Myriasth
Joined: 15 Sep 2024
Replies: 23
Location: FranceBack to top |
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marcelproustPO Top Contributor
Joined: 28 Jun 2014
Replies: 4398
Location: PolandBack to top |
Posted: Mon Sep 16, 2024 3:04 pm
Post subject: Re: Help translating mariage and death record
I am working on it.
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My translations are voluntary, but they take a lot of time and effort, so whenever you want to send money it will be a very nice "Thank you" gift to me.
THANK YOU 
PAYPAL: [email protected]
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marcelproustPO Top Contributor
Joined: 28 Jun 2014
Replies: 4398
Location: PolandBack to top |
Posted: Mon Sep 16, 2024 4:59 pm
Post subject: Re: Help translating mariage and death record
217
Skierniewice
It happened in the town of Skierniewice, on September 6th/18th, 1882, at 8 a.m.
Appeared Wacław Wakulski, the deceased's son, the official of The Warsaw-Vienna Railway, from Warsaw and Feliks Gajewski, the railroad conductor from Skierniewice, both of age and they declared thet yesterday, at 9 p.m., died in Skierniewice Franciszek Ksawery Wakulski, who lived in Skierniewice, a pensioner, 82 years old, who was born in ???Stonim??? located in the governorate of Grodno, a son of the late spouses, Bazyli Wakulski and Marcjanna Wakulska of the unknown maiden name.
He was survived by his wife, Katarzyna nee Parodzińska.
After convinced myself about the death of Franciszek Ksawery Wakulski this act was read to the declarants and it was signed by Us and them.
Priest Skrzypkowski, the administrator of the Skierniewice parish, serving as Civil Registrar,
Wacław Wakulki,
Feliks Gajewski.
_______________
242
It happened in the town of Skierniewice, on June 19th/July 1st, 1879, at 10 a.m.
We make it known that in the presence of the witnesses, priest Józef Dmochowski, the vicar of the Skierniewice parish, 25 years old and Aleksander Pichelski, the organist, 64 years old, both from Skierniewice, a religious marriage was concluded on this day, between:
Ksawery Wakulski, a single man, a pensioner, who was born in the village of Starzynki located in the governorate of Mińsk, living in Skierniewice, a son of the late spouses: Mateusz Wakulski and Marcjanna Wakulska nee Skrzędziewska, 77 years old
and
Katarzyna Parazińska, a miss, who was born in the town of Węgrów located in the governorate of Siedlce, a daughter of the late spouses: Ignacy paraziński and Weronika Parazińska of the unknown maiden name, living in Skierniewice at her family, 66 years old.
This marriage was not preceded by the banns of marriage due to the decision of the Warsaw Romancatholic Consistory, issued on May 12th/24th of the current year, at number 1447.
The newlyweds declared they did not enter into the prenuptial agreement.
The religious marriage ceremony was performed by the priest Mikołaj Skrzypkowski, the administrator of the local parish.
This act was read to the newlyweds and the witnesses and it was signed by Us and them except of the bride who was illiterate.
Priest Józef Dmochowski, the witness,
Ksawery Wakulski,
Aleksander Pichelski,
priest M. Skrzypkowski, the administrator of the Skierniewice parish, serving as Civil Registrar.
_________________
My translations are voluntary, but they take a lot of time and effort, so whenever you want to send money it will be a very nice "Thank you" gift to me.
THANK YOU
PAYPAL: [email protected]
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Myriasth
Joined: 15 Sep 2024
Replies: 23
Location: FranceBack to top |
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SophiaPO Top Contributor
Joined: 05 Oct 2014
Replies: 1147
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Posted: Tue Sep 17, 2024 8:31 am
Post subject:
| Myriasth wrote: | | I wonder why they got married so lately, they already had children. |
Hi,
It is an interesting question.
I am sure you already looked at the birth/baptism records for all of the children of this couple.
I looked at the birth/baptism record for Natalia Jozefa Wakulska, Akt #149 here:
https://metryki.genealodzy.pl/index.php?op=pg&id=370&se=&sy=1833&kt=1&plik=148-153.jpg&x=346&y=1142&zoom=1.5
It appears on this record that they were truly married. It probably says the same, for all of their children.
So, why should they get married in 1879? Maybe some person in an official capacity told them they were not legally married so they decided it was easier to marry than to find an original document that proved they were married already. It is just a theory. If proof of marriage was helpful to Katarzyna after Franciszek Ksawery's death, for purposes of ownership of his estate, then it was worth it.
Good luck in your search,
Sophia
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Myriasth
Joined: 15 Sep 2024
Replies: 23
Location: FranceBack to top |
Posted: Wed Sep 18, 2024 9:50 am
Post subject:
Hello Sophia,
Indeed, i have the birth records of all of the children (as far as i know) but since i don't read polish, i only have basic informations (date essentially). I have to get these records translated, they may bring crucial informations.
Regarding the marriage your assumption might be correct. That means i have to look for a first marriage record !
Best regards
Yvan
_________________
https://gw.geneanet.org/myriasth?lang=fr&n=wakulski&oc=0&p=franciszek+ksawery&type=tree
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SophiaPO Top Contributor
Joined: 05 Oct 2014
Replies: 1147
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Posted: Wed Sep 18, 2024 1:31 pm
Post subject:
| Myriasth wrote: | Hello Sophia,
Indeed, i have the birth records of all of the children (as far as i know) but since i don't read polish, i only have basic informations (date essentially). I have to get these records translated, they may bring crucial informations.
Regarding the marriage your assumption might be correct. That means i have to look for a first marriage record !
Best regards
Yvan |
Hi Yvan,
The translation of Ksawery's death record said he was from Grodno.
There are two interesting marriages in Grodno, indexed here:
https://geneteka.genealodzy.pl/index.php?op=gt&lang=pol&bdm=S&w=22br&rid=6659&search_lastname=Wakulski&search_name=&search_lastname2=&search_name2=&from_date=&to_date=
First we see Ksawery Wakulski marrying Karolina Swidynowicz in 1825. Then, we see Karolina Wakulska marrying Maciej Olenski in 1843; I believe it says she is a widow. I do not know what to think of it. Does it mean Ksawery abandoned the marriage, left Grodno and was declared dead so that Karolina could re-marry? I do not mean any disrespect to this family, but I am looking for an explanation of what happened. I do think a full translation would be helpful. You can post the documents on the Polish translation thread here on the forum .
Sophia
P.S. Is this their son Ksawery (on line 35), with his wife (on line 36) and two sons (next page), travelling to the U.S. in 1895?
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:JXS9-CPY
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Myriasth
Joined: 15 Sep 2024
Replies: 23
Location: FranceBack to top |
Posted: Thu Sep 19, 2024 10:17 pm
Post subject:
Hello Sophia, these records are interesting, i think a translation would be helpful too (i didn't know there was a thread dedicated to translation).
Since you seem interested in my research, let me give you a resume of what i know about Franciszek Ksawery Wakulski
Firstly, i do have a date of birth : 15th of October 1800, thanks to a polish historian (Barbara Konarska-Pabiniak) who contacted the polish descendants of him. They had an old picture of the headstone with the date of birth and death (17th of October 1882). He's burried in Skierniewice. I do not know if the headstone is still there. Therefore, date of birth is quite certain.
But regarding the place of birth, it's an other story ...
The death record says he was born in Stotin / Stochin / Stonim in the governorate of Grodno (around 1800 according to his age, which corroborate the date of birth i already know). However i can't identify where are "Stotin / Stochin / Stonim". Maybe it's Slonim but i already checked this lead : belarus and lituanuan archives did not find a birth record of him in Slonim for the date i gave them.
The marriage record says he was born in Starzynki in the governorate of Minsk, but there are many cities with this name ... I didn't investigate this lead yet.
Regarding his son Ksawery (Franciszek Ksawery actually, he had the same name as his father), it's him, his wife and two of his children indeed. He was a polish engineer who obtained his diploma in France and moved to Peru. With other polish engineers, he developped railways in the country. He came back to France in 1895 (it's the document you found). You can see other informations in the article about him in wikipedia (polish, spanish, or french version that i made few days ago Sadly there's not an english version, but i will try to do it someday).
I think i will first translate all of Franciszek Ksawery's (senior) children birth records, and also the two marriage records you found in Grodno. Then i will see what i got ...
_________________
https://gw.geneanet.org/myriasth?lang=fr&n=wakulski&oc=0&p=franciszek+ksawery&type=tree
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SophiaPO Top Contributor
Joined: 05 Oct 2014
Replies: 1147
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Posted: Fri Sep 20, 2024 7:44 am
Post subject:
For translations of Polish documents, go here
https://forum.polishorigins.com/viewtopic.php?p=70220#70220
and under the words "Quick Reply" you can add your request. The Polish translations thread is one very long thread with requests from many people, so it may take some time before your request is looked at. It is most helpful to the translators if you give a link to the document so they can see it clearly, because sometimes when you post only an image of a document it can be hard to read. Then, just keep checking over the next several days to see if your request got an answer.
Sophia
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BarbOsloPO Top Contributor
Joined: 19 Nov 2022
Replies: 1127
Location: NorwayBack to top |
Posted: Sun Sep 22, 2024 2:25 pm
Post subject:
Hi Yvan
Linking you birth record for one of the children of Franciszek Ksawery Wakulski and Katarzyna Parazinska. In your tree his name is Ignacy Wakulski.
https://metryki.genealodzy.pl/index.php?op=pg&id=512&se=&sy=1836&kt=1&plik=076-081.jpg&x=1899&y=1349&zoom=1.5
Ignacy Piotr Wakulski was born on August 1st, 1836 in Działoszyn and died on January 12th, 1877 in Warszawa-Praga.
And back to Sophia's post about the late marriage of Franciszek Ksawery and Katarzyna. I have something interesting to add. In the birth record of Roman (born in 1840), I could read that "newborn child is his (Franciszek Ksawery) and unmarried Katarzyna Parazinska" In all other children's birth records she is mentioned as his wife.
Regards,
-Barb
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Myriasth
Joined: 15 Sep 2024
Replies: 23
Location: FranceBack to top |
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Myriasth
Joined: 15 Sep 2024
Replies: 23
Location: FranceBack to top |
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BarbOsloPO Top Contributor
Joined: 19 Nov 2022
Replies: 1127
Location: NorwayBack to top |
Posted: Sat Sep 28, 2024 10:02 am
Post subject:
Hi,
The child (Romuald) died in Gostynin on October 5th, 1841 at 6 a.m. It is stated that he was not quite a year old. Do you know his year of birth? The age is written in a strange way.
The link to your tree doesn't work!
-Barb
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Myriasth
Joined: 15 Sep 2024
Replies: 23
Location: FranceBack to top |
Posted: Sat Sep 28, 2024 10:18 am
Post subject:
| BarbOslo wrote: | Hi,
The child (Romuald) died in Gostynin on October 5th, 1841 at 6 a.m. I disagree with the person who made the index about the age of the deceased. It is stated that he was not quite a year old. Do you know his year of birth? The age is written in a strange way.
The link to your tree doesn't work!
-Barb |
Hello Barb
I don't know his year of birth. I thought his age below 1 year old was right because the next child is Franciszek Wakulski and he's born in Gostynin in 1842. However, all of the previous children were born in Dzialoszyn bewteen 1835 and 1840 (except the first one, Natalia Josefa, born in Blonie in 1833).
You can see their place of birth in my tree (i changed the link, see if it works now ...)
_________________
https://gw.geneanet.org/myriasth?lang=fr&n=wakulski&oc=0&p=franciszek+ksawery&type=tree
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BarbOsloPO Top Contributor
Joined: 19 Nov 2022
Replies: 1127
Location: NorwayBack to top |
Posted: Sat Sep 28, 2024 10:30 am
Post subject:
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