Forum | PolishOrigins :: View topic - Investigations on Franciszek Ksawery Wakulski

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BarbOslo
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Posted: Fri Oct 11, 2024 5:04 am Post subject:

Hi Barb,
Thanks!
Geneteka provides links to both marriages: https://geneteka.genealodzy.pl/index.php?op=gt&lang=pol&bdm=S&w=22br&rid=6659&search_lastname=Wakulski&search_name=&search_lastname2=&search_name2=&from_date=&to_date=

Sophia[/quote]

Hi,
I've looked at both.
The first entry is very sparse with information. Date: 14.2.1825. The names of both, priest's name, and the names of witness. They were both single. The witness's surname appears to be unrelated to the family (not in the same name). Most of all, I miss the parent's surname and age.

Wedding from 15.11.1843 contain more information:
Groom: Maciej Oleński, a bachelor, 48 years old, a son of Jerzy Oleński and Maryanna nee Sieńkiewicz
Bride: Karolina Wakulska, a widow, 28 years old (born abt. 1815), from the area near Ejsmonty, Grodno region, a daughter of Józef Swidinowicz and Zofia nee Ziezunińska
Karolina in 1825 in 1843 was the same person (has the same maiden name). Looks like she was younger than your Ksawery Wakulski. .... but her age must have been wrongly written in marriage no.2. If she was 28 years old in 1843, then she was only 10 years old when she married for the first time! Then I became even more confused.

-Barb

Sophia
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Posted: Fri Oct 11, 2024 7:05 am Post subject:

BarbOslo wrote:

Hi,
I've looked at both.
The first entry is very sparse with information. Date: 14.2.1825. The names of both, priest's name, and the names of witness. They were both single. The witness's surname appears to be unrelated to the family (not in the same name). Most of all, I miss the parent's surname and age.

Wedding from 15.11.1843 contain more information:
Groom: Maciej Oleński, a bachelor, 48 years old, a son of Jerzy Oleński and Maryanna nee Sieńkiewicz
Bride: Karolina Wakulska, a widow, 28 years old (born abt. 1815), from the area near Ejsmonty, Grodno region, a daughter of Józef Swidinowicz and Zofia nee Ziezunińska
Karolina in 1825 in 1843 was the same person (has the same maiden name). Looks like she was younger than your Ksawery Wakulski. .... but her age must have been wrongly written in marriage no.2. If she was 28 years old in 1843, then she was only 10 years old when she married for the first time! Then I became even more confused.

-Barb

Hi Barb,
Thank you very much for looking at these. I am just as confused as you are by Karolina's age. It is what it is, though. An error by the scribe, perhaps. Or a woman who refused to age! Who knows.
I think it all gets put into a file folder of "interesting records that may be part of the Wakulski family tree."
Enjoy the upcoming weekend,
Sophia

Myriasth

Joined: 15 Sep 2024
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Posted: Fri Oct 11, 2024 8:52 am Post subject:

Hey, thank you very much for these translations

So if we sum up what we have regarding Franciszek Ksawery WAKULSKI marriages :

- 1825 : Franciszek Ksawery WAKULSKI (though we don't know for sure it's him) married Karolina SWIDINOWICZ in Belarus
- Franciszek Ksawery WAKULSKI left his home at some point and went to Polonia
- before 1833 : Franciszek Ksawery WAKULSKI started a relationship with Katarzyna PARAZINSKA
- 1833 : first born child, Natalia Jozefa WAKULSKA, they are considered maried
- 1840 : fifth born child, Roman WAKULSKI, they are considered NOT maried (why ?) and according to Barb it's the only birth record where this is the case
- 1843 : his former wife Karolina WAKULSKA (born SWIDINOWICZ, considered widow, her age doesn't correspond though) could remarry Maciej OLENSKI
- 1879 : Franciszek Ksawery WAKULSKI married Katarzyna PARAZINSKA at an old age, they were around 79 and 66 years old

Putting the pieces together, it makes sense. Do you think Franciszek Ksawery WAKULSKI and Katarzyna PARAZINSKA married normally before 1833 ?
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Last edited by Myriasth on Fri Oct 11, 2024 11:54 am; edited 1 time in total

BarbOslo
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Posted: Fri Oct 11, 2024 10:36 am Post subject:

It would be interesting to see if there were any children from the Wakulski-Swidinowicz marriage in the period 1825-1832. And check whether the surname Wakulski exists in the Ejsmonty area.
I do not believe that Ksawery i Katarzyna was married before 1833. This information in Roman's birth record suggests that the priest was interested to hear where they married, since they came from another place. This family moved a lot.

-Barb

Myriasth

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Posted: Fri Oct 11, 2024 12:11 pm Post subject:

I found a birth record of Wincenty OKULSKI, parents Ksawery OKULSKI and Karolina SWIEDINOWICZ, in 1825, place Grodno
n°228 : https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3QS7-99D3-LSZZ-G?cat=2325238

And maybe his death record but this time it is spelled Wincenty WOKULSKI, in 1831, place Grodno, at 6 years old (the age matches his birth record in 1825) but i don't see his parents ...
n°252 : https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3QS7-99D3-39SM-L?cat=2325238

It looks like the same couple but OKULSKI name seems to be way more common in Polonia than WAKULSKI, bot not in Belarus. I don't know if this is a mistake ...

SWIEDINOWICZ / SWIDYNOWICZ name seems to be rare and mostly found in Grodno according to Geneteka.
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Sophia
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Posted: Fri Oct 11, 2024 1:44 pm Post subject:

Myriasth wrote:

Also, it looks like twins in 1823. Record 290 is for Anna Okulska and Ksawery Okulski, children of Ksawery Okulski and Agnieszka Kuleszo:
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3QS7-99D3-LSSS-4?cat=2325238

Myriasth

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Posted: Fri Oct 11, 2024 3:26 pm Post subject:

Sophia wrote:

Myriasth wrote:

The mother is not the same, maybe it is another couple
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Myriasth

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Posted: Sat Nov 02, 2024 10:29 am Post subject:

Hello,
I'm stopping research on this branch for now.

I have a birth record of a brother of Franciszek Ksawery WAKULSKI (son) 's wife which i would like to be translated.
act n°33 : https://metryki.genealodzy.pl/index.php?op=pg&id=998&se=&sy=1852&kt=1&plik=031-034.jpg&x=1679&y=186&zoom=1

Here is a first draft, to be corrected and completed ...
" This took place in Warsaw on June 25 / July 7, 1852, at 5 p.m. Wilhelm LOMBARD, a private tutor aged 57, residing in Warsaw at No. 1359, appeared in the presence of Jan Jakub DE CASTRES de TERSAC, a private tutor in Warsaw aged 38, and Jakub Karol GRESSER, profession ??? aged 73. They presented to us a male child, born in Warsaw at No. 1359 on April 16 / 28 of this year at 3 p.m., the son of his wife Wirginia née PERRIN, aged 39. At Holy Baptism, the child was given the names Emil Henryk. His godparents were Emil HIGNET, clerk ???, and Jozefa Marcelina MNIEWSKA, who was replaced by Lucia RUBICKA, as well as August DAUBAN, captain ???"

Thank you for your help

Yvan
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BarbOslo
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Posted: Sat Nov 02, 2024 12:11 pm Post subject:

No. 33 Emil Henryk Lombard
It happened in the town of Warszawa on June 25th/July 7th, 1852, at 5 p.m.
Appeared Wilhelm LOMBARD, a private teacher/tutor, 57 years old, residing in Warszawa at no. 1359, in the presence of Jan Jakub DE CASTRES de TERSAC, a private teacher/tutor, residing in Warszawa at no.604, 38 years old, and Jakub Karol GRESSER, inspector of the Polish bank printing house, residing in Warszawa at no. 773, 73 years old, and presented to us a male child, who was born in Warszawa at no. 1359 on April 16th/28th of the current year at 3 p.m., to his legal wife Wirginia née PERRIN, 39 years old.
At The Holy Baptism, held today the child was given the names Emil Henryk, and his godparents were Emil HIGNET, clerk in the office of the war governor of the city of Warsaw and Mrs. Jozefa Marcelina MNIEWSKA, who was replaced by Lucia RUBICKA, as well as August DAUBAN, a ship's captain with Mrs. Henrieta (Henryka) LOMBARD nee PEJROT, and Henryk Martin (Marcin) and Mrs. Ludwika Stefania LOMBARD.
This act was delayed due to the weakness of the child's mother was read to the father and the witnesses, and signed by them.
X. Józef Spleczyński, pastor
Witness signatures

Myriasth

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Posted: Sat Nov 02, 2024 1:34 pm Post subject:

BarbOslo wrote:

Thank very much for your quick answer
So if i understand well, the child has several godfathers and godmothers ?
And do you think that the persons mentionned but who did not sign were present too ? Because it's quite odd that some were ever gone to Poland, for example Henrieta PEIROT (uncle's wife) or August DAUBAN (half-uncle)
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BarbOslo
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Posted: Sat Nov 02, 2024 1:59 pm Post subject:

I do not know if everyone was present during this ceremony, but it is possible that another person may represent the absent one. More than 2 sponsors / godparents is typical for an evangelical ceremony.

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