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Latin records translations
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Lori Love



Joined: 05 Feb 2018
Replies: 5
Location: Las Vegas, NV

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Post Posted: Fri Feb 09, 2018 5:37 pm      Post subject: Re: Family records in Latin
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Lori Love wrote:
I am overwhelmed by the depth of your answer. I have a few questions but they will have to wait until tomorrow. I just want to thank you right away for the fabulous response. Very Happy


I have a few questions, if you don’t mind. What are the 'banns'? I am not familiar with this term.
I see the church in Rogowo. It looks beautiful!
Near the Village of Czewujewo is a church, Kościół Rzymskokatolicki pw. św Wawrzyńca. I am learning how to get records from microfilms and see the film is labeling the actual church. Many of the records I have were sent to me so I don't know which church it is. Is there any reason to assume the marriage was in the church in Rogowo rather than the church closer to their home?
The Latin-English-Polish names list you sent is very helpful. Thanks very much. I have shared it with friends already.
What does, "....with judicial consent granted at Śrem on... " mean? I don't know what Śrem is.
I find the male-female name changes very confusing. The spelling changes are equally confusing. So, if I want to search for the death of the mother of the bride, is her last name Nyczanka or Nyk? Is the new last name of the bride Nysiewicz or is there a female /male variety of that name? Do you know if there is a rule of how these people are listed in official records?
Your family, being from Jarogniewice, is just a bit over 100 km from Rogowo area. Have you traced your roots back that far? Is it a fair statement to say that in days of horse and buggy that people married folks in that geographic range so the probability is high of a connection? I have so many of these records and I don't want to overload anyone with requests but I am attaching another for your magic touch! This record is marked as 'Matthew-Jozef Cielinski’. Again there is name confusion. My one great Grandmother’s maiden name was Cielinski. She arrived with 2 brothers, one had 18 children and the other had 14, with about half being boys, resulting in a small army of families named Cielinski in St. Cloud, Minnesota. I realize the female is supposed to be Cielinska, but no one uses that anymore. In the records from Poland, the name is spelled Ciełęcka. Somewhere, whole branches of distant family is spelling it Zinlinski. My great-great-great grandfather was Jozef Ciełęcka born in 1800. I am assuming this is his birth record. I hope this is readable!
Again, I am thrilled with your assistance. Thanks so very much!



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dnowicki
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Joined: 28 Dec 2011
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Location: Michigan City, Indiana

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Post Posted: Sat Feb 10, 2018 11:32 pm      Post subject: Re: Family records in Latin
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Lori Love wrote:
Lori Love wrote:
I am overwhelmed by the depth of your answer. I have a few questions but they will have to wait until tomorrow. I just want to thank you right away for the fabulous response. Very Happy


I have a few questions, if you don’t mind. What are the 'banns'? I am not familiar with this term.
I see the church in Rogowo. It looks beautiful!
Near the Village of Czewujewo is a church, Kościół Rzymskokatolicki pw. św Wawrzyńca. I am learning how to get records from microfilms and see the film is labeling the actual church. Many of the records I have were sent to me so I don't know which church it is. Is there any reason to assume the marriage was in the church in Rogowo rather than the church closer to their home?
The Latin-English-Polish names list you sent is very helpful. Thanks very much. I have shared it with friends already.
What does, "....with judicial consent granted at Śrem on... " mean? I don't know what Śrem is.
I find the male-female name changes very confusing. The spelling changes are equally confusing. So, if I want to search for the death of the mother of the bride, is her last name Nyczanka or Nyk? Is the new last name of the bride Nysiewicz or is there a female /male variety of that name? Do you know if there is a rule of how these people are listed in official records?
Your family, being from Jarogniewice, is just a bit over 100 km from Rogowo area. Have you traced your roots back that far? Is it a fair statement to say that in days of horse and buggy that people married folks in that geographic range so the probability is high of a connection? I have so many of these records and I don't want to overload anyone with requests but I am attaching another for your magic touch! This record is marked as 'Matthew-Jozef Cielinski’. Again there is name confusion. My one great Grandmother’s maiden name was Cielinski. She arrived with 2 brothers, one had 18 children and the other had 14, with about half being boys, resulting in a small army of families named Cielinski in St. Cloud, Minnesota. I realize the female is supposed to be Cielinska, but no one uses that anymore. In the records from Poland, the name is spelled Ciełęcka. Somewhere, whole branches of distant family is spelling it Zinlinski. My great-great-great grandfather was Jozef Ciełęcka born in 1800. I am assuming this is his birth record. I hope this is readable!
Again, I am thrilled with your assistance. Thanks so very much!


Hi Lori,

The record is very legible. I thought that perhaps you find it useful to see the Latin text written out in full. Thus I transcribed the handwritten Latin and then translated the record. Here is the transcription and the translation.

Latin Text: Left Margin: Jaroszewo Sub N(ume)ro 2

Body of Entry: Die 23 Martji Ego Jacobus Wesoloski V(icarius). Z(niniensis) oblatum infantem n(omi)ne Josephum die 21 hora 3 matut(ina) L(aboriosorum)* Mathaei et Mariannae Cielęckich L(egitimorum) C(onjugum) natum filium baptisavi. Patrini** fuere L(aboriosus)* Simon Żur ex Wilczkowo et Catharina Bębenkowa.***
Col. 1 Numerus: 26 (Number for the year)
Col. 2 Filii (Sons)
Col. 2a: Legitimi: Checked (Legitimate)
Col. 2b: Illegitimi: Blank (Illegitimate)

Translation: Left Margin: (Village of) Jaroszewo Under (house) Number 2

Body of Entry: On the 23rd day of March (1800) I, Jakub Wesoloski, vicar of Znin, baptized the presented child by the name of Józef, born on the 21st at the hour of 3 in the early morning of the legitimate marriage of the industrious* Mateusz and Maryanna Cielęcki. The sponsors** were the indudtrious* Szymon Żur from Wilczkowo and Katarzyna Bębenkowa.***

Notes: * laboriosus/industrious: an adjective used to designate an individual as a peasant.
**patrini/sponsors: The individuals commonly called godparents in official Catholic Church terminology are officially called “sponsors” and only one sponsor is required. The custom of having a male and a female sponsor for baptism led to the use of the unofficial term “godparents”.
***The suffix -owa on a female’s surname indicates that she was a married woman and means “wife of”. In this case she is the wife of Bębenek.

Attached are birth & baptism records of two siblings of Józef, Wojciech (born 1797---image 1328) and Katarzyna (born 1795---image 1306) as well as the image location info for three others, Paweł (born 1/16/1791---image 1207) Krystof Jan (born 10/23/1787---image 1188), and Bartolomiej (born 8/22/1784---image 1154). The last three are found on film 20582553 Item 11 and the first two on the same film, but Item 13. I thought that they might help to provide a point in time before which to search for the marriage of Mateusz & Maryanna.

To try to answer your questions…
1.) Banns are the three announcements of the intention to marry published prior to the wedding. Their purpose is to make sure that there is no impediment to the marriage (like in the flicks: “If anyone knows of any reason…speak now or forever hold your peace...”) Some non-Catholic denominations also publish banns and in colonial America some town records also contain “publications of intention to marry.” The announcements were once made orally but in these days of widespread literacy most Catholic parishes simply publish the banns in the Sunday bulletin.
2.) The parish in Czewujewo was not established until 1976. In the 19th Century it was a Lutheran church. The building was erected in 1880. Since your ancestors were Roman Catholics they married in the R.C. parish of Rogowo.
3.) Śrem is a town to the southwest of Rogowo. For whatever reason, that must have been the location of the court which had issued the judicial permission. Think of the judicial permission in terms of a marriage license.
4.) Feminine suffixes of surnames can be confusing since in the 18th and 19th Centuries there were quite a number of variations used. Once upon a time I drew up a list for one of my relatives. If I can find a copy I’ll let you know.
5.) Yes, I did trace my Nyk/Nyczak ancestors to the late 1600s in Jarogniewice. However, it is not very likely that there is a connection to your Nyk/Nyka ancestors. It is possible that one or another of my ancestors migrated to the area near Jaroszewo and indeed my great, great-grandfather did so in 1874. However, an early connection is unlikely. His name was Marcin Kajetaniak and his wife was Barbara Nyk/Nyczak. His eldest daughter, my great-grandmother, was born in Jarogniewice in 1855. The family then moved to Będlewo where Barbara died at age 31 in 1865, leaving him with four children under the age of 10. He remarried and eventually moved to Retkowo, which is in the parish of Brzyskorzystew (the neighboring parish just to the north of Żnin). You’ll not find any old records from that parish. The church burned in 1826 and the parish records burned with it so the only records extant are post 1826. Nyk direct ancestors going back from Barbara by generations are: Piotr, Wawrzyniec, Idzi, Szymon (born 1687) and his parents Grzegorz & Anna. All were born, lived, and died in Jarogniewice.
6.) I’m not clear on what you meant when you wrote: “...and see the film labeling the actual church...” All the films I’ve ever seen name the parish in terms of its location.

Attached is a picture of the parish church in the town of Żnin. There are 3 churches in the town. One dates from 1966, but the other two existed there when your ancestors were born. One of them, św. Floriana (St. Florian) was the parish church since it is the one titled “Fara”. Churches with that title were considered the local parish church where more than one church existed in a town.

Please feel free to request translation or to ask any questions you may have. It would be my pleasure to assist you in any way I can.

Dave



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Lori Love



Joined: 05 Feb 2018
Replies: 5
Location: Las Vegas, NV

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Post Posted: Tue Feb 13, 2018 10:55 pm      Post subject: Latin translations lead to more family
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Hi Dave,
Once again you have outdone yourself! I am assuming you are knowledgeable about the way the different sites work. When I was adding the new people to Family Search, I got an option of what appears to be the same family members already posted. The birth years match. The names match. I can't double check the sources as the information was imported from Legacy.
I have a number of these Latin records sent to me by a person related by marriage who lives in Columbia. It is amazing how the world starts getting more connected all the time! I need to print out all these Latin records and see if I can at least figure out who in them so the translations go in some order of sorts. Thank-you again!
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JDombrowski89



Joined: 14 Apr 2015
Replies: 40
Location: Pennsylvania

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Post Posted: 7 Days ago at 12:05 pm      Post subject:
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Dave,

Looking to see if you can translate this record.

Marriage of Mikołaj Sokołowski and Katarzyna Samborska in Płock, 1818.

Regards,

Justin



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dnowicki
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Joined: 28 Dec 2011
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Location: Michigan City, Indiana

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Post Posted: 6 Days ago at 10:29 pm      Post subject:
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JDombrowski89 wrote:
Dave,

Looking to see if you can translate this record.

Marriage of Mikołaj Sokołowski and Katarzyna Samborska in Płock, 1818.

Regards,

Justin


Hi Justin,

I don’t know what the letters naming the church (C.V.V.) stand for. Everything else is very straightforward.

Hoping this helps,

Dave


Left Margin: Płock
Main Entry: On the first day of the month of February I, Marcin Grodzicki, vicar of the church of ??, after the three banns had been announced beforehand in the presence of the people gathered together to hear the Divine Rites,* and since no canonical or civil impediment had been detected, blessed the marriage contracted between the upright**Mikołaj Sokołowski, a single young man, and Katarzyna Szamborska, a maiden, in the presence of the witnesses Antoni Przędzienski (&) Jan Adamski and others worthy of credence.***

Notes: The name of the church is simply given with letters. I can’t determine to what church they refer.
*Divine Rites = Sunday & Holy Day of Obligation Mass.
**honestos/upright: an adjective used to designate an individual as a peasant. Since the form is plural it describes both the bride and the groom.
***aliis fide dignis/others worthy of credence/belief = credible/trustworthy individuals. Since a marriage had to be contracted before a priest and two additional witnesses the two official witnesses are named and everyone else who was present gets lumped together as “aliis/others”.
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dnowicki
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Post Posted: 5 Days ago at 9:52 am      Post subject: Re: Jan Jackowski Birth Record Translation Request
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joejazz wrote:
I thought that I had posted this yesterday, but do not see it. I would very much appreciate the translation of the attached document for my great-uncle's birth. Thanking you in advance. Please excuse if this is a duplicate


Joe,

The records you posted are in Russian and were moved to Russian Records Translations. Check there and you will see them.

Wishing you success,

Dave
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