PolishOrigins Forum

 FAQFAQ    SearchSearch    MemberlistMemberlist    ProfileProfile    Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages    Log inLog in    RegisterRegister 
Author
Message
dnowicki
PO Top Contributor


Joined: 28 Dec 2011
Replies: 1683
Location: Michigan City, Indiana

Back to top
Post Posted: Tue Apr 09, 2013 7:35 pm      Post subject: Wojciga & Kadela
Reply with quote

This is the post of the marriage record in two parts. Part 1 shows the column headings and Part 2 contains the actual data.


Andrzej Kedala Marriage data.jpg
 Description:
 Filesize:  279.44 KB
 Viewed:  1981 Time(s)

Andrzej Kedala Marriage data.jpg



Andrzej Kedala Marriage headings jpg.jpg
 Description:
 Filesize:  442.18 KB
 Viewed:  1981 Time(s)

Andrzej Kedala Marriage headings jpg.jpg


View user's profile
Send private message
fiverus



Joined: 18 May 2012
Replies: 19

Back to top
Post Posted: Tue Apr 09, 2013 8:01 pm      Post subject:
Reply with quote

dnowicki-very interesting. I don't see separate attachment.? How do I find it?

Karen
View user's profile
Send private message
fiverus



Joined: 18 May 2012
Replies: 19

Back to top
Post Posted: Tue Apr 09, 2013 8:07 pm      Post subject:
Reply with quote

dnowicki is Wojciga spelled Wojciech? polish way?
View user's profile
Send private message
fiverus



Joined: 18 May 2012
Replies: 19

Back to top
Post Posted: Tue Apr 09, 2013 8:19 pm      Post subject:
Reply with quote

Where should I look for church records at St. Casimir's? There may be more sacramental records from there to search like marriage records of Louis Wojciga/Wujciga. I still searching church where he may have married about 1928 give or take a few years. I know St. Mary of Celle was his parish when he lived in Berwyn but don't know if he married there or not.

I think Andrzej Kadela is most likely candidate for caretakers of Anna, Louis and John Wojciga.

Thanks to all you experts! you've all have made my day:)
View user's profile
Send private message
fiverus



Joined: 18 May 2012
Replies: 19

Back to top
Post Posted: Tue Apr 09, 2013 8:30 pm      Post subject:
Reply with quote

Elzbieta-Is there a way to find out my Grandfather's parents name in Poland?

Karen
View user's profile
Send private message
dnowicki
PO Top Contributor


Joined: 28 Dec 2011
Replies: 1683
Location: Michigan City, Indiana

Back to top
Post Posted: Wed Apr 10, 2013 7:31 am      Post subject: Wojciga & Kedala
Reply with quote

Karen,

The record for Andrzej Kedala's marriage is the separate post. My original attempt to post the record exceeded the size limit so I posted it with the second (short) messaage.

I also posted an incorrect address for the Chicago research aid site. It should be www.alookatcook.com rather than the address posted previously.

You can find the records filmed for St. Casimir's as well as St. Adalbert's and other parishes of the Chicago Archdiocese on the Mormon church site www.familysearch.org On the home page scroll down and click on United States under browse records. Then click on Illinois and then on Chicago Catholic Church records. On the list of parishes click on the name of parish you wish to research. Be aware that the vast majority of filmed records only include records until 1915.

Wojciech is the Polish version of the first name Adalbert (Adalbertus in Latin). St. Adalbert's Church in Polish is Kosciol sw. Wojciecha. If one of your Wojciga relatives had the first name Adalbert his name in Polish would be Wojciech Wojciga or in Latin it would be Adalbertus Wojciga.

After his marriage to Tekla Andrzej Kedala and his wife would have belonged to St. Adalbert's based on the address of their residence in the 1910 census. The reason that the wedding took place at St. Casimir's is because that was the parish to which Tekla belonged as a single woman and by Catholic Church law marriages were to ordinarily take place in the parish of the bride.

Another resource which you may find helpful in giving direction to Chicago area genealogy research is a book by Grace DuMelle entitled Finding Your Chicago Ancestors. This book is available in book stores as well as on Amazon.

Hope this info helps.

Dave
View user's profile
Send private message
fiverus



Joined: 18 May 2012
Replies: 19

Back to top
Post Posted: Wed Apr 10, 2013 11:22 am      Post subject:
Reply with quote

dnowicki-Your information is very helpful. I'm so new at this and appreciate your direction how to search parishes on Family Search..

Best REgards,
Karen
View user's profile
Send private message
fiverus



Joined: 18 May 2012
Replies: 19

Back to top
Post Posted: Thu Sep 26, 2013 3:02 pm      Post subject: Wojciga/more information Radom/Krzeszow/birth certificate
Reply with quote

Hello,
Can someone kindly translate my Grandfathers birth certificate?

Thank you,
Karen



20130926145648124.pdf
 Description:
Hello, Can someone kindly translate my Grandfathers birth certificate?

thank you,
Karen

Download
 Filename:  20130926145648124.pdf
 Filesize:  55.33 KB
 Downloaded:  193 Time(s)

View user's profile
Send private message
Elzbieta Porteneuve
PO Top Contributor


Joined: 09 Nov 2012
Replies: 3096
Location: Paris, France

Back to top
Post Posted: Thu Sep 26, 2013 4:29 pm      Post subject: Re: Wojciga/more information Radom/Krzeszow/birth certificat
Reply with quote

fiverus wrote:
Hello,
Can someone kindly translate my Grandfathers birth certificate?

Thank you,
Karen


Karen,

Here it is: baptism and birth certificate from the parish Wsola.

Best,
Elzbieta
==

[Top left corner]
L. aktu 4 // Number 4
Z r. 1902 // from the year 1902

[Title]
Metryka Chrztu // Baptism certificate
Wyciag z ksiag metrycznych rz.-kat. [rzymsko - katolickiej] parafii Wsola za rok 1902. //
Extract from the books of Registry of Vital Records, Roman – Catholic parish in Wsola, year 1902.

Wojewodztwo: Kieleckie // Voievodship: Kielce
Powiat: Radom // County: Radom
Gmina: Wsola // Community: Wsola

Diecezja: Sandomierska // Diocese: Sandomierz
Dekanat: Jedlińsk // Deanery: Jedlińsk
Parafia: Wsola // Parish: Wsola

[headers, then content]
Imie i nazwisko: // First and Last name: Ludwik Wujciga
Imiona rodzicow: // first names of parents: Jan i Marianna z Witków // Jan and Marianna born Witek
Miejsce urodzenia: // Place of birth: Wielogóra
Data urodzenia: // Date of birth: 25 grudzien 1901 rok // 25 December 1901
Data chrztu: // Date of baptism: 19 styczen 1902 r. // 19 January 1902

Urodzony roku tysiac dziewiecset pierwszego // Born year one thousand nine-hundred one

Zgodnosc wyciagu z oryginalem aktu stwierdzam wlasnorecznym podpisem i przybiciem ... //
Conformity with the original act is certified by our own signature and affixing …

[line continues hidden by two stamps, guessed text] pieczeci parafialnej // the seal of the parish

Wsola, dnia 7 pazdziernika 1959 r. // Wsola, 7 October 1959
[two tax stamps: Oplata Skarbowa 10 zl, Oplata skarbowa 5 zl][seal with cross and Sandomierz – Wsola][signature]
Proboszcz parafii Wsola // Pastor of the parish Wsola

==
View user's profile
Send private message
fiverus



Joined: 18 May 2012
Replies: 19

Back to top
Post Posted: Fri Sep 27, 2013 9:21 am      Post subject:
Reply with quote

Thank you Elzbieta ,

How do I find more information about his parents? Jan and Marianna Witkow? or Witek? How come their last name is not Wojciga? I so confused. Since I know parish is Wsola, should I try to find parish? and find out church name.

Also, I think Agata Wojciga may be my Grandfather's Aunt (his dad's sister).

Would it be possible for you to summarize what you think and I can go from there? (if possible). My cousin and I are so confused with all the different kinds of information. I am not expert at all, learning as I go along....

Thank you for your support as always!
Karen
View user's profile
Send private message
Elzbieta Porteneuve
PO Top Contributor


Joined: 09 Nov 2012
Replies: 3096
Location: Paris, France

Back to top
Post Posted: Fri Sep 27, 2013 11:00 am      Post subject:
Reply with quote

fiverus wrote:
Thank you Elzbieta ,

How do I find more information about his parents? Jan and Marianna Witkow? or Witek? How come their last name is not Wojciga? I so confused. Since I know parish is Wsola, should I try to find parish? and find out church name.

Also, I think Agata Wojciga may be my Grandfather's Aunt (his dad's sister).

Would it be possible for you to summarize what you think and I can go from there? (if possible). My cousin and I are so confused with all the different kinds of information. I am not expert at all, learning as I go along....

Thank you for your support as always!
Karen


Karen,

1. Wujciga vs. Wojciga, or rather with "ó", Wójciga - that is matter of orthography, the Polish spelling is identical.
The correct orthography is Wójciga, you can see they are 294 today
http://www.moikrewni.pl/mapa/kompletny/w%25C3%25B3jciga.html
while only 1 without diacritical mark, Wojciga, and nobody with "u" Wujciga.

That could be a scribe mistake, either in 1901 (original) or in 1959.
If the name was ever scribed in Cyrillic (phonetical), you cannot recover Polish orthography without knowing how it should be.
I would not bother too much with that "u" and "ó" issue. You know the name was Wojciga.

2. Jan Wójciga and Marianna Witek (other is declension), spouse Wójciga
Their son Ludwik was born in Wielogóra, it is North of Radom.
The distance between Wielogóra and Wsola is very small, circa 2 km.

3. The parish is Wsola. I understand it was their church.

What to do now? That is difficult. A part of Wsola records is in public archives http://szukajwarchiwach.pl online.
It could be better to find original birth act, and get his parents age.
You may know the year when Ludwik's parents married (from your personal family souvenirs), or estimate it was 1-2 years before Ludwik's birth, and try to find it.

Maybe you have some hints with Agata Wojciga?
Sorry, not much help.

Best,
Elzbieta
View user's profile
Send private message
dnowicki
PO Top Contributor


Joined: 28 Dec 2011
Replies: 1683
Location: Michigan City, Indiana

Back to top
Post Posted: Fri Sep 27, 2013 2:10 pm      Post subject:
Reply with quote

Karen,
Perhaps a few more details might help you to better understand some of the things Elzbieta wrote. The record you posted in a baptismal certificate which is a document which contains information extracted from the original record book, in this case the parish baptismal register. The record as it appears in the register usually contains more information than what is found in the certificate. During the time of the partitions of Poland in Russian Poland the priests most often did double duty---the kept the religious records of the reception of various Sacraments--- something they did for religious purposes---and they also acted as civil registrar and kept a second set of books recording births, marriages and deaths for the civil government. The church records were kept in Latin and the civil transcripts were in Polish until 1868 and then in Russian until Poland regained independence after World War I. The register from which the certificate you posted was taken would either be found at the parish of Wsola or in the archives of the Diocese of Radom. So it would be necessary to write to either the parish or to the archives for copies of the records found in the religious registers. Since the civil transcripts were records required by the civil government those books would be found in the state archives---in this case the state archives in Radom. If the records you would like to find are not available online, it would be necessary to write to the archive and request copies of the records you are interested in. In my experience, the archive directors I contacted were very prompt in replying to my requests but it takes several months for the copies to arrive after the archive sends them. --- I guess they are sent on a slow boat--- There are fees set by the government for the cost of copying the records and sending them but they are reasonable. The fees must be deposited directly into the archive's account so it is almost as expensive to accomplish the wire transfer as the archive's fee for the work.

In a separate post I will give a more detailed explanation of what is meant by a declension.
Dave
View user's profile
Send private message
dnowicki
PO Top Contributor


Joined: 28 Dec 2011
Replies: 1683
Location: Michigan City, Indiana

Back to top
Post Posted: Fri Sep 27, 2013 2:46 pm      Post subject:
Reply with quote

Karen,
Declensions are not something we think about in English but are something found in what are called inflected languages. Both Polish and Latin are inflected languages. What this means is that in both those languages nouns and adjectives have a series of case endings which indicate the use of the noun in a sentence. In English the use of a noun is determined by position in a sentence rather than by changes of endings. The simplest word order in English is subject, verb, direct object. If you take a simple sentence like "The dog bit the boy" the dog is the subject (the one doing the biting) and the boy is the direct object (the one being bitten). If you change the word order to "The boy bit the dog" the whole meaning is completely different. In inflected languages the word order is not so important---you can tell whose is doing the biting and who is being bitten by the case endings of the nouns. There is still a remnant of a declension found in English pronouns. An example would be a pronoun like who. When the pronoun is the subject it is "who." When the pronoun is showing possession the form is "whose" and when it is either a direct or an indirect object the form is "whom." What is going on here is that the pronoun is made up of two parts---a stem and an ending. The stem is "wh" and the endings are "o", "ose" and "om". When we use the proper endings (the declension) of the pronoun in English we can depart from the normal word order without changing the meaning of the sentence. If we say in English "Whom did you see?" the word order is direct object, subject, verb but the person doing the seeing and the person seen are clear because of the "ending" used in the form of the pronoun whom. In both Polish and in Latin nouns have sets of endings which show how the noun is being used in a sentence. The grouping of nouns according to the types of endings they take is called a declension. In Polish nouns have seven case endings in the singular and seven in the plural and in Latin nouns have six case endings in the singular and six in the plural. What is happening with the surname Witek (which is a noun) is that the maiden name of the mother is given in the Genitive Plural form and it literally means "of the Witeks" in common English. The surname of the father is not repeated in the certificate after his first name because it already appeared as part of the child's name. In English we would say that Ludwik's parents were Mr. & Mrs. Wojciga. What the certificate adds is the maiden name of the mother---Witek.
Hope this helps to explain the differences between a noninflected language (English) and an inflected language (Polish). The key to understanding this is found in the structure of the respective languages.
Dave
View user's profile
Send private message
fiverus



Joined: 18 May 2012
Replies: 19

Back to top
Post Posted: Tue Oct 08, 2013 1:44 pm      Post subject:
Reply with quote

I am wondering about contacting St. Bartholomew's in Wsola in the Wielogora area where my grandfather Ludwik was born/baptised. His father's name is Jan Wojciga and his mother's name is Marianna Witkow (Wojciga). I do not speak Polish and wonder how would we go about doing this.

Karen
View user's profile
Send private message
fiverus



Joined: 18 May 2012
Replies: 19

Back to top
Post Posted: Tue Oct 08, 2013 2:21 pm      Post subject:
Reply with quote

Someone else is looking for my family as well at a Polish genealogy site!! - http://tinyurl.com/c7fbnyz
Maybe someone here can be so kind to help me send a message or reply to Kasia since I cannot read or speak polish? or maybe let me know her email address?

Karen
View user's profile
Send private message
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    PolishOrigins Forum Index -> Research in Poland All times are GMT - 5 Hours
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4  Next Page 3 of 4

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You can download files in this forum


Powered by phpBB ©

© 2019 COPYRIGHTS BY THE OWNER OF POLISHORIGINS.COM