Forum | PolishOrigins :: View topic - Translation of name needed

Author

Message

jfbjax

Joined: 24 Dec 2014
Replies: 12

Back to top

Posted: Wed Apr 15, 2015 3:04 pm Post subject: Translation of name needed

I am unable to decipher the name shown on my grandfather's immigration records. Could somebody give me a clue? I'd greatly appreciate it!

Scan_20150414 (4).jpg

Description:

Can some one please decipher this signature. It's from my grandfather's immigration records and indicates the name of his father. Will greatly appreciate help again!

Filesize:

28.32 KB

Viewed:

13145 Time(s)

Magroski49
Guest

Back to top

Posted: Wed Apr 15, 2015 4:45 pm Post subject: Re: Translation of name needed

jfbjax wrote:

I am unable to decipher the name shown on my grandfather's immigration records. Could somebody give me a clue? I'd greatly appreciate it!

It is Jan.

Gilberto

jfbjax

Joined: 24 Dec 2014
Replies: 12

Back to top

Posted: Thu Apr 16, 2015 4:34 am Post subject:

Thanks, but what about the last name? Question

Magroski49
Guest

Back to top

Posted: Thu Apr 16, 2015 5:42 am Post subject:

jfbjax wrote:

Thanks, but what about the last name? Question

Could you upload the entire image so that we can compare letters? The way it is I can only see it ends -owski.

Gilberto

jfbjax

Joined: 24 Dec 2014
Replies: 12

Back to top

Posted: Thu Apr 16, 2015 1:31 pm Post subject: Fabian Oskierko

Your wish is my command. I can see this clearly on my computer, I just don't know if you can.

Scan_20150414.jpg

Description:

Filesize:

1.53 MB

Viewed:

13149 Time(s)

Scan_20150414.jpg

Description:

This is both pages of the manifest. Hope it helps! I truly appreciate your time on this!

Filesize:

1.53 MB

Viewed:

13149 Time(s)

jfbjax

Joined: 24 Dec 2014
Replies: 12

Back to top

Posted: Thu Apr 16, 2015 1:41 pm Post subject: I cut it down a little and hopefully it's clearer.

Trying to make it clearer for you.

Scan_20150414 (6).jpg

Description:

Filesize:

562.77 KB

Viewed:

13149 Time(s)

Scan_20150414.jpg

Description:

Clearer?

Filesize:

1.22 MB

Viewed:

13149 Time(s)

Magroski49
Guest

Back to top

Posted: Thu Apr 16, 2015 6:02 pm Post subject: Re: Fabian Oskierko

jfbjax wrote:

Your wish is my command. I can see this clearly on my computer, I just don't know if you can.

Hi,

Since I could not read it in the german manifest (even magnifying it) I tried to find him in EI database.
There I found him listed as Jan Geriewosowski.
Couldn't find any Geriewosowski ou Gerienosowki.
The german manifest lists his place as Kalisz; the american one read Stancziza (should be Stanczyce, but I couldn't find the place).

I'll dig a bit more to see if I find something.

Gilberto

jan.jpg

Description:

Filesize:

142.48 KB

Viewed:

13149 Time(s)

Elzbieta Porteneuve
PO Top Contributor

Joined: 09 Nov 2012
Replies: 3098
Location: Paris, France
Back to top

Posted: Thu Apr 16, 2015 7:14 pm Post subject:

Jfbjax, Gilberto,

Jumping in your conversation.

The big scan helps, because it makes clear that it starts with G, and no "y" or "j" (capital K of the name below Keyman touches G-name).

The SS Albano list http://polishorigins.com/forum/files/jan_768.jpg gives: Jan Goniewosowski, I don't see etymology in Polish.

Now looking once more on the big scan http://polishorigins.com/forum/files/scan_20150414_194.jpg I read Gniewosowski (no "o").

One step more, and we have etymology: Gniewoszowski

http://sjp.pwn.pl/slowniki/gniewoszowski.html : od Gniewoszów,
see http://pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gniewosz (first name Gniewomir, a kind of snake Coronella austriaca, mountain name in Góry Bystrzyckie, name of a beer)

Best,
Elzbieta

jfbjax

Joined: 24 Dec 2014
Replies: 12

Back to top

Posted: Thu Apr 16, 2015 7:22 pm Post subject:

I can't wait to hear what you find out. I have been trying to find a record of him for 20 years and been unsuccessful. Now I may know why. But why would he change his name to Oskierko? I think there is a good deal more to this story. He said he was very poor and lived and was raised in the Jewish section of Nieswicz, but I haven't found anything there. I have found a man named Ghyerasim Oskerko there on the Dumas list of 1906. His house on Svyerzhyenskay St. was described as ramshackle and having no value! There are several Oskerkos on that list in that town. Ivan, Kashmir, Osip and Vitaol'd Ferdinandov in Slutsk. We thought his name was Julian or Julius. Not knowing how Ghyerasim is pronounced or what it means,,, I wonder if it could be him. This manifest note makes me wonder if he made the story of his life up! I haven't found anything connecting him to a multitude of Oskierkos.( Jan, Michal or Alexander). The stories he told match up to what some of them experienced in their lives..He has half brother, John and one named Nick. Fabians mother died when he was 4-5 And father remarried. I hope I haven't lost you with all this additional info! I'll stop now and let you breathe!

jfbjax

Joined: 24 Dec 2014
Replies: 12

Back to top

Posted: Thu Apr 16, 2015 7:27 pm Post subject:

Elizabeth..Have seen your name on many posts and thank you for jumping in!

jfbjax

Joined: 24 Dec 2014
Replies: 12

Back to top

Posted: Thu Apr 16, 2015 7:51 pm Post subject:

Let me muddle the waters again. On translation I have of his Russian army discharge in 1900, his name is indicated as: Oskierko Fabiyan'Y'ul'yanovich. I have the details of his military regiment if that helps.

Elzbieta Porteneuve
PO Top Contributor

Joined: 09 Nov 2012
Replies: 3098
Location: Paris, France
Back to top

Posted: Fri Apr 17, 2015 4:23 am Post subject:

jfbjax wrote:

Let's organize a little this information. In addition to everything, we have here some noise of différent transliterations from Cyrillic to Latin.

1. Oskierko Fabiyan'Y'ul'yanovich

The given name Fabian?
This list of given names and equivalences will help us:
http://pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Odpowiedniki_imion_w_r%C3%B3%C5%BCnych_j%C4%99zykach
Fabian
Фабиан (Russian)
Фабіан (Ukrainian)

The second component Y'ul'yanovich?
First idea: Julianowicz, son of Julian, suffix -owicz very much used in Slavic languages to say "son of"
Julian
The same above list of equivalences
Юлиан (Russian)
Юліан (Ukrainian)
But also:
Ульян (as in Lenin's full name: Владимир Ильич Ульянов)

In summary: Fabian Julianowicz (son of Julian) Oskierko

2. Nieswicz
It is in Volynia, Wolyn, today in Ukraina
http://wolyn.ovh.org/spis/n.html
Polish names:
Nieświcz, Czaruków, Łuck
http://pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/%C5%81uck

3. Svyerzhyenskay St.
His house on Svyerzhyenskay St. was described as ramshackle and having no value!
It was his house, and had a value for him.

My ear-translation is:
Świerzyńska, ulica Świerzyńska

4. Ghyerasim?
Sounds like Polish Gerazym, old name of Greek origin, meaning "old" or "worthy", spelled (for Polish ears) like Harasym
http://pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gerazym

Gerazym
Tha same above equivalences list:
Герасим (Russian and Ukrainian alike)

5. "Dumas" is Duma
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_legislative_election,_1906
Lower chamber of Russian Legislative Assembly
http://pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wybory_parlamentarne_w_Rosji_w_1906_roku

That's all I can digg in.

Best,
Elzbieta

Elzbieta Porteneuve
PO Top Contributor

Joined: 09 Nov 2012
Replies: 3098
Location: Paris, France
Back to top

Posted: Fri Apr 17, 2015 10:34 am Post subject: Re: Translation of name needed

jfbjax wrote:

I am unable to decipher the name shown on my grandfather's immigration records. Could somebody give me a clue? I'd greatly appreciate it!

I would like to understand your question.
Are you searching for:
Oskierko (on the manifest: Fabian Oskierko, 23 years old, from Rudawka)
or for:
~Gniewoszowski (on the manifest: Jan ~Gniewoszowski, 32 years old, from Kalisz)

==
In the meantime, more diggs with Oskierko.
==

6.
https://familysearch.org/search/collection/results?count=20&query=%2Bsurname%3AOskerko&collection_id=1368704
and Oskierko

3+1 persons from Rudawki, in 1903 Fabian, 9 years later Iwan, and 10 years later the same day Alexandra and Jozeph.

==
Fabian Oskerko
Rudawki
immigration: 22 décembre 1903
==
Alexandra Oskerko
Rudawky, Russia
immigration: 25 juin 1913
==
Joseph Oskerko
Rudawky, Russia
immigration: 25 juin 1913
==
Iwan Oskerko
Rudawki, Russia
immigration: 8 juillet 1912
==

7. Rudawka – but which one?
On today map of Poland, there are two “clusters” of Rudawka’s, one near the borders with Lithuania and Belarus, and one in former Galicia. All Ellis Island records with Rudawka indicate Russia, so it is not Galicia, but could be either North-East of today Poland, or Belarus or Lithuania.

Four Rudawka in today Poland, North-East:
==
Rudawka
238 osób
woj. podlaskie
pow. augustowski
gmina Płaska
==
Rudawka
45 osób
woj. podlaskie
pow. sejneński
gmina Krasnopol
==
Rudawka
168 osób
woj. podlaskie
pow. sokólski
gmina Janów
==
Rudawka
woj. podlaskie
pow. hajnowski
gmina Kleszczele
==

Rudawka in old geography book:
http://dir.icm.edu.pl/Slownik_geograficzny/Tom_IX/904
1), 2), 3),
http://dir.icm.edu.pl/Slownik_geograficzny/Tom_IX/905
left side, the first Rudawka is about river name, the second Rudawka:1) to 6)

1) Augustowski // Poland
2) Suwalski // Poland
3) Kalwaryjski, gmina i parafia Krasne // Lithuania
--
1) Powiat dziśnieński // Lithuania, http://pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Powiat_dzi%C5%9Bnie%C5%84ski
2) Wilejka, powiat wilejski // partly Belarus, http://pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Powiat_wilejski
3) powiat nowogrodzki // Belarus, http://pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Powiat_nowogr%C3%B3dzki
4) powiat słonimski // partly Belarus, http://pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Powiat_s%C5%82onimski
5) powiat sokólski // Poland
6) powiat wołkowyski // Belarus, west part in Poland http://pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Powiat_wo%C5%82kowyski

==

8. Some random search for "Rudawka, Oskierko" (warning: maybe total waste of time):

8a.
http://www.genealogia.okiem.pl/powstanies/index.php?inne_pole=Rud%C3%84
Powstanie styczniowe - lista uczestników ... // January 1863 insurrection, participants

(21545) Aleksander Oskierka vel Oskierko // rich man
Opis: (1830-1911) urodził się w zamożnej rodzinie ziemiańskiej, Władysława i Jadwigi z Gieczewiczów Oskierków, w majątku Rudaków na Polesiu.Ukończył Uniwersytet w Petersburgu, gdzie odbył obowiązkową służbę w pułku grenadierów. Jako oficer rezerwy uczestniczył w wojnie krymskiej 1853-1855. Od 1862 r. był Aleksander Oskierka członkiem kierownictwa konspiracyjnej "organizacji obywatelskiej". W 1863 r. wszedł do komitetu "białych" na Litwie, następnie został powołany do Wydziału Zarządzającego Prowincjami Litwy (powstańczego rządu na Litwie), gdzie powierzono mu sprawy wojskowe. W konspiracji powstańczej pełnił także obowiązki cywilnego naczelnika miasta Wilna. Po denuncjacji i aresztowaniu został skazany na karę śmierci, którą zamieniono,Manifestem carskim katorga została skrócona o połowę.
źródło: Sybiracy w dziejach Nałęczowa

8b.
http://linia-polnocna.internetdsl.pl/SGKP/litera_N.html
line "Neuburskie Dobra na Litwie" // how Oskierko were getting rich
... Gdy księżna Ludwika-Karolina umarła w 1695 r., właścicielką dóbr N. została jedyna jej córka Elżbieta - Augusta pod kuratelą palatyna ojca, z ramienia którego zarządzali niemi, i nadużywając zaufania bogacili się Oskierko i Niezabitowski (ob. Pamiętniki Matuszewicza, t. I: 75).

9. Search in Geneteka database:

Search for Oskierko, then select "Podlaskie". Answer with 8 birth, 1 death, 6 marriage
Half a dozen in Barglów - Barglów is very close to Augustów, and, therefore close to all 4 Rudawka in the North-East of today Poland.
My URL:
http://www.geneteka.genealodzy.pl/index.php?rid=A&from_date=&to_date=&search_lastname=Oskierko&search_lastname2=&rpp1=0&bdm=B&w=10pl&op=gt&lang=pol

Interesting: the death record indicate for Ewa Harasim another name Oskierko (remember item 4. Gerazym aka Harasym), spouse Harasim born Oskierko. Please have a look on all 15 names in above URL.

1868 204 Ewa Harasim [inne nazwiska: Oskierko] NN NN NN Bargłów [Miejscowość: Bargłów Uwagi: Harasim z d. Oskierko wiek 80 miejscowość Wólka] [Indeks dodał Croizet_Anna]

==

Best,
Elzbieta

jfbjax

Joined: 24 Dec 2014
Replies: 12

Back to top

Posted: Fri Apr 17, 2015 1:51 pm Post subject:

You've given me a lot of homework! You have located things I have never been able to find, I will keep you posted. thank you so much for your efforts!

jfbjax

Joined: 24 Dec 2014
Replies: 12

Back to top

Posted: Fri Apr 17, 2015 11:40 pm Post subject:

Ewa couldn't be Fabians nother because she died before he was born IF Julian was his father where is he? Who were his parents? Who was Fabian born to. But Michal ands Alexander were dead before he was born
So, where is Julian hiding? Is there a Rudawki near nieswiczh? Minsk? I'm confused. Sure wish I could see all the names on the lists, but how?

PolishOrigins Forum