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starshadow
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Post Posted: Fri Sep 02, 2022 3:06 pm      Post subject: Finding passenger lists for the S.S. Pres. Grant, 1903
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I'm trying to find the passenger lists for the S.S. Pres. Grant, arriving in NY City on May 11 1903. It embarked from Antwerp Belgium. There seem to be no ships in active use using that name in 1903. Though there were other ships using that name before and after. One was renamed that in 1907, but wasn't in active use in 1903. I'm wondering if the one I'm looking for was renamed, or if its passenger lists are unavailable.
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dnowicki
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Post Posted: Fri Sep 02, 2022 9:08 pm      Post subject: Re: Finding passenger lists for the S.S. Pres. Grant, 1903
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starshadow wrote:
I'm trying to find the passenger lists for the S.S. Pres. Grant, arriving in NY City on May 11 1903. It embarked from Antwerp Belgium. There seem to be no ships in active use using that name in 1903. Though there were other ships using that name before and after. One was renamed that in 1907, but wasn't in active use in 1903. I'm wondering if the one I'm looking for was renamed, or if its passenger lists are unavailable.


Hi Starshadow,

Here is what https://www.theshipslist.com has to say about SS President Grant. Apparently the ship was not in service in 1903.

PRESIDENT GRANT / SERVIAN / PRESIDENT BUCHANAN / REPUBLIC 1903
The PRESIDENT GRANT had a long and varied career. She was built in 1903 by Harland & Wolff at Belfast as the SERVIAN for Wilson and Furness - Leyland Line's North Atlantic service, which failed to materialise. Her details were - 18,072 gross tons, length 599ft x beam 68.2ft, one funnel, six masts, twin screw and a speed of 14 knots. She had accommodation for 200-1st, 150-2nd, 704-3rd and 2,300-4th class passengers. Launched on 19/2/1903, she spent four years at anchor in the Musgrave Channel, Belfast until purchased by Hamburg America Line, who originally intended to name her BERLIN, but instead named her PRESIDENT GRANT. On 14/9/1907 she finally started her maiden voyage from Hamburg to Boulogne, Southampton and New York. In 1914, she took refuge in New York and on August 4th, was interned at Hoboken. Seized by the US authorities in 1917, when America entered the Great War, she operated as a US Navy transport. In October she transferred to the US Army, and made 20 voyages, and in 1920 was used to repatriate Czech troops from Vladivostok [where they had been fighting the Bolsheviks] via Suez to Trieste. In March 1921, she was handed over to the US Shipping Board, renamed PRESIDENT BUCHANAN and laid up until 1923, when she was refurbished and rebuilt with four masts by the Newport News Shipbuilding Co. Her tonnage was reduced to 17,910 and her accommodation altered to 600-cabin class and 600-3rd class passengers. In 1924 she went to the United States Line, who named her REPUBLIC, and on 29/4/1924 she commenced sailing between New York, Plymouth, Cherbourg and Bremen. In 1926, she was converted to carry cabin, tourist and 3rd class passengers and on 17/7/1931 she commenced her last voyage from Hamburg to Southampton, Cherbourg and New York. She then became a US Troopship and ran between San Francisco, Hawaii and Manila and from 1932-1941 was used between New York, Panama, San Francisco and Honolulu. In 1941 she was assigned to the US Navy as AP33 REPUBLIC and was used for Pacific trooping as far afield as Sydney, Australia. Returned to the army in 1945, she was converted at Mobile, Alabama to a Hague Convention Hospital ship and in February 1946, reverted to a troopship and was engaged on repatriation work. She was laid up later the same year, until 1951, when she was scrapped at Baltimore. [North Atlantic Seaway by N.R.P.Bonsor vol.1., p.413] [Merchant Fleets in Profile by Duncan Haws vol.4, p.98
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Sophia
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Post Posted: Sat Sep 03, 2022 9:27 am      Post subject: Re: Finding passenger lists for the S.S. Pres. Grant, 1903
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starshadow wrote:
I'm trying to find the passenger lists for the S.S. Pres. Grant, arriving in NY City on May 11 1903. It embarked from Antwerp Belgium. There seem to be no ships in active use using that name in 1903. Though there were other ships using that name before and after. One was renamed that in 1907, but wasn't in active use in 1903. I'm wondering if the one I'm looking for was renamed, or if its passenger lists are unavailable.


Hi Starshadow,
Do you need help searching for a particular passenger? I assume you have some type of document (perhaps a naturalization petition) which states they arrived at the Port of New York on the steamship President Grant on May 11, 1903.
I will try to look for them, if you'd like.
Sophia
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starshadow
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Post Posted: Sun Sep 04, 2022 2:59 pm      Post subject:
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Thanks Dave and Sophia. Long story short. I'm helping a cousin help another cousin research her great-grandfather John Modzelewski. Here's John's 1935 Declaration. He names his vessel as the S.S. Pres. Grant.

But according to Ancestry, 12 ships arrived in NY on May 11th 1903. The SS Anchoria, Beatrice, Calabria, Indradeo, Ivernia, La Bretagne, Minehaha, Philadelphia, Pretoria, Regina Elena, Umbria, and Vincenzo Bonnano.

I also checked all other dates in May (before and after the 11th), and no S.S. Pres. Grant docked in NY that entire month.

I even checked the history of each of those 12 ships, to see if any ever went by the name Pres. Grant. And as far as I could tell, none ever did.

There were several other ships named a variety of "Pres. Grant", "Ulysses Grant", etc. Some of them "S.S.", and some "U.S.S." But none in use in 1903, at least not as passenger vessels.

I noticed the Wikipedia article for the S.S. Servian (Serbian) said it was built in 1903, but kept anchored for its first 4 years in Belfast. Then renamed in 1907, the 3rd ship named after Ulysses Grant. Maybe we need one of the previous 2 ships by that name?

(By the way I also checked for the Servian arriving in NY in May 1903.)

Or maybe there was another S.S. Pres. Grant, whose passenger lists haven't been copied yet, or were lost? Or maybe John just got the name of his ship wrong?



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Trish



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Post Posted: Sun Sep 04, 2022 4:41 pm      Post subject: Re: Finding passenger lists for the S.S. Pres. Grant, 1903
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starshadow wrote:
I'm trying to find the passenger lists for the S.S. Pres. Grant, arriving in NY City on May 11 1903. It embarked from Antwerp Belgium. There seem to be no ships in active use using that name in 1903. Though there were other ships using that name before and after. One was renamed that in 1907, but wasn't in active use in 1903. I'm wondering if the one I'm looking for was renamed, or if its passenger lists are unavailable.


Hi Everyone,

This could be Jan Modzelewski coming on a different ship. I need another set of eyes to look at this record. Jan is on line 18 coming from Zembrow.

Trish

Name: Jan Modzilewski
Gender: Male
Ethnicity/ Nationality: Polish
Age: 26
Birth Date: abt 1879
Departure Port: Hamburg
Arrival Date: 2 Jun 1905
Arrival Port: New York, New York, USA
Ship Name: Pennsylvania



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Trish



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Post Posted: Sun Sep 04, 2022 4:57 pm      Post subject: Re: Finding passenger lists for the S.S. Pres. Grant, 1903
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starshadow wrote:
I'm trying to find the passenger lists for the S.S. Pres. Grant, arriving in NY City on May 11 1903. It embarked from Antwerp Belgium. There seem to be no ships in active use using that name in 1903. Though there were other ships using that name before and after. One was renamed that in 1907, but wasn't in active use in 1903. I'm wondering if the one I'm looking for was renamed, or if its passenger lists are unavailable.


Hi Everyone,
There was a Jan Modzelewski on the President Grant in 1907. He was married. His wife was still in Poland. He was going to go see his Uncle.

Any thoughts!
Trish

Name: Jan Modzelewski
Gender: Male
Ethnicity/ Nationality: Polish
Marital status: Married
Age: 29
Birth Date: abt 1878
Birth Place: Russia
Other Birth Place: Modrelow
Last Known Residence: Modrele Stare, Russia
Departure Port: Hamburg
Arrival Date: 7 Nov 1907
Arrival Port: New York, New York, USA
Final Destination: New York, New York
Height: 5 Feet, 7 Inches
Hair Color: Light Fair
Eye Color: Gray
Complexion: Dark
Money in Possession: 7
Person in Old Country: Stanislawa Modzelewska
Person in Old Country Relationship: Wife
Person in Old Country Residence: Modrele Stare, Lourza
Person in US: Marcin Petrongowski
Person in US Relationship: Uncle
Spouse: Stanislawa Modzelewska
Ship Name: President Grant



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Sophia
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Post Posted: Mon Sep 05, 2022 7:49 am      Post subject:
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Hi Starshadow, Trish and Dave,
I think that Trish, in providing these two ship manifests, has given us the solution to the puzzle.
Starshadow, one of your questions was whether John got the name of his ship wrong. It was not his error. You can see on the Declaration of Intention that you posted, just below John's signature there is a paragraph showing that a certificate was provided to the clerk of the district court. That certificate would have named the ship and the date of entry. It was researched and signed off by the commissioner of immigration and naturalization. So the person who wrote that certificate provided incorrect information, and here I am hypothesizing that what they wrote was based on finding the same 1907 manifest that Trish posted. Further, I am guessing that the person receiving that certificate misread 1907 as 1903 and entered that info on the declaration. It is not the right one, however, because John was clearly in the U.S. already, marrying in Throop, PA in November 1905. Trish's June 1905 manifest, which gives the town of origin that you expected to find, is most likely the correct manifest.
By the way, the 1907 manifest is a two-page manifest.
What do you think?
Sophia

P.S. Here is a very nice example for you of a "Certificate of Arrival." Follow this link, scroll down the page until you get the part about naturalizations after 1906, and you will see it:

https://www.familysearch.org/en/wiki/U.S._Naturalization_Records_Class_Handout
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starshadow
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Post Posted: Mon Sep 05, 2022 8:19 am      Post subject: Re: Finding passenger lists for the S.S. Pres. Grant, 1903
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Trish wrote:
Hi Everyone,

This could be Jan Modzelewski coming on a different ship. I need another set of eyes to look at this record. Jan is on line 18 coming from Zembrow.

Trish

Name: Jan Modzilewski
Gender: Male
Ethnicity/ Nationality: Polish
Age: 26
Birth Date: abt 1879
Departure Port: Hamburg
Arrival Date: 2 Jun 1905
Arrival Port: New York, New York, USA
Ship Name: Pennsylvania


Thanks Trish. I really believe this might be the right John on the 1905 manifest. Most of the details match up. The errors on his Declaration very possibly derived from a transcription error, as Sophia suggested. And the "m" for married could just be another simple error. This manifest also provides some new leads, like his brother Adolf Modzilewski. I really appreciate this. I'll check into it further.
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starshadow
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Post Posted: Mon Sep 05, 2022 8:38 am      Post subject:
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Sophia wrote:
Hi Starshadow, Trish and Dave,
I think that Trish, in providing these two ship manifests, has given us the solution to the puzzle.
Starshadow, one of your questions was whether John got the name of his ship wrong. It was not his error. You can see on the Declaration of Intention that you posted, just below John's signature there is a paragraph showing that a certificate was provided to the clerk of the district court. That certificate would have named the ship and the date of entry. It was researched and signed off by the commissioner of immigration and naturalization. So the person who wrote that certificate provided incorrect information, and here I am hypothesizing that what they wrote was based on finding the same 1907 manifest that Trish posted. Further, I am guessing that the person receiving that certificate misread 1907 as 1903 and entered that info on the declaration. It is not the right one, however, because John was clearly in the U.S. already, marrying in Throop, PA in November 1905. Trish's June 1905 manifest, which gives the town of origin that you expected to find, is most likely the correct manifest.
By the way, the 1907 manifest is a two-page manifest.
What do you think?
Sophia

P.S. Here is a very nice example for you of a "Certificate of Arrival." Follow this link, scroll down the page until you get the part about naturalizations after 1906, and you will see it:

https://www.familysearch.org/en/wiki/U.S._Naturalization_Records_Class_Handout


Thanks Sophia. I think you're right. There were so many John Modzelewski's coming over. Dozens of them it seems. It must have been hard for the clerks to find info for the right one. The John on Trish's 1905 manifest matches up in almost every way. I'll check out the article.
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