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Kmichael8

Joined: 28 Dec 2016
Replies: 548

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Posted: Thu Jan 18, 2024 8:00 am Post subject:

Jesper wrote:

Hello.
Ok. Thanks again for your valuable help. Maybe it is not likely to find the specific house but still it narrows down to only three houses in Southern Poland is very exciting. I looked in Google maps,unfortunately no street view of the village but the satellite view presumes it is quite a small village.

I am trying to figure out whether or not Martha moved to Berlin by herself when she was older or younger with the parents. Also, is it possible to find out about any siblings of Martha or would that be on the marriage certificate already if any existed do you think?

Thanks Jesper

Hello Jesper

Maybe it is not likely to find the specific house but still it narrows down to only three houses in Southern Poland is very exciting. I looked in Google maps, unfortunately no street view of the village but the satellite view presumes it is quite a small village.
You might have a look at the topographical map from Bechau with a scale of 1:25 000, published in 1912. The survey is from 1883 with updates until 1912, so it covers the time Maria Theresie Peche lived there. I attach a detail from the map. In the red circle you will see a group of buildings, probably the three houses, some barns and stables, forming the “Gut”. The group of houses south of the circled Gut formed the village of Korkwitz. For the complete map, please see:

http://maps.mapywig.org/m/German_maps/series/025K_TK25/5469_(3193)_Bechau_1912_UW.jpg

I am trying to figure out whether or not Martha moved to Berlin by herself when she was older or younger with the parents.
When she married in 1929 Martha was a housemaid [Hausgehilfin] in the villa colony [Villenkolonie] Lichterfelde. A quite typical situation for a young woman after migrating from the country into the city in the early 20. Century. Hence I would assume she moved to Berlin by herself.

For additional information you might have a look at the Berlin Former Residents Registration Card Index:

https://landesarchiv-berlin.de/en/berlin-former-residents-registration-card-index

and at the Berlin Address Directories 1799-1970:

https://digital.zlb.de/viewer/berliner-adressbuecher/

Also, is it possible to find out about any siblings of Martha or would that be on the marriage certificate already if any existed do you think?
The civil registry offices added cross references about children on marriage records – unfortunately not always and predominantly on the documents of the main register, not on the copies. (If you look at the bottom of the second page of Martha’s marriage record, you will find the note of confirmation, saying this is a copy, provided by the registrar, not the main register.)
But you might find this information on the residents-registration-card from Berlin. You could also check the birth records of Reinschdorf (the civil registry office for Korkwitz) around the year 1904 and the records from Friedenthal for 1906 and later.

Best regards
Michael

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Jesper

Joined: 15 Jan 2024
Replies: 11

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Posted: Thu Jan 18, 2024 1:12 pm Post subject:

Thank you very much the additional information. Is it Friedenthal that is north or Berlin or any other Friedenthal?

I will definitely try the registration cards.

mcdonald0517
PO Top Contributor & Patron

Joined: 27 May 2012
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Posted: Wed Jan 24, 2024 4:54 pm Post subject: Please translate marriage record

Hello Michael!

It has been a long time - I hope you are well.

When you have the opportunity, please translate the attached 1817 marriage record for Johann Gottfried Kruger and Regine Lehmann (? I think). It is #7 on the page.

Thank you,
Cynthia

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Kmichael8

Joined: 28 Dec 2016
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Posted: Thu Jan 25, 2024 9:10 am Post subject: Re: Please translate marriage record

mcdonald0517 wrote:

Hello Cynthia!

Thank you for asking. Hope you are well, too.

#3 and 7 on this page summarize two entries each. I don’t know why. In the second entry of #7 some abbreviations are used, hence it might be helpful to start with a transcription. This is what I read:

jun[ior] Gottfried Krüger, angeh[ender] Büdner in Nauendorf, des Joh[ann] Gottfried
Krüger Büdners in Nauendorf ältester ehel[icher] Sohn, alt 26 J[ahre] mit Regine
Lehmann, des Halbbauers Christian Lehmann in Lüdersdorf 3te ehel[iche] Toch-
ter, alt 20 Jahr, am 17ten [Sonntag] p[ost] Trinitatis cop[uliert] von H[errn] Gebhard
in Christinendorf

Gottfried Krüger junior, soon-to-be cottager, eldest legitimate son of Johann Gottfried Krüger, cottager in Nauendorf, 26 years old, was married to Regine Lehmann, the third daughter of the half-farmer Christian Lehmann in Lüdersdorf, 20 years old, by priest Gebhard in Christinendorf on 28 September 1817.

Best regards,
Michael

mcdonald0517
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Joined: 27 May 2012
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Posted: Fri Jan 26, 2024 9:15 pm Post subject:

Hi Michael, Thank you very much for doing the translation!
Best,
Cynthia

cpkaway

Joined: 21 Jan 2024
Replies: 25
Location: Canada
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Posted: Tue Feb 06, 2024 3:41 pm Post subject: 1854 Nizankowice (Galicia) Birth

I would be very grateful if someone could help me with the attached birth/baptism record from Nizankowice, Galicia. It is a 1907 copy of the 1854 original. As you can see most of it is in Latin (which is readable) but the occupations of the father (1) and the godfather (2) are in German.

They were both in the Austrian kaiserlich-königliche army. I believe the rank of the godfather is "Ober luitenant" (sic Leutnant), but I am at a loss for the rank of the parent.

The ranks are the only pieces of the documents I need help with.

Thank you in advance.

Chris

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Kmichael8

Joined: 28 Dec 2016
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Posted: Wed Feb 07, 2024 6:34 am Post subject: Re: 1854 Nizankowice (Galicia) Birth

cpkaway wrote:

Hi Chris,

Anton, the father, was “k.k. Steuer-Einnehmer” (tax collector). The godfather Xaver was - as you already found out – “k.k. Oberleitenant”.

Best
Michael

cpkaway

Joined: 21 Jan 2024
Replies: 25
Location: Canada
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Posted: Wed Feb 07, 2024 12:20 pm Post subject: 1854 Nizankowice (Galicia) Birth

Hi Michael,

Thank you so much for your assistance. I have puzzled over this for years, not helped by my belief Anton was in the army.

Best regards
Chris

cpkaway

Joined: 21 Jan 2024
Replies: 25
Location: Canada
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Posted: Wed Feb 14, 2024 3:46 pm Post subject: Austrian Army WW1 Haupt-Grundbuchsblatt record

I am hoping someone in this group is familiar with the Austrian Army Haupt-Grundbuchsblatt records from WW1. The following items are from my uncle's record. He was in the Landwehr No. 18 Infantry Regiment.

Question 1: I cannot find the meaning anywhere of the word "beteilt".
| --- „ --- | beteilt | -- „ -- | 21/9 | mit dem handgelde v[on] 6. Kronen.(with the allowance of 6 Kronen) |

Question 2: Anyone know what the abbreviations M.K. and M.B. mean or the numbers "26/18" (18 might refer to the regiment number)?
| ------- „ ------- | zugeteilt (appointed) | -- „ -- | 21./12. | zur 1 M.K. des M.B. 26/18. (to 1 M.K. of M.B. 26/18). |

Thank you for any suggestions.

Chris

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Kmichael8

Joined: 28 Dec 2016
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Posted: Thu Feb 15, 2024 8:53 am Post subject: Re: Austrian Army WW1 Haupt-Grundbuchsblatt record

cpkaway wrote:

Hi Chris,

Question 1: I cannot find the meaning anywhere of the word "beteilt".

“beteilen” is an old Austrian verb, here it refers to “Handgeld” and might be translated as “he was provided with his hand money”.

Question 2: Anyone know what the abbreviations M.K. and M.B. mean or the numbers "26/18" (18 might refer to the regiment number)?

He was appointed to the 1st Marschkompanie of the Marschbataillon 26 (the 26th of these battalions) destined for Infanterie Regiment No. 18. A march battalion was a temporary unit made up of replacement personnel destined for the regular battalions of an infantry regiment.

Best regards,
Michael

cpkaway

Joined: 21 Jan 2024
Replies: 25
Location: Canada
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Posted: Thu Feb 15, 2024 12:41 pm Post subject: Re: Austrian Army WW1 Haupt-Grundbuchsblatt record

Hi Michael,

I really appreciate your reply. For a long time I tried to find answers to my questions before giving up. When I found this group, I thought I would try again.

This morning I came across an old email I had sent 4 years ago -

As I looked through several thousand Galician military records, I noticed the following:
On the printed Haupt-Grundbuchblatt forms used generally before 1900 there were often these three terms printed under Voranderung -
eingetheilt
prasentiert (with 2 dots over the "a")
betheilt
On the printed forms after 1900 the spelling had changed -
eingeteilt
prasentiert (with 2 dots over the "a")
beteilt
The "h" was dropped in the first and third words. If the form did not have these words pre-printed, the they were either stamped or handwritten with or without the "h" as above.

It is interesting that the spelling changed, but, one can only assume, the meaning is the same.

Does this help with the meaning of "beteilt"? Your explanation seems to make sense, regardless of the spelling, given the context.

Best regards
Chris

Kmichael8

Joined: 28 Dec 2016
Replies: 548

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Posted: Fri Feb 16, 2024 6:00 am Post subject: Re: Austrian Army WW1 Haupt-Grundbuchsblatt record

cpkaway wrote:

Hello Chris,

In 19th Century German the use of the letter “h“ was widely spread. Often but not only in combination with a “t” like in “Pathe” or “Theil” (in the noun as well as in verbs “theil” was part of, like “eintheilen”, “zutheilen”, “betheilen” and so on). You also find the “h” in other combinations like in “gebohren” or “Gefahr” for example. Around the turn of the century, the “h” disappeared. To keep things simple, of course not completely. See “Gefahr” for example. By the way, the “t” underwent a quite similar process, see “Todt/Tod” or “Stadt/Stadt” for example. Hence your four year old assumption is correct, the spelling changed, the meaning is the same.

There are two German dictionaries available online where you might find words which were in use in the 19th Century but are uncommon today, together with a description of their meaning and examples of uses. Please have a look at:

https://www.duden.de (enter “beteilen” in the field “Stichwort”)

and

https://www.dwds.de

Hope this helps.
Best regards,
Michael

Sophia
PO Top Contributor

Joined: 05 Oct 2014
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Posted: Fri Feb 16, 2024 6:17 am Post subject: Re: Austrian Army WW1 Haupt-Grundbuchsblatt record

Kmichael8 wrote:

In 19th Century German the use of the letter “h“ was widely spread. Often but not only in combination with a “t” like in “Pathe” or “Theil” (in the noun as well as in verbs “theil” was part of, like “eintheilen”, “zutheilen”, “betheilen” and so on). You also find the “h” in other combinations like in “gebohren” or “Gefahr” for example. Around the turn of the century, the “h” disappeared.

Michael

Hi Michael and Chris,
I have been following your interesting conversation.
One of my favorite examples of this 19th century "h" is the word Neanderthal. It refers, literally, to the Neander Valley. The word for valley was spelled Thal using the old spelling rules, and today it is Tal, but in the study of anthropology, Neanderthal retains its H.
Best regards,
Sophia

cpkaway

Joined: 21 Jan 2024
Replies: 25
Location: Canada
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Posted: Fri Feb 16, 2024 2:09 pm Post subject: Re: Austrian Army WW1 Haupt-Grundbuchsblatt record

Hello Michael and Sophia,

It is an interesting discussion. One wonders how the "h" was dropped from the two words (eingetheilt and betheilt). Was it an official decree from the "language bureaucrats" or just common usage which eventually become the official spelling? Of course in English there are plenty of words which could eliminate certain letters. For example, "k" (knee, know, knife).

Thank you Michael for the links.

Best regards
Chris

jajan

Joined: 12 Jan 2014
Replies: 71

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Posted: Fri Feb 23, 2024 9:31 am Post subject: Land Record in German?

Michael, Sophia, Barb and/or anyone who would like to chime in: I found this record on Family Search under images for “ Mierunsken, Oletzko, East Prussia, Prussia, Germany”.

https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3Q9M-CSP2-BQWH-K?view=explore&groupId=M9F4-TD6

It is entitled land records 1825. Would you be able to try to explain what it is, translate the headings, translate the entry for Fritz Rudzinsky/Rudzewsky (5th one down) and possibly take a guess at the last name of the entry above Fritz’s which looks like Johann P?. I would appreciate any help and have included the cover page. Thank-You, jajan.

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