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Shannon207



Joined: 31 Mar 2023
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Post Posted: Fri Mar 31, 2023 10:45 am      Post subject: Would be so grateful for help on Great Grandparents
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Longing for information about my Great Grandfathers and Great Grandmothers lives before their arrival in America.

All info I have acquired is from my GGrandfathers declaration of intention paperwork and a passenger log for him. Passenger log states he is Russian and from Russia (what my father always believed) But all his declaration of intention paperwork that I found lists Bolshia, Kniazikovcy, Poland as last residence before America and that he is Polish. Russian Poland?-so maybe this makes sense.

My great grandfather arrived under the name of Andrej Szadulski on the SS Ausonia (formerly Tortana) His name in America was Andrew Sadulsky. He arrived at Ellis Island from the La Havre, France port about1913 with Father listed as Teodor. My father said he was told he left to avoid conscription into the Russian army. He arrived here at the age of 19. And though my Dad thinks he secretly escaped, maybe under a false name, at that age, maybe that might not have been necessary.

But then, after months of searching, I am loss for anything more. My research techniques are newly acquired and definitely amateur.

My great grandmother, who married my GGrandfather in America, is even more of a mystery.

She died in 1944 before my own father was born, and no information seems to be available about her. According to my GGrandfathers declaration of intention paperwork, she was from Viliaki, Poland. And arrived in New York August 27, 1912. But I can find no info because of the mystery of her last name.
Our family seems unsure about her last name. Supposedly Veroniqus Skrabw as listed on my Grandfathers obituary. But no one knows where this came from. (or first name Veronica or Veronika?) Other family tree researchers have listed her last name as Skvabutan or Zaibatan or Scrubbutan or Scroboton??? But showing no proof. Ugh!

She's listed on Census paperwork in America as not being able to read or write, and supposedly only spoke Polish.

I have tried every combinations of names and anything I can think of. But I am sure the Polish and Russian language/ translation is not helping me. And since I can't verify towns or places listed for them, I am lost Sad I would be more grateful than I can describe for even a little hint of their lives before America. But completely understand that some brick wall are not coming down.
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BarbOslo



Joined: 19 Nov 2022
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Post Posted: Fri Mar 31, 2023 11:50 am      Post subject: Re: Would be so grateful for help on Great Grandparents
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Shannon207 wrote:
Longing for information about my Great Grandfathers and Great Grandmothers lives before their arrival in America.

All info I have acquired is from my GGrandfathers declaration of intention paperwork and a passenger log for him. Passenger log states he is Russian and from Russia (what my father always believed) But all his declaration of intention paperwork that I found lists Bolshia, Kniazikovcy, Poland as last residence before America and that he is Polish. Russian Poland?-so maybe this makes sense.

My great grandfather arrived under the name of Andrej Szadulski on the SS Ausonia (formerly Tortana) His name in America was Andrew Sadulsky. He arrived at Ellis Island from the La Havre, France port about1913 with Father listed as Teodor. My father said he was told he left to avoid conscription into the Russian army. He arrived here at the age of 19. And though my Dad thinks he secretly escaped, maybe under a false name, at that age, maybe that might not have been necessary.

But then, after months of searching, I am loss for anything more. My research techniques are newly acquired and definitely amateur.

My great grandmother, who married my GGrandfather in America, is even more of a mystery.

She died in 1944 before my own father was born, and no information seems to be available about her. According to my GGrandfathers declaration of intention paperwork, she was from Viliaki, Poland. And arrived in New York August 27, 1912. But I can find no info because of the mystery of her last name.
Our family seems unsure about her last name. Supposedly Veroniqus Skrabw as listed on my Grandfathers obituary. But no one knows where this came from. (or first name Veronica or Veronika?) Other family tree researchers have listed her last name as Skvabutan or Zaibatan or Scrubbutan or Scroboton??? But showing no proof. Ugh!

She's listed on Census paperwork in America as not being able to read or write, and supposedly only spoke Polish.

I have tried every combinations of names and anything I can think of. But I am sure the Polish and Russian language/ translation is not helping me. And since I can't verify towns or places listed for them, I am lost Sad I would be more grateful than I can describe for even a little hint of their lives before America. But completely understand that some brick wall are not coming down.


Hi, You don't give a specific place, date... Could you upload some documents?
_____
-Barb
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Shannon207



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Post Posted: Fri Mar 31, 2023 12:12 pm      Post subject: Would be so grateful for help on Great Grandparents
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Of Course. I'll give you all I have, but what I have is probably not much.


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Shannon207



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Post Posted: Fri Mar 31, 2023 12:15 pm      Post subject: Would be so grateful for help on Great Grandparents
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And the last two.


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BarbOslo



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Post Posted: Fri Mar 31, 2023 12:22 pm      Post subject: Re: Would be so grateful for help on Great Grandparents
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Shannon207 wrote:
And the last two.


Thanks, will look into this.
B.
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Shannon207



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Post Posted: Fri Mar 31, 2023 12:23 pm      Post subject: Would be so grateful for help on Great Grandparents
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Thank you so much!
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Shannon207



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Post Posted: Fri Mar 31, 2023 2:38 pm      Post subject: Would be so grateful for help on Great Grandparents
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Hi Barb,
I just found out some info from a cousin.
I thought it might help considering it is once again a little different but interesting.

From a family notebook:
Andrew Sadulsky born Poland on Jan 27, 1896 in Rypnik, Poland. 50-100 mi from Berlin Poznan.
I was told he came from a landed (I think he meant learned) family and was sent to school in St. Petersburg.

I will try to find something more with this too.

Thank you, Thank You!!
Shannon
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Shannon207



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Post Posted: Fri Mar 31, 2023 2:50 pm      Post subject: Would be so grateful for help on Great Grandparents
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Sorry to be replying so much. One more thing. My cousin just taught me something.
'Landed means that they owned land and were therefor rich as Poland went at the time. That is why the family could afford to send him to St. Petersburg for schooling.'
I thought this might lead to land ownership records?!
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BarbOslo



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Post Posted: Fri Mar 31, 2023 3:17 pm      Post subject: Re: Would be so grateful for help on Great Grandparents
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Shannon207 wrote:
Sorry to be replying so much. One more thing. My cousin just taught me something.
'Landed means that they owned land and were therefor rich as Poland went at the time. That is why the family could afford to send him to St. Petersburg for schooling.'
I thought this might lead to land ownership records?!


Hi Shannon,
It is absolutely not the direction of Poznan. This part of Poland was German speaking.
We have to search in the region of north-east Poland (today Podlaskie) in the direction of Belarus.

But.... in Podlaskie voivodeship there is a place called Rybniki (15 km from Bialystok).

-Barb



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Shannon207



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Post Posted: Fri Mar 31, 2023 4:08 pm      Post subject: Would be so grateful for help on Great Grandparents
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This info is so great! Thank you!.
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BarbOslo



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Post Posted: Fri Mar 31, 2023 4:53 pm      Post subject: Re: Would be so grateful for help on Great Grandparents
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In the two documents concerning Andrej, two different places are mentioned. His place of birth is given as Bolshia Kniazikovcy. Was written that was heard. He was probably Polish speaking, but in this region many people speak with a Russian accent and the words are mixed up. So first word is: Большая (Russian) – Wielka (Polish) – Great (English). Bolshia is phonetic form. The second word I think is Kniazikowce. Wielkie Kniazikowce.


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Shannon207



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Post Posted: Fri Mar 31, 2023 5:15 pm      Post subject:
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I feel like I'm starting to get a possible feel for his earlier life! so grateful!
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BarbOslo



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Post Posted: Fri Mar 31, 2023 5:23 pm      Post subject:
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https://www.radzima.org/pl/miejsce/kniazikowce-wielkie.html?fbclid=IwAR0P0sq-x_ysiP58z4XEb6E9GZgk8DRBjyaYzoO8NbT5Y8MMawwPcGedlh4

You can look for your ancestors in this parish:
Zhizhma and Lipnishki.



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Last edited by BarbOslo on Sat Apr 01, 2023 5:38 am; edited 1 time in total
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BarbOslo



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Post Posted: Sat Apr 01, 2023 2:26 am      Post subject: Re: Would be so grateful for help on Great Grandparents
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"My great grandmother, who married my GGrandfather in America, is even more of a mystery.
She died in 1944 before my own father was born, and no information seems to be available about her. According to my GGrandfathers declaration of intention paperwork, she was from Viliaki, Poland. And arrived in New York August 27, 1912. But I can find no info because of the mystery of her last name.
Our family seems unsure about her last name. Supposedly Veroniqus Skrabw as listed on my Grandfathers obituary. But no one knows where this came from. (or first name Veronica or Veronika?) Other family tree researchers have listed her last name as Skvabutan or Zaibatan or Scrubbutan or Scroboton??? But showing no proof. Ugh!"


Hi ,
You listed Veronika's (Weronika's) place of birth as "Viliaki". It may be written in inflection typical of Polish, Russian language.

In Latvia I found a place called Viļaka. Written in Russian Виляка (phonetic Viliaka).
Viļaka is located approx. 250 km km from Riga, not far from the Russian border.

You wrote that her last name was Skvabutan or Zaibatan or Scrubbutan or Scroboton. Some Latvian surnames sound German and Swedish. This has a historical background. Some are more Russian.

I know too little to be sure about that location.

-Barb
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Shannon207



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Post Posted: Sat Apr 01, 2023 12:04 pm      Post subject: Would be so grateful for help on Great Grandparents
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I can't thank you enough Barb.
You've made sense of things I never would have figured out.
I'm gonna start hunting for more clues right now!!
Shannon
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