Posted: Wed Mar 23, 2016 8:58 am
Post subject: Czeinego...
At least that is what they wrote it as.
I am able to find my great grandmother in the Ellis Island records. Her name is Franziska Kowalsuska (arrived July 1897). Her last residence is "Czeinego"
For the past 10 years I have tried to understand what or where that is. This is the spelling on the Ellis Island website and when I purchased the records from the city of Hamburg they stated "Czernego". I do believe it is Eastern Poland/Russia as census records state Russia along with Poland for the family. Can anyone help get me to the right place? I have no clue if this is a village or district even...
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Cheri Vanden BergPO Top Contributor & Patron
Joined: 16 Oct 2011
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Posted: Wed Mar 23, 2016 1:21 pm
Post subject:
Hi,
I looked at the manifest, and I guess I see the same thing that whoever indexed it saw - Czeinego. I searched for Czeinego and Czernego, and I'm sure that you know I didn't find a village with that name. Looks like Czernego is a surname though. I went to the Steve Morse gold form and looked at anyone who had a surname started with Kowals who was from a village starting with Cze. I saw some from Czernigow, which also doesn't appear to be a village, but it does look that way on the manifest. I did find a village named Czerniejów which is on the maps. It's about 15 km south of Lublin. To know with more certainty I'd ask, what else do you know? She was going to her husband Franciszek, have you found a ship manifest or naturalization records for him, death records, etc.?
Cheri
P.S. I just looked to see if there would be anyone from Czerniejow on the Stephen Morse site, and there was only one: Watiakiewicz, Franz Czerniejow, Lublin, Russia 29 1882-1883 1912
Looking at his manifest, I could see how when the e is close to the j an indexer could think it was a g, so I do believe that Czernigow should be Czerniejów. Also Czerniejów was in the Russian partition...
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Posted: Wed Mar 23, 2016 2:24 pm
Post subject:
Thanks for the reply Cheri.
According to the 1900 census, Franciszek stated he had been in America for 10 years. I have not found a record that would be him for certain. I do have a headstone, but the church records did not give a place of birth and the state archive has not found a death certificate. Oddly enough I even have a bill for the funeral services that is written in Polish. I have a few hits for naturalization records for Suffolk County on Long Island. All it stated that the person was renouncing citizenship to the Czar of Russia. I have even tried to trace Martin Zenda who appears to be traveling from the same village and could have been helping my great-grandmother and young daughter.
As a last effort I tried to get the death certificate for Marianna the daughter. Yet since I am not a direct ancestor and she had no children that is known, I can not get the certificate for another 20 years last time I did the math.
I have always wondered how bad is bad to leave your wife an infant daughter and it take over 5 years before Franciszek could bring them to New York. to join him.
~Sunny
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Posted: Wed Mar 23, 2016 4:16 pm
Post subject:
Hi, Sunny and Cheri
I believe the surname is misspelled either. I could not find in herby.com.pl or janusz stankiewicz etymologie nazwisko. Also, not any record in Geneteka.
Gilberto
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Posted: Wed Mar 23, 2016 4:57 pm
Post subject:
Well the last name has been spelled a few ways in my research. All spellings came out to a soundex of K142. Franciszek (my great-grandfather) has a few different spellings per each census record I find. Franzista (my great-grandmother) has the spelling from Ellis Island.
I know from oral family history and census records the "V" was once a "W". When I get back to my files I can find the spelling that is on his gravestone in Long Island.
Try spelling it Kowalski...
Thanks for everyone's assistance
~Sunny
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Cheri Vanden BergPO Top Contributor & Patron
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Posted: Wed Mar 23, 2016 10:35 pm
Post subject:
Yes, Gilberto, Kowalsuska, as indexed at Ellis Island, didn't show up on the Polish surname map. Ancestry has the surname indexed as Kowalowka, which doesn't show up on the map either. I then found that Kowalowska was a rare surname, and Kowalewska is a very popular surname. Sunny, those surnames were never used for your great grandparents? I thought maybe not, because the Soundex code for them would be K420, and you said the surnames you had were K142. I'm attaching her name from the manifest. Earlier I thought maybe it was supposed to be Kowalska, but as written it looks like there are a couple more letters between the l and the s??
Cheri
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Posted: Thu Mar 24, 2016 4:37 am
Post subject:
| Cheri Vanden Berg wrote: | Yes, Gilberto, Kowalsuska, as indexed at Ellis Island, didn't show up on the Polish surname map. Ancestry has the surname indexed as Kowalowka, which doesn't show up on the map either. I then found that Kowalowska was a rare surname, and Kowalewska is a very popular surname. Sunny, those surnames were never used for your great grandparents? I thought maybe not, because the Soundex code for them would be K420, and you said the surnames you had were K142. I'm attaching her name from the manifest. Earlier I thought maybe it was supposed to be Kowalska, but as written it looks like there are a couple more letters between the l and the s??
Cheri |
Cheri,
The way it was written it seems Kowalewska, or Kowalenska (didn't check if this spelling exists).
Yesterday, I checked SGKP for Czarnego and Czernego. No luck.
Gilberto
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Posted: Thu Mar 24, 2016 8:24 am
Post subject:
My ggfather's headstone reads as
Frantisek Kovalewski
zom. 30 MAJA 1923
U VERK 60 LAT
The 1910 census it's Kovelski
I forgot the 1920 index spelling
There are 2 good candidates for naturalization in Suffolk, NY-
Both are Kowaleski...
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Posted: Thu Mar 24, 2016 8:32 am
Post subject:
| Sunhoney wrote: | My ggfather's headstone reads as
Frantisek Kovalewski
zom. 30 MAJA 1923
U VERK 60 LAT
The 1910 census it's Kovelski
I forgot the 1920 index spelling
There are 2 good candidates for naturalization in Suffolk, NY-
Both are Kowaleski... |
This morning I checked Geneteka for a birth between 1890-1891 for Marianna Kowalewska and Kowalewski. I found some, but none had a mother named Franciszka. These names and surnames are pretty much common. Do you know Franciszka's husband's name? We could look for her marriage before 1891 (back to 1885, for instance).
Gilberto
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Cheri Vanden BergPO Top Contributor & Patron
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Posted: Thu Mar 24, 2016 9:58 am
Post subject:
Gilberto,
Franciszka's husband's name was Franciszek. She named him on the ship manifest, but it was spelled Franzisok. Sunny said his name on his gravestone was Frantisek.
Cheri
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Cheri Vanden BergPO Top Contributor & Patron
Joined: 16 Oct 2011
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Posted: Thu Mar 24, 2016 11:20 am
Post subject:
Sunny, you probably have all this information, but I was just trying to narrow down the year that "Frantisek" would have become a citizen. I now have seen "Frank" in every census year in the states. In 1900 indexed at Ancestry as Korelski, 1910 Kanelmalski, 1915 Kovaleski, 1920 Kowelski, and his wife "Frances" in 1925 Kovaleski. I noticed that in 1910 there was no immigration or naturalization written at all for either of them. In 1900 it said that Frank was an alien. In the 1915 NY state census it said that he was a citizen. In 1920 it said that he was naturalized in 1895. So there are some inconsistencies. One thing that stayed the same was that in 1900, 1915, and 1920 he said he immigrated in 1890. In 1900 it said that Frank and Francis were married for 14 years. In 1910 it said they were married 20 years. In 1910 there was a 2 after M for married for Frank indicating he had been married before. There was an M 1 for Francis. In 1925 it said that Francis was a citizen, and there was a note that said "husband's papers". That would be right, because if he became a citizen before woman were granted the right to vote, she would have become a citizen as well.
Cheri
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Cheri Vanden BergPO Top Contributor & Patron
Joined: 16 Oct 2011
Replies: 504
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Posted: Thu Mar 24, 2016 11:53 am
Post subject:
Sunny, Did Marianna marry? If so, do you know what church it might have been? Her town of baptism would have been written in the marriage records in either the marriage entry book, or marriage banns. The church should have that information.
Cheri
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Posted: Thu Mar 24, 2016 3:19 pm
Post subject:
I do not know where or when Marianna was married. I do know that she was married twice. There is no record at the family church (St. Patrick's RCC) in East Islip, New York. I know from her headstone that she was born 20 February 1889 and this matches the 1900 census. She was married by 1910 as she was not in her father's house and was with her 1st husband in New Jersey along with one of her brothers.
As for my ggmother, She remarried 2 years after the death of my ggrandfather. The records at St. Patrick's gave the first name of her parents (but not a place of birth in Poland). Her name in that register was listed as Frances Kovalska and she is the daughter of Francis & Catherine.
~Sunny
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Cheri Vanden BergPO Top Contributor & Patron
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Posted: Thu Mar 24, 2016 4:49 pm
Post subject:
Sunny,
I just want to point this out in case Gilberto is coming across any marriage record that could be of Franciszek and Franciszka. They might have been married 14 years in 1900 like it says in the census. In the 1900 census it says that Marianna was born in May 1887, so I wonder if that could be correct. It did not have the correct birth years for Frank and Frances. It said 1870 for both of them, and the birth month was unknown. I have read that back then people did not celebrate their birthdays like we do, and many people have come across multiple birth dates on records. Recently, on another list, there were comments about relatives being younger on ship manifests because the rates were cheaper.
When I wrote to the church where my grandparents married, they told me that they did not have the villages where they were born (I have that information now). Also, I've seen enough Chicago marriage records at Family Search to know that sometimes the village was written in the record book, and sometimes it wasn't. So when I read posts where people are told to get the marriage record, I would think that it was not always that simple...Recently someone insisted that the church collects that information, though it might not be written in the actual record. It could be in the marriage banns book. You might want to ask about that. Also, I don't know what information was collected in NY on the application for a marriage license, but that might be worth a try for Frances' second marriage.
I don't know if this could be the case for your great grandfather, but some men did go back to Poland (to a partition) in between the years when they first came, and the rest of the family emigrated. Seven or eight years seems like it would have been an eternity before they would see each other again...
Cheri
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Posted: Thu Mar 24, 2016 10:49 pm
Post subject:
I think I should try sending for my g-grandmother's second marriage record and see if they can find it. I have yet to have a positive experience with the vital records for New York. 
I have also wondered if "Frank" went back and forth between NY and Poland. It has even crossed my mind what if Martin Zenda was actually Frank. Oral history says Frank was in military service to the Czar. What if he deserted...What travel documents did a person have leaving Poland or America?
Like you stated Gilbert, there are so many Franz Kowalski and close variants to say "ah-ha, found it".
Sunny
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