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Dugas_Chelsea



Joined: 11 Jul 2020
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Post Posted: Sat Jul 11, 2020 2:40 am      Post subject: Deciphering mother's name
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This is from an Ellis Island record of my Great-grandmother's entrance in 1909. It lists her father's name, Antoni Deśkiewicz , pretty clearly. Her mother's name.. not so much. I have stared at this for too long, need some help!

This is on line 20 for Jozefa Deśkiewicz. I have cropped the names of her parents to see it closer.



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dnowicki
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Joined: 28 Dec 2011
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Location: Michigan City, Indiana

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Post Posted: Sat Jul 11, 2020 7:22 am      Post subject: Re: Deciphering mother's name
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Dugas_Chelsea wrote:
This is from an Ellis Island record of my Great-grandmother's entrance in 1909. It lists her father's name, Antoni Deśkiewicz , pretty clearly. Her mother's name.. not so much. I have stared at this for too long, need some help!

This is on line 20 for Jozefa Deśkiewicz. I have cropped the names of her parents to see it closer.


Hi,

I believe that the person about whom you are asking is the mother of the immigrant on line 21 and not the mother of Józefa.

Dave
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Sophia



Joined: 05 Oct 2014
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Post Posted: Sat Jul 11, 2020 11:09 am      Post subject: Re: Deciphering mother's name
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Dugas_Chelsea wrote:
This is from an Ellis Island record of my Great-grandmother's entrance in 1909. It lists her father's name, Antoni Deśkiewicz , pretty clearly. Her mother's name.. not so much. I have stared at this for too long, need some help!

This is on line 20 for Jozefa Deśkiewicz. I have cropped the names of her parents to see it closer.


Hi,
I agree with Dave.
You clearly see the line where it says "Father: Antoni Deskiewicz".
Below that (indented, and not on a line) it reiterates the town she is from, Krzywa, where her father still lived.
Below that relates to the next person on the list, whose mother's name was Sore Kramer. As you can see, in the column for this passenger's "race or people" is the entry Hebrew, and the name Sore would be in keeping with that.
I'm guessing you already know that there is a second page to this manifest, which will have additional information for Jozefa (but I mention it anyway, because not everyone realizes it). It may also be interesting for you to page through the ship manifest until you reach the page for Detained Passengers. The large X next to Jozefa's name indicates that she was detained. This is not a serious thing (not as serious, for example, as the people who were held for Special Inquiry), it was practically standard practice for a woman travelling alone, such were the times! If you look at the two people listed above Jozefa, you see "SI" (Special Inquiry) by their names, and the stamp "deported." Anyway, I like to look at the detainees, because sometimes you get to see the name of yet another relative who came to get them.
Best of luck in your research,
Sophia
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Dugas_Chelsea



Joined: 11 Jul 2020
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Post Posted: Sat Jul 11, 2020 12:12 pm      Post subject: Re: Deciphering mother's name
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Sophia wrote:
Dugas_Chelsea wrote:
This is from an Ellis Island record of my Great-grandmother's entrance in 1909. It lists her father's name, Antoni Deśkiewicz , pretty clearly. Her mother's name.. not so much. I have stared at this for too long, need some help!

This is on line 20 for Jozefa Deśkiewicz. I have cropped the names of her parents to see it closer.


Hi,
I agree with Dave.
You clearly see the line where it says "Father: Antoni Deskiewicz".
Below that (indented, and not on a line) it reiterates the town she is from, Krzywa, where her father still lived.
Below that relates to the next person on the list, whose mother's name was Sore Kramer. As you can see, in the column for this passenger's "race or people" is the entry Hebrew, and the name Sore would be in keeping with that.
I'm guessing you already know that there is a second page to this manifest, which will have additional information for Jozefa (but I mention it anyway, because not everyone realizes it). It may also be interesting for you to page through the ship manifest until you reach the page for Detained Passengers. The large X next to Jozefa's name indicates that she was detained. This is not a serious thing (not as serious, for example, as the people who were held for Special Inquiry), it was practically standard practice for a woman travelling alone, such were the times! If you look at the two people listed above Jozefa, you see "SI" (Special Inquiry) by their names, and the stamp "deported." Anyway, I like to look at the detainees, because sometimes you get to see the name of yet another relative who came to get them.
Best of luck in your research,
Sophia


I thought that was maybe for the below passenger as well, but the PA, Conshohocken so I thought maybe they were related. I also did not know there was a 2nd page! I'll have to try to find it. Thank you for all the helpful information.

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Dugas_Chelsea



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Post Posted: Sat Jul 11, 2020 12:24 pm      Post subject: Re: Deciphering mother's name
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Sophia wrote:
Dugas_Chelsea wrote:
This is from an Ellis Island record of my Great-grandmother's entrance in 1909. It lists her father's name, Antoni Deśkiewicz , pretty clearly. Her mother's name.. not so much. I have stared at this for too long, need some help!

This is on line 20 for Jozefa Deśkiewicz. I have cropped the names of her parents to see it closer.


Hi,
I agree with Dave.
You clearly see the line where it says "Father: Antoni Deskiewicz".
Below that (indented, and not on a line) it reiterates the town she is from, Krzywa, where her father still lived.
Below that relates to the next person on the list, whose mother's name was Sore Kramer. As you can see, in the column for this passenger's "race or people" is the entry Hebrew, and the name Sore would be in keeping with that.
I'm guessing you already know that there is a second page to this manifest, which will have additional information for Jozefa (but I mention it anyway, because not everyone realizes it). It may also be interesting for you to page through the ship manifest until you reach the page for Detained Passengers. The large X next to Jozefa's name indicates that she was detained. This is not a serious thing (not as serious, for example, as the people who were held for Special Inquiry), it was practically standard practice for a woman travelling alone, such were the times! If you look at the two people listed above Jozefa, you see "SI" (Special Inquiry) by their names, and the stamp "deported." Anyway, I like to look at the detainees, because sometimes you get to see the name of yet another relative who came to get them.
Best of luck in your research,
Sophia


I have page 2 here. Are you able to make out the name of the cousin that paid for her? Can't make it out myself.



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Sophia



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Post Posted: Sat Jul 11, 2020 1:24 pm      Post subject:
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Hi,
I read his name as Marcin Tomczak. He is actually not her cousin, but rather her brother-in-law (abbreviated BIL if you look at the detainees page). It was a cousin who had provided her with the money to make the journey.
If you follow this link https://stevemorse.org/ellis2/mm.htm?back=https%3A%2F%2Fstevemorse.org%2Fcgi-bin%2Fboat.php%3Fseries%3D%26rollStart%3D%26rollEnd%3D%26volumeStart%3D%26volumeEnd%3D%26monthStart%3D%26dayStart%3D%26yearStart%3D1909%26monthEnd%3D%26dayEnd%3D%26yearEnd%3D1909%26boatkind%3Dstarts%26boat%3DPresident%2BGrant%26offset%3D1%26portkind%3Dstarts%26port%3D%26pageSize%3D50%26database%3Dall%26local%3Dyes%26auth%3D&series=1&roll=1370&frame=428&display=true
you then have to go to FRAME 875 (see the box for Frame? put 875 there, then click on "display" and "on separate page") it will get you to her entry on the list of detained passengers (she is number 40).
Best regards,
Sophia


Last edited by Sophia on Sat Jul 11, 2020 1:30 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Dugas_Chelsea



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Post Posted: Sat Jul 11, 2020 1:30 pm      Post subject:
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Sophia wrote:
Hi,
I read his name as Marcin Tomczak. He is actually not her cousin, but rather her brother-in-law (abbreviated BIL if you look at the detainees page). It was a cousin who had provided her with the money to make the journey.
If you follow this link https://stevemorse.org/ellis2/mm.htm?back=https%3A%2F%2Fstevemorse.org%2Fcgi-bin%2Fboat.php%3Fseries%3D%26rollStart%3D%26rollEnd%3D%26volumeStart%3D%26volumeEnd%3D%26monthStart%3D%26dayStart%3D%26yearStart%3D1909%26monthEnd%3D%26dayEnd%3D%26yearEnd%3D1909%26boatkind%3Dstarts%26boat%3DPresident%2BGrant%26offset%3D1%26portkind%3Dstarts%26port%3D%26pageSize%3D50%26database%3Dall%26local%3Dyes%26auth%3D&series=1&roll=1370&frame=428&display=true
you then have to go to FRAME 875 (see the box for Frame?) it will get you to her entry on the list of detained passengers (she is number 40).
Best regards,
Sophia


Thank you so much, Sophia! I'm pretty new to this and it's really amazing all the information you miss if you don't know what to look for. You've been super helpful.

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Sophia



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Post Posted: Sat Jul 11, 2020 4:50 pm      Post subject:
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There really is a lot of information that most people miss!
The first page of her ship manifest shows the date she set sail, and the second page shows the date of arrival, so you can calculate the number of days she was at sea. Also, you can see that the reason she is among the detained passengers was that she had to telephone her brother-in-law to wire money (most likely for her train ticket, to get from New York to whatever the closest station is for Conshohocken). It took him 2 days to accomplish that, as you can see from the fact that she consumed 2 breakfasts, 2 dinners and 2 suppers, and was finally released at 3:30 pm on November 13th (the ship having arrived on the 11th). Now, if that were me, I'd be having a bit of a discussion with my brother-in-law afterwards! Even so, if you look at the other detained passengers, many of them had to be much more patient than that. From a genealogy point of view, this is not the most important information, but if you want to imagine your great-grandmother's journey, this does add a bit of "color" to the story.
All the best,
Sophia
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