm      Post subject:
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I don't need the attached translated, because I know what it says....except for the last column of the highlighted record. I know it's supposed to be the cause of death, but I have no idea what it says. Curiously, it seems to be a rather common cause of death.

Thanks in advance,
Richard



1847 Marianna Kuc Death Parish Register.jpg
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dnowicki
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Post Posted: Mon Sep 29, 2014 8:48 am      Post subject:
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Richard,

Maryanna's cause of death is typhus. The most common forms of typhus are epidemic typhus, which is spread by lice, and endemic typhus, which is spread by fleas. The more deadly form is epidemic typhus with a death rate of between 10 to 60 percent (10 to 100% without treatment and depending on the health of the individual and living conditions). It is correct that typhus is the most common cause of death listed on the page. Of the 12 deaths recorded , 9 list typhus as the cause of death. The deaths recorded all took place in a period of less than 10 days so it appears that the type of typhus was epidemic typhus, which has a number of symptoms which include high fever and delirium. Death usually occurs in two weeks from heart failure. Maryanna was the youngest at 5 years of age and the oldest individual on the page was 67 years old. There are more deaths caused by typhus recorded on the page than appear at first glance because the handwriting varies and there are at least 3 distinct ways in which the word appears on the page. Another disease which at the time was common because of poor living conditions is cholera. Death records from 19th century Poland contain many examples of deaths which occurred in both cholera and typhus epidemics.

Dave
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heatherc27



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Post Posted: Thu Oct 02, 2014 7:14 pm      Post subject:
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Dave,
When you have a chance could you please translate Ignacy Szymanowicz's baptism/birth record and Michal Szymanowicz's death record. Some of the column headings were missing on the microfilm image. I saved it as it was and them cropped it and the portion of the record with Michal. I am particularly interested in the last column. I know the heading is missing but I am hoping that you know what it is. I suspect it is the names of his living mother and siblings. If so, then he is the brother of my gggg-grandfather Ignacy Szymanowicz. Your help is much appreciated!!
Heather



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dnowicki
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Post Posted: Thu Oct 02, 2014 10:02 pm      Post subject:
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Heather,

I was able to list the missing column headings for Michal's death record because they are typical of the format used in the German Partition aka The Province of Posen during that time. There were several versions used and I suspect that which was used depended on the publisher from whom the register was purchased. Since many of my ancestors and a huge number of relatives of various degrees were from that Partition, I've seen that exact version many times. The entry you are most interested in is what you suspected---the name of his mother and the names and ages of three of his siblings. The handwriting of the entry in the column which listed his occupation is hard to read, but I believe it could possibly be "villicus" which means that he was a steward---a kind of overseer---but there are no guarantees that I interpreted the handwriting correctly. He died of cholera which describes one of several intestinal diseases. The form which was usually fatal in adults and was highly infectious was Asiatic Cholera. It was caused by bacteria in the bowels and was transmitted by contaminated water and by food which was contaminated by flies. There were a number of major cholera epidemics in the 19th Century. Here is the translation.

Dave

P.S. I'll translate Ignacy's baptismal record tomorrow.



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rsowa



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Post Posted: Fri Oct 03, 2014 6:47 am      Post subject: Another baptismal record
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The attached (highlighted) is for the baptism of Apollonia Kuc (or Kuć) in Lipnica Murowana, Galicia. While the names of everyone are pretty easy to read, there are some oddities that prompts me to post it here for help.

What has me curious is the annotation "Mort" in the upper left corner. I assume that means the baby died at birth, or was dead when it was baptized?

Another item is the father's name box. I understand it is "Antonius, son of Petri and Josephae Kuć", but what is the word after that?

The same thing applies to the Godparents column. There are two annotations after the names that are confusing. The same words appear in several other records as well, but haven't figured it out.

Thanks in advance,
Richard



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heatherc27



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Post Posted: Fri Oct 03, 2014 7:27 pm      Post subject:
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Dave,
Thank you for the translation of Michal Szymanowicz's death. Your translation and added insights were, as always, very helpful. I am attaching another baptism-birth record. This time for Joannes Szymanowicz, brother of Ignacy and Michal. You translated his marriage record for me a couple of weeks ago. At your convenience would you please translate if for me?

Heather



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dnowicki
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Post Posted: Fri Oct 03, 2014 8:36 pm      Post subject:
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Heather,

Here is the translation of the baptism record of your gggg grandfather Ignacy. There is a bonus notation in the record that he went into the (Prussian/German) army on June 10, 1837 and I just looked at your post for Jan and there is a notation in that record that he also went into the army on June 10, 1837. It is interesting that although they were two years apart in age they both went into the army on the same day. The notation does not indicate whether they were conscripted or volunteered, but a good guess would be that they were conscripted. I don't recall any wars in which Prussia was involved at that time but I once read somewhere that each area was given a quota of conscripts which had to be filled. My ancestors and relatives in the German Partition were not inducted into the army but my great grandmother's first two husbands were conscripted in the Russian Partition. Both died young but after having served their time in the army. Hard to tell whether having been in the army had any bearing on their lives being short. She had better luck with my great grandfather----he was not in the army and lived to be 82.

I'm not sure of the handwriting in the maiden name of Jadwiga but it contains the old feminine suffix -anka which was used to indicate "daughter of." I was going to suggest that you ask Elzbieta about recovering her father's surname from that name but when I glanced at the record for the birth & baptism of Jan her maiden name listed there is radically different from that found in Ignacy's record. Perhaps it would be better to wait for that translation before asking Elzbieta when there is more data to examine. One thing to keep in mind is that in the late 18th Century and even into the early 19th Century surnames were still rather fluid and then, of course, the info depended on who was supplying it. The mother of the child was not usually present for the baptism since she had given birth only a short time before and had to go to the church for the "churching ceremony" before she resumed her normal life. I remember those ceremonies from the grammar school days of being an altar boy. Those ceremonies usually took place after a weekday morning Mass. The new mother would kneel at the communion rail and as an altar boy I would carry the holy water container. The priest said the prayers and then sprinkled the new mother with holy water. From what I remember my mother doing after the births of my younger siblings was that she didn't go out of the house for about a month and then went to church for that ceremony. I believe, but am not positive, that the ceremony was the Catholic version a Jewish purification rite which took place something like 40 days after the birth of a child. But the point is that the mother was not there to give information. The info was given by the father and/or the sponsors/Godparents (The father often was present for the baptism, but often was not.) and so information like the mother's maiden name was second had info at best.

Anyway, here is the translation. Jan's record will be done tomorrow.

Dave



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