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NB_Roots



Joined: 02 May 2017
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Post Posted: Tue May 02, 2017 10:49 pm      Post subject: Need help with spelling of name, Nickowol from Kamien
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I have been using ancestry.com to help trace my Polish roots, but its been tough because my Great Grandmothers maiden name seems to change every census. Other than some polish traditions and family recipes nobody in the family speaks polish. If anyone can help with just the proper spelling of the names I would be very grateful.

Jan Nickowol and Sophia Olszowy immigrated to New Bedford, Massachusetts in the Unite3d States right around 1900. A few family obituaries state they both came from Kamien Poland, although early census records state their birth place as Austria? but their language is listed as Polish though?

The name Nickowol changes over the years, I have seen it Nickowol, Nickowal, Niekowal, even Jancorla. the Jancorla threw me for a loop at first and makes no sense, but it is in deed my great grandfather when he first arrived.

Also my great grand fathers name goes from Jan, to jacob, to John.

I also have a Sophia Olswszy that starts out as Zofia Alazawa and have a favorite great uncle that was a Smagacz.

Without knowing Polish its hard to know how to keep going if I can't confirm the names. Nicokowol to Jancorla totally threw me for a loop.

Any help would be appreciated....
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Cheri Vanden Berg
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Post Posted: Wed May 03, 2017 9:01 am      Post subject:
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Niekowal is the only spelling that showed up on a somewhat recent surname distribution map http://www.moikrewni.pl/mapa/kompletny/niekowal.html
That doesn't mean that you wouldn't find the other spellings in church records. I don't know about Jancorla, although many people had nicknames that also ended up in church records, so that is one possible explanation

John is the English version of Jan.

At the time of your great grandparents birth, there was no Poland. It was divided between Austria, Germany, and Russia. IF there was more than one Kamień, you'd want to make sure it was in the former Austrian partition.

Smagacz - http://www.moikrewni.pl/mapa/kompletny/smagacz.html

Neither version of Sophia's surname showed up.
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Cheri Vanden Berg
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Post Posted: Wed May 03, 2017 9:42 am      Post subject:
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Now I have seen the names written in the Massachusetts marriage records. I'm attaching part of it to see if anyone else can help. Zofia's name is indexed as Alazawa, but it is clear to me that it starts with an O (based on the way Anna was written in the marriage record above Jan and Zofia's). Jan's name is indexed as Nickowal, but it could say Niekowal (that is how the letter e is written on this page). I see a Jan Olszowy whose marriage is on the same page - I found that curious. If you haven't already, you should get their marriage record from the church. A priest with a Polish name married them. You would want to ask for a photo copy of the actual record written in the book. It should name of the village where they were baptized in Poland.


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NB_Roots



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Post Posted: Wed May 03, 2017 10:13 am      Post subject:
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Thanks you so much for looking that up. Unfortunately that column is for farthers and mothers name. they don't seem to have crossed over and stayed behind. I feel foolish for never seeing that Sophia had a brother on the same page.

I never noticed that, I guess my great grandmother had a brother. the parents match. The Olazawa family always lived near the Niekowols, and Sophia would have needed a sponsor to come here as she wasn't married.

All the names Niekowal, Smagacz, Byk, and Dunaj show up on the surname map in the same areas. Smagacz mothers name was a Kozynoski, but that also doesn't show up on the map. If I could get modern versions of Olazawa and Kozynoski and they show up in the same regions, I think it will give me a good idea off the area they came from.

I am going to swing by the "Polish Church" today and see if I can get some info there, thanks again for all the help. It would be amazing if I could track down a town and and a departure.
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Cheri Vanden Berg
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Post Posted: Wed May 03, 2017 10:19 am      Post subject:
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Yes, before you wrote, I noticed that they were the parents names and edited my post. Maybe in the church record Zofia's name is written Olszowa (the female version of Olszowy?) Both surnames show up on the map http://www.moikrewni.pl/mapa/kompletny/olszowa.html http://www.moikrewni.pl/mapa/kompletny/olszowy.html Hope you have luck at the church!
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NB_Roots



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Post Posted: Wed May 03, 2017 10:47 am      Post subject:
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Its an old church, nobody was there today. I am amazed at how one letter makes so much difference on the surname map Smile

If I Use those maps and looking for towns with Kamień in it, and then finally the Austrian division it should narrow a region down nicely.

I am going to keep swinging by the church until I catch someone when they are in, it will be interesting if all lines up.
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Post Posted: Wed May 03, 2017 11:21 am      Post subject:
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Yes, on the surname map if a Polish surname has a diacritical mark, it will not show up unless you use it.

I think I might have only seen one Kamień that didn't have an additional name after it, but I don't know enough about Polish geography. I was lucky that both my grandparents villages only had one village by the name. It can get confusing.

This doesn't completely add up, but I found Jan Olszowy, indexed as Olszony, arriving on 21 Dec 1902, going to sister Zofia Olszowa in New Bedford, and he was from KAMIEN. The part that was weird was that he was traveling with his wife Rozalia, and he didn't marry Rozalia until 1903, right? Your great grandparents Jan and Zofia married in 1903?

When searching sometimes you need to think like an indexer. Now that you know how the names should be spelled, you still need to spell them a variety of ways, because you never know how someone read them, or in some cases, how someone might have written them down when listening to the names.
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Post Posted: Wed May 03, 2017 11:50 am      Post subject:
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If the 1920 census was the only place you saw Jancorla, my guess would be that enumerator Annie M. O'Connor did not understand the surname. That might sound far fetched, but basically they were just counting people, and they weren't concerned about family genealogists looking for these names 72 years in the future.
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NB_Roots



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Post Posted: Wed May 03, 2017 12:24 pm      Post subject:
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All that sounds about right.

I just found another sister for Sophia Olszowa in the marriage index, there was also a Agnes Olszowa married on September 25th, 1906. She has a really miss spelled farthers name, but the mother is "Mary Byk" is as clear as day. After you find her it seems to be the same farther.

The Olszowa surname just changes so often, it makes it them hard to track. I thought I might have got lucky with a naturalization record, but then it kind of disappeared when I forgot what spelling of Olszowy brought it up, but it may not have been the same Jan.

Can you explain about male and female versions of polish surnames? Does the last name change?

Ancestry.com gave me a hint on "Mary Byk"....

Poland, Roman Catholic Church Books Index, 1742-1964
Birth, Marriage & Death
Name Maria Bąk
Spouse Antoni Nietendel

But Im not ready to sign up for the extra ancestry.com world package just yet, I have a bunch of other sides of family trees I have to do first to make the most of the international features.

Tonight I am going to use the census data and try to nail down the Jan Olszowy chain of events through the street address's in the census. I found out a lot of this stuff by search the census by address as the spellings of the name keep changing.

Thanks again for all the help, its turning into a mystery I just have to figure out.
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Post Posted: Wed May 03, 2017 12:42 pm      Post subject:
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Some Polish surnames have male and female versions (none of my ancestors that I have found do). In this country, Zofia's brother's wife probably used the surname Olszowy, since generally here the wife had the same version of the surname as her husband. Sometimes I've seen on gravestones the proper ending will be there for women. Sometimes women will come through Ellis Island with the male version of the surname (maybe the authorities copied the father or husband's name). As far as the record you found goes, I don't know. Byk is a surname, and Bąk is a surname, and that diacritical mark under the a makes it sound something like on, so it would be Bonk.
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Post Posted: Wed May 03, 2017 10:12 pm      Post subject:
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I have found the Kamień that the Olszowy family was from. I found a birth record for Zophia's sister Anna in Kamień. I'll start at the beginning. I went to http://www.szukajwarchiwach.pl/ (This is the Polish State Archives site). I searched for Kamień, and clicked on the box that says only with scans. Two collections of birth records came up (Księga urodzeń - Kamień) 1890-1897 and 1897-1902. I was disappointed that the years that your great grandparents were born weren't there, but I thought I might find their parents' names in a grandchild's birth record, since the birth records have the grandparents' names. It was fortunate that I found a child's birth, because now you have Zophia's grandparents names as well.

I chose the 1890- 1897 Collection, and when it went to it, it said:
Collection: 59/1480/0 Akta stanu cywilnego Parafii Rzymskokatolickiej w Jeżowem
Which means
Collection: 59/1480/0 Civil Status Record of the Roman Catholic Parish in Jeżowe
I assume that the attended church in Jeżowe, which was very close. I've attached a map.

Here's the link to Anna's birth/baptismal record http://www.szukajwarchiwach.pl/59/1480/0/-/1/skan/full/BmI6c_3tRbCt4vKfa38kYw

I'm also going to attach the record, because maybe someone can tell you more than I know about it. It's written in Latin, including the first names.
Anna was born on March 30, 1890 in house number 588 and baptized the same day.
Antonius (Antoni) Olszowy agricola (farmer) fil (son of) Thomas (Tomasz) Olszowy et (and) Marianna (Marianna or Maria) ? Luca (Łukasz) Sabat.

I've gone through many records of my grandfather's village of Świlcza that are on this site, and they didn't include what I assume is the great grandfather. I'm not familiar with that added name - wish they were in the Świlcza records. So Thomas' wife was Marianna, and she was the daughter of Łukasz Sabat - correct me if I'm wrong anyone.

Marianna (Maria) Byk filia (daughter of) Josephi (Józef) Byk and Catharina (Katarzyna) [daughter of] Petro (Piotr) Sindak.
Underneath those names is the name of the midwife. On the far right are the names of the godparents. I think Paweł Lach and Zofia wife of Ignacy Drzymata.

Note - often woman will have the name Marianna in church records, but will be called Maria at home. The thought was the name Maria/Mary should be reserved for Jesus' mother.

Before I went to work, I might have started with the 1897-1902 years. All together I probably didn't look through more than 30 scans. I didn't run across any Niekowals, but there are many more scans to look at, and I could have missed it. The handwriting leaves a little to be desired, but I think you can tell where to look for the names. Maybe you'll run across Dunaj as well. Do you have something of Jan's that says he was from Kamień too? I'm going to send better instructions for you to navigate the online Archives. I don't think I ran across it here (I'm editing this to write that there are two examples in Anna's record where the priest separated a surname!), but in Świlcza the priest often wrote the beginning of a surname on one line, and the rest of it on the next line. I became very familiar with the surnames, but sometimes didn't even recognize my family names.



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Last edited by Cheri Vanden Berg on Thu May 04, 2017 3:05 am; edited 2 times in total
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Post Posted: Wed May 03, 2017 10:23 pm      Post subject:
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http://www.szukajwarchiwach.pl/

How to use the Polish State Archives site:
https://mikeeliasz.wordpress.com/2013/03/27/a-guide-for-using-szukajwarchiwach-pl-poradnik-polish-archive-guide-poradnik/
OR
https://familysearch.org/wiki/en/images/a/a1/How_to_Use_the_Digitized_Records_of_the_Polish_State_Archives).pdf
How to decipher the Catholic records that you find from Galicia (which Austrian Poland was part of):
https://familysearch.org/wiki/en/images/b/bf/Catholic_Vital_Records_of_Galicia-Halychyna_by_Matthew_R._Bielawa.pdf
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NB_Roots



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Post Posted: Wed May 03, 2017 11:10 pm      Post subject:
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Wow thank you, its late over here, but yes from what i was told both sides were from Kamień.

From some World War I draft cards I found some more brothers and sisters of the Nickowal's and Olzsowy's....

Farther: Joseph Nickowal
Mother: Magna Dunaj
1880 Jacob Nickowal (immigrated 1908)
1866 Jan Nickowal (Immigrated 1901)
more ???

Farther: Antoni Olszowy
Mother: Mary byk
15(or 20) MAY 1874 Jan Olszowy (Immigrated 1902)
ABT 1877 Sophia Olszowa (Immigrated 1902)
20 Jul 1881 Jacob Olszowy (Haven't found in census yet)
ABT 1884 Agnes Olszowa (haven't found in census yet)

I found them through going over the WWI draft registrations, they list each other as family contacts. then I confirmed by going through the city guides and searching by the address year by year from 1900-1930.

Both families all seemed to live in the same house from 1900-1930's, Im going to look up the 1910 census and find the original address and get a listing of the names then go through the city register again. To figure out if John Olszowy was with his wife or not where did you get this from?

"This doesn't completely add up, but I found Jan Olszowy, indexed as Olszony, arriving on 21 Dec 1902, going to sister Zofia Olszowa in New Bedford, and he was from KAMIEN. The part that was weird was that he was traveling with his wife Rozalia, and he didn't marry Rozalia until 1903, right?"

Could it be Jacob? I only found him in a draft registration card and city directories so far, he disappeared after mid 1920's so far.
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Post Posted: Thu May 04, 2017 2:25 am      Post subject:
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Jan and Rozalia Olszowy (indexed as Olszony at Ancestry) on a NY passenger list: https://tinyurl.com/kyucc7d

Anna Olszowa on a NY passenger list, arriving 5 Dec 1908, from Kamien (indexed as Kannie), father Antoni, age 20, going to brother-in-law Walenty - I'm not sure of the last name.
https://tinyurl.com/md6mnav
I believe this is the Anna Olszowa whose birth/baptismal record I gave to you. She was born in 1890, so she wasn't quite 20. Perhaps you've run across multiple birth dates on documents for the same person. I'm amazed when I find someone from Poland during this time period who always has the same birth date on documents!! Sometimes people didn't know. I actually read that on a naturalization document yesterday. In the space for the birth date, unknown was written.
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Post Posted: Thu May 04, 2017 8:29 am      Post subject:
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Thanks, so what is listed as Galicy Poland the same thing as Kanniea?

I did run into that a few times, I am starting to learn, always view the docs, who knows what ends up getting entered.

That arrival date is perfect, maybe they just got married again? I have a lot to do the old fashion way, research at the church and start looking for death records and obituaries the old fashion way at the library on the microfilm. But I believe the draft records and was able to verify from other births that Jacob Nickowol, Jacob Olszowy, and John Olszowy were all different. A new Vollaria Nickowal even popped up in a city directory for a year or two, now I have another Anna Olszowa.
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