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ossnhughie
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Posted: Sat Jan 02, 2016 10:30 pm Post subject: Elzbieta I think I found another ancestors record!!!

Elzbieta,

I feel so lucky as of late because and if my reading of this record is correct I found another one. This appears to be the brother of my 3rd Great Grandfather Konstanty. From what I can read it apppears he has the same parents of Konstanty: Izydor and Kunegunda (Bulat) Szymkiewicz and is from the same parish of Konstanty's 1859 marriage Szyrwinty. Here is the actual record number 98. I am so excited I hope you are able to read it.

Thanks a million.

Hugh

Izydor Szymkiewicz 1831 birth record.jpeg

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Izydor Szymkiewicz 1831 birth record.jpeg

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Elzbieta Porteneuve
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Posted: Sun Jan 03, 2016 6:32 am Post subject: Re: Elzbieta I think I found another ancestors record!!!

ossnhughie wrote:

Hugh,

Here is my Sunday homework, with a lot of geography ...
Please note there is no name Bulat in that record.
Best,
Elzbieta

==

==PO269:
http://polishorigins.com/forum/files/izydor_szymkiewicz_1831_birth_record_208.jpeg
Table Baptism form in Polish, from Roman Catholic parish in (Szyrwinty)
NOTE: parish Szyrwinty – very important to state so, as the land of Birże from that time was covering significant part of today’s Lithuania

Column1: N (Numer) // chronological number
Column2: Daty // data=date; daty=plural, here 2 dates, left: Urodzenia=birth, right: Chrztu=baptism
Column3: Kiedy? Gdzie? Kto i od kogo? Z samej wody, czyli tez z ss (swietych) olejow ochrzczony?
// When? Where? Who and from whom? Baptized with the water only, or also the saints oils?
Column4: Jakich rodzicow? Kiedy i gdzie, to jest: w jakiej parafii urodzil sie?
// Which parents? When and where, i.e.: in which parish was he born?
Column5: Kto trzymal do chrztu? To jest: kto byli kumami i kto assystowal mianowicie?
// Who was holding for baptism? i.e.: who were godparents and who assisted, who is that?

First line in the Table, Column2: 1831, miesiaca listopada // month of November 1831
Left margin, vertical note, one name per record: 97 Wiszienow 98 Szymkiewiczow 99 Mikolewiczow 100 Janusziow

C1: 98
C2: 25 (birth day) 29 (baptism day) // of November 1831
C3: Roku 1831, miesiaca listopada, dnia 29 w tymze parafialnym kosciele ochrzczono z wody i swieconych olejow niemowle imieniem Izydor przez tegoz X. J.Wiselkiewicza? // On 29 November 1831 have been baptised with water and holy oils the child named Izydor, by priest J.Wiselkiewicz
C4: z urodzonych Izydora i Kunegundy z Urczynow Szymkiewiczow slubnych malzonkow syn, dnia 25 tegoz miesiaca w tej parafii, w zascianku Birży narodzony // son of well born (plural) Izydor and Kunegunda born Urczyn, legitimate spouses Szymkiewicz, born on 25 of current month in this parish, in [zascianek] of Birże
C5: trzymali do chrztu urodzony Michal Urbanowicz z Marianna, urodzonego Antoniego Michalowskiego malzonka // godparents were well-born Michal Urbanowicz with Marianna [Michalowska], spouse of well born Antoni Michalowski

NOTE: geography
Birże
https://pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bir%C5%BCe
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bir%C5%BEai

Birże litewskie, with 5 long pages in the old geography book:
http://dir.icm.edu.pl/Slownik_geograficzny/Tom_I/233
right side in French “Carte géographique du Duché de Birże, bien héréditaires de L.L.A.A. les Princes de Radziwiłł, situé dans le district d’Upita, ceux de Wiłkomierz, Kowno et dans le duché de Samogitie, faite l’an 1786 au mois de Juin“
Nice text about Duchy of Samogitia:
http://www.wikiwand.com/en/Duchy_of_Samogitia

Wiłkomierz lithuanian Ukmergė
https://pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wi%C5%82komierz

Powiat_poniewieski, Poniewież
https://pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Powiat_poniewieski
http://dir.icm.edu.pl/pl/Slownik_geograficzny/Tom_VIII/772

Search for French map, found Birze in the book dated MDCLXXXIII = 1683, donated to the library in 1789, cf. attached Wilno-Kowno-Birze-map-from-geography-book-1683.jpg – looks like Birze was in the same category as Warsaw at that time (same font size).

Google Maps not showing anymore Polish-Lithuanian equivalents:
https://www.google.fr/maps/dir/Kowno,+Kaunas+County,+Lithuania/Wilno,+Vilnius+County,+Lithuania/Wiłkomierz+Ukmergė,+Lithuania/Upita,+Panevėžys+County,+Lithuania/Birże,+Panevėžys+County
Lithuania/Szyrwinty,+Vilnius+County,

Birże
http://kresy.genealodzy.pl/zbior/poniewiez.djvu page 4 / 84, the name Birże in Cyrillic Биржи is underligned

==

Wilno-Szyrwinty-Wilkomierz-Upita-Poniewiez-Birze.JPG

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ossnhughie
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Posted: Sun Jan 03, 2016 8:19 am Post subject: Thank You Elzbieta

That was a lot of work you did finding the village and it was way up there almost out of modern day Lithuania. They must have moved there because it is hard to picture going all that distance for the purpose of a baptism. I really thought this might be the right family and the names all seem to match with the exception of Kunegunda's maiden name. The Russian record in 1859 for her son Konstanty clearly says Bulot or Bulat.

The other interesting piece of information is that there are two other records I submitted to the Latin records forum last night that are from the same Szrwinty baptism book. I couldn't make them out completely but there are two other sons from what appears to the be 1820 (Franciszek) and 1826 (Konstanty) birth books. From what I could make out whilst looking at the records both Konstanty and Fraciszeks parents are listed as Izydor and Kunegunda Szymkiewicz but the maiden name of Kunegunda seems to be different on each record.

This is where it is interesting.

Chronoloically the data at hand seems to indicate these facts (Awaiting complete latin translation of (Franciszek and Konstanty)

-1820 Franciszek Szymkiewicz baptized in Szyrwinty Parish s/o Izydor and Kunegunda.

-1826 Konstanty Szymkiewicz baptized in Szyrwinty Parish s/o Izydor and Kunegunda.

-1831 Izydor Szymkiewicz baptized in Szyrwinty Parish s/o Izydor and Kunegunda.

-1859 Konstanty Szymkiewicz s/o Izydor and Kunegunda (Bulat) Szymkiewicz marries in Mejszagola Julia Dowiat. Konstanty listed as 30 years old noble from Winciun Szyrwinty parish.

I am thinking despite apparent discrepancies in Kunegunda's Maiden name that the area and age of Konstanty are fairly close so now it's a matter of sorting out if these are the same people. Hopefully Latin translations come through and clarify or bring new info to light.

Very confusing.

Hugh
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Litwo! Ojczyzno moja! ty jesteś jak zdrowie;
Ile cię trzeba cenić, ten tylko się dowie, Kto cię stracił.

ossnhughie
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Posted: Mon Jan 04, 2016 12:55 am Post subject: Elzbieta will these death records help clear things up

Dear Elzbieta,

I have found in the Szyrwinty death registers from 1839 to 1848 what appears to be the death records of Izydor and Kunegunda Szymkiewicz. I am hopig your translation can clear up if They were in fact the parents of Franciszek, Konstanty (My 3rd great grandfather) and Izydor.

Here they are:

Izydor: #59 http://www.epaveldas.lt/vbspi/biRecord. ... 680&psl=45

Kunegunda: #95 http://www.epaveldas.lt/vbspi/biRecord. ... 80&psl=119

Thanks a million,

Hugh

ps- I just realized I haven't entered this in the normal queue for translations, my excitement got the better of me Smile

pps- I added photos of actual documents to make it easier.

Kunegunda Szymkiewicz death record.jpeg

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Izydor Szymkiewicz Sr. Death record.jpeg

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Izydor Szymkiewicz Sr. Death record.jpeg

_________________
Litwo! Ojczyzno moja! ty jesteś jak zdrowie;
Ile cię trzeba cenić, ten tylko się dowie, Kto cię stracił.

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