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Polish records translations
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szynkiewicz



Joined: 12 Mar 2017
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Location: Chicago, USA

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Post Posted: Sun May 14, 2017 1:57 pm      Post subject: Death Record
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This record is from Rozalia Kirsztaj (Kirstein) from St Stanislaus Kostka church in Chicago, IL. 1893. I can not read the writing they have written. I am looking for someone to translate it for me or tell me what it says. The full link is: https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:S3HY-6XSQ-F6K?mode=g&i=750&cc=1452409&cat=411138

Third from the bottom.

I am looking for parents names and death date. Thanks in advance!



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Magroski49
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Joined: 10 Nov 2008
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Post Posted: Sun May 14, 2017 2:33 pm      Post subject: Re: Death Record
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szynkiewicz wrote:
This record is from Rozalia Kirsztaj (Kirstein) from St Stanislaus Kostka church in Chicago, IL. 1893. I can not read the writing they have written. I am looking for someone to translate it for me or tell me what it says. The full link is: https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:S3HY-6XSQ-F6K?mode=g&i=750&cc=1452409&cat=411138

Third from the bottom.

I am looking for parents names and death date. Thanks in advance!


Hi,it reads:
Record nr. 307
date of death: May 20, 1893
date of burial: May 23, 1893
Place of birth: Grodziundzi zach. prusy My opinion: Grudziądz (sounds Grudziondz) zach prusy = zachodnie prusy = West Prussia see map here:https://pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prusy_Zachodnie#/media/File:Prusy_Zachodnie.svg
parents: Jan Grabowski and Joanna (in polish córka Jana Grabowskieg i Joanny)
declarant: Franciszek Kirsztaj, her son.

maybe this couple is her parents because the place Kielbasin is just 10 miles south of Grudziad: http://geneteka.genealodzy.pl/index.php?op=gt&lang=pol&bdm=S&w=02kp&rid=S&search_lastname=grabowski&search_name=jan&search_lastname2=sosnowska&search_name2=joanna&from_date=1867&to_date=1867

Gilberto
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szynkiewicz



Joined: 12 Mar 2017
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Location: Chicago, USA

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Post Posted: Sun May 14, 2017 2:35 pm      Post subject:
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Thanks Magroski49!

What is that after Grabowski. It looks like Blekhak or something. Is that the maiden name of Joanna?
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szynkiewicz



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Post Posted: Sun May 14, 2017 2:40 pm      Post subject:
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Also that could be, but that couple married in 1867. Rosalie was born circa 1830.
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Magroski49
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Post Posted: Sun May 14, 2017 2:47 pm      Post subject:
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szynkiewicz wrote:
Thanks Magroski49!

What is that after Grabowski. It looks like Blekhak or something. Is that the maiden name of Joanna?


Unfortunately, the headers are crazy. For instance, under the column Disease, they have written her parents' names. And under column Priest, it seems to be the name of a street and the number of the house.

Gilberto
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Fantom



Joined: 30 Sep 2016
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Location: Polska

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Post Posted: Mon May 15, 2017 5:27 am      Post subject: Re: Pawyza Wiktoria
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crispm28 wrote:
Hello, I have found what I think is a birth record for Wiktoria Pawyza. Would greatly appreciate a translation. Please translate also. Thank you very much.
Christine


20. Before me, the Parish Priest of Dzietrzkowice, performing the duties of a Civil Registrar of Dzietrzkowice Commune in Ostrzeszow County in Kalisz Department, personally appeared Bartlomiej Paweza, a farmer, fifty years of age, residing in the Village of Lubnice belonging to Dzietrzkowice Commune, and presented to us a baby of the female sex, born on the twenty-first day of the month of December, of the current year, at the hour of ten before noon, in his house at number fifty-six, declaring that she was begotten from him and Zofia nee Chobota, his wife, thirty-two years of age, and that he wished to give her the names Wiktorya and Ewa. Both the above statement and the presentation of the baby took place in the presence of Antoni Panek, a farmer, sixty years of age, and Ignacy Boszczyk, a farmer, forty years of age, both residing in the Village of Lubnice. The father and the witnesses did not know how to write. After that, the present birth certificate was read aloud to the appearers and subsequently signed by myself.

Priest Hippolit Chrzanowski (signed), Parish Priest of Dzietrzkowice, performing the duties of a Civil Registrar

NOTES: No date was provided as to when exactly the above record was drawn up.
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Sophia



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Post Posted: Tue May 16, 2017 10:15 am      Post subject: Re: Death Record
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szynkiewicz wrote:
This record is from Rozalia Kirsztaj (Kirstein) from St Stanislaus Kostka church in Chicago, IL. 1893. I can not read the writing they have written. I am looking for someone to translate it for me or tell me what it says. The full link is: https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:S3HY-6XSQ-F6K?mode=g&i=750&cc=1452409&cat=411138

Third from the bottom.

I am looking for parents names and death date. Thanks in advance!



Szynkiewicz and Gilberto,
I want to add to your conversation. I believe that "Blekhak" is an attempt at writing a street name - - you see in that column other street addresses, such as Cleawer (should be Cleaver) and Carpenter (correct) and Blench (could be Beach). Blekhak is most likely Blackhawk, based on looking at the Chicago street map near this church. The 49 should be the family's house number.
Best of luck in your search,
Sophia
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lynwes



Joined: 17 May 2017
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Post Posted: Wed May 17, 2017 12:35 pm      Post subject:
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I believe this is the birth record for Jakob Ferszt in 1854. I would like this verified and to know any pertinent family information or locations associated with his birth.


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Lynnette Wescovich
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szynkiewicz



Joined: 12 Mar 2017
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Post Posted: Wed May 17, 2017 9:41 pm      Post subject:
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Thanks Sophia for that note! It looks like that could be, good catch!
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szynkiewicz



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Post Posted: Wed May 17, 2017 9:47 pm      Post subject: Stanislaus Pupel Death Record
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St Stanislaus Kostka church, death record for Stanislaus Pupel. I cant read the names in the column, looks like Maryana and Maryanny? Probably means father as Marian and mother as Marianna. Just wondering if someone can tell me what it says to make sure. Thanks! He is the 2nd in the row under the 70 on the far left side. Named listed as Stanislaw Pupel. Couldnt upload full photo so I uploaded a bit of it. Here is a link to the full one if needed: http://prntscr.com/f94a3l


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Magroski49
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Post Posted: Thu May 18, 2017 5:56 am      Post subject: Re: Stanislaus Pupel Death Record
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szynkiewicz wrote:
St Stanislaus Kostka church, death record for Stanislaus Pupel. I cant read the names in the column, looks like Maryana and Maryanny? Probably means father as Marian and mother as Marianna. Just wondering if someone can tell me what it says to make sure. Thanks! He is the 2nd in the row under the 70 on the far left side. Named listed as Stanislaw Pupel. Couldnt upload full photo so I uploaded a bit of it. Here is a link to the full one if needed: http://prntscr.com/f94a3l


Yes, you are right. Names are presented in a declensioned form, so Mariana is Marian, and Mariany is Mariana.

Gilberto
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Sophia



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Post Posted: Thu May 18, 2017 6:44 am      Post subject: Re: Stanislaus Pupel Death Record
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szynkiewicz wrote:
St Stanislaus Kostka church, death record for Stanislaus Pupel. I cant read the names in the column, looks like Maryana and Maryanny? Probably means father as Marian and mother as Marianna. Just wondering if someone can tell me what it says to make sure. Thanks! He is the 2nd in the row under the 70 on the far left side. Named listed as Stanislaw Pupel. Couldnt upload full photo so I uploaded a bit of it. Here is a link to the full one if needed: http://prntscr.com/f94a3l


Hi again Szynkiewicz,
I agree with Gilberto about the parents' names. I want to add some info from looking at the full record. First, the pre-printed column heading "Date of Death and Burial" is, in this case, used in the reverse, so you see the date of burial followed by the date of death, so your Stanislaw Pupel died on June 16, 1888 and was buried on June 17. Look how many people were buried each day! It would be interesting to pull up Chicago newspapers from this time and see what was happening. You also have a column, pre-printed as "Disease" which was used here to record date of birth. Many of these deceased, then, were children, and so their full date of birth was known, as well as the maiden name of their mother. Your Stanislaw, dying at age 60, has only his year of birth and his mother's maiden name was not known by the person supplying the information, Frank Kirsztajn. One more little detail - - these records you have posted here on the Russian Translation thread are actually written in Polish.
Best,
Sophia
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dnowicki
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Post Posted: Thu May 18, 2017 8:49 pm      Post subject: Re: Stanislaus Pupel Death Record
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Sophia wrote:
szynkiewicz wrote:
St Stanislaus Kostka church, death record for Stanislaus Pupel. I cant read the names in the column, looks like Maryana and Maryanny? Probably means father as Marian and mother as Marianna. Just wondering if someone can tell me what it says to make sure. Thanks! He is the 2nd in the row under the 70 on the far left side. Named listed as Stanislaw Pupel. Couldnt upload full photo so I uploaded a bit of it. Here is a link to the full one if needed: http://prntscr.com/f94a3l


Hi again Szynkiewicz,
I agree with Gilberto about the parents' names. I want to add some info from looking at the full record. First, the pre-printed column heading "Date of Death and Burial" is, in this case, used in the reverse, so you see the date of burial followed by the date of death, so your Stanislaw Pupel died on June 16, 1888 and was buried on June 17. Look how many people were buried each day! It would be interesting to pull up Chicago newspapers from this time and see what was happening. You also have a column, pre-printed as "Disease" which was used here to record date of birth. Many of these deceased, then, were children, and so their full date of birth was known, as well as the maiden name of their mother. Your Stanislaw, dying at age 60, has only his year of birth and his mother's maiden name was not known by the person supplying the information, Frank Kirsztajn. One more little detail - - these records you have posted here on the Russian Translation thread are actually written in Polish.
Best,
Sophia


Hi Gilberto, Sophia, & Szynkiewicz,

To follow up on the discussion of both Rozalia’s and Stanisław’s death records there are some things which are USA specific and Chicago specific which increase the understanding of the records.

To address Gilberto’s observation that the page headings do not always correspond to the data entered in the appropriate column…USA Cath. Church records were not kept in the same way as those in Poland. Here there was no civil mandated form since church records did not enjoy official civil status. Various for profit religious goods supply companies sold their own versions of parish registers so what the column headings called for were not the same in publications from competing companies. The C. Church instructed priests to keep records of deaths and burials but did not specify in detail what info was to be included. Parish priests were especially prone to adapting death registers to suit their own view of what should be included. The parish where I was raised on the Southeast Side of Chicago used the same register as St. Stanislaus was using. The early entries recorded the info called for in the column headings, but later entries were recorded using only either the right or the left page. Basically, one cannot depend on the headings to indicate what was entered in the various columns.

A Chi-town specific consideration revolves around maps and street addresses. When dealing with addresses prior to 1910 contemporary maps may or may not provide accurate results. In 1889 Chicago increased tremendously in size because of annexation (e.g. prior to 1889 the southern boundary of the city was 39th Street and after the annexation the southeastern city limits extended to 136th Street due to the annexation of Hyde Park Township). As a result of the annexation streets within the annexed communities sometimes had the same name as streets within pre-1889 Chicago. To bring some degree of order into the situation during the first decade of the 20th Century a large scale change of street names took place. Also, in 1909 a new street numbering system was instituted using the dividing point of the corner of State and Madison (In some places the lines from that starting were not physical but were extended lines). Thus the address of 49 Blackhawk does not correspond to any contemporary street address. An excellent resource for street name changes and street address changes which can convert old addresses to contemporary addresses can be found at http://www.alookatcook.com/

Historic maps of Chicago are more useful in identifying street names than contemporary maps. Two good online sources for historic maps are the David Rumsey Historical Map Collection and the map collection of the University of Chicago Library. A street Sophia identified which is not connected to Rozalia’s record does provide a good example of the value of old maps and the street name change resource. The street entered as “Blench” actually denotes a street named “Blanche” which is now known as LeMoyne Street.

As an aside…When the Kennedy Expressway (then known as the Northwest Expressway) was constructed in the late 1950s the original route was changed due to the activism of the Polish Community in Chicago so that St. Stan’s did not end up under the pavement of the road. The two attached pages are taken from the 1933 Poles in America: Their Contribution To a Century of Progress, a souvenir book from the 1933 Century of Progress fair in Chicago. Although the data is from a later period, the picture of the church building shows how the church appeared in the late 19th Century and how the entire parish complex appeared after 1909. The top of one tower is no longer found on the contemporary building. It was damaged in a lightning strike and was removed rather than rebuilt.

There was nothing about the number of deaths and burials recorded in St. Stanislaus Kostka parish on a given day or month or year during the late 1890s which would be worthy of note in newspapers of the time. St. Stan’s was the oldest Polish R.C. parish in Chicago and thus was a very large parish (over 2,000 families [not individuals] belonged to the parish. High mortality rates---especially high infant mortality rates---were just part of life in the big city. The Encyclopedia of Chicago states that each year during the early 1890s between 10,000 and 12,000 children under the age of 5 died on a yearly basis. Given the size of the parish along with the fact that mortality was higher in immigrant communities than in the population at large there is nothing remarkable about the yearly number of deaths in the parish.

A final note on the spelling of given names…The Polish names which are currently spelled in Polish as Marian (English: Marion) and Marianna were spelled as Maryan and Maryanna during the 19th Century (and into the 20th Century) both in Poland and in the Polish Diaspora. Perhaps Elżbieta or another forum contributor educated in Poland could nail down when exactly the spelling was changed. This is not an earthshaking point but it could influence how one chooses to enter such names of individuals living in more recent times.

Hope this info provides some food for thought.

Dave



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Sophia



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Post Posted: Fri May 19, 2017 7:48 am      Post subject:
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Hi Dave,
So that street name was Blanche! Thanks for the clarification. The Cook County resource for which you provided a link is excellent. I also appreciate your explanation of St. S. Kostka, as I had no idea what a large congregation that was. That certainly does put the number of deaths into perspective.

Szynkiewicz,
I looked at old newspapers and found two pieces relevant to Stanislaw Pupel. If he is a relative of yours, you now have an interesting avenue to continue exploring.
From the newspaper Daily Inter Ocean of Sunday, June 17, 1888: “Stanislaus Pupel, a Polish laborer, 50 years old, while employed unloading slabs from a vessel at Schoeneman’s docks, was struck on the head by a falling timber, and received injuries from which he died. The body was removed to his home at No. 65 Elston Avenue.”
From the Daily Inter Ocean of Tuesday, July 3, 1888, a notation of a suit in the Superior Court: “116,914 – Catharine Pupel, admx, vs Otto Scheonemann. Case, $5,000. Walker, Furthman & Judd, attys.”

To anyone who can answer: out of curiosity, when one's posts are moved from one thread to another as these were, are you notified of it?

Sophia
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arielvfu



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Post Posted: Fri May 19, 2017 8:27 am      Post subject:
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can you please assist translating the following certificate

thanks!



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