rsowaPO Top Contributor
Joined: 09 Nov 2013
Replies: 177
Location: Dundee, Michigan, USABack to top |
Posted: Sun Nov 23, 2014 9:50 am
Post subject: Missing Death Records
I've found quite a few Polish records where the wives of my ancestors married a second or third time. In all cases, the wives were identified in the Parish Register as a "widow" for their second (or third) marriages.
There SHOULD be a death recorded for the first (or second) husband, but in quite a few cases, I have found none. I know they were living in the same parish, because I found birth records listing them as parents.
All of these deaths happened during the period from about 1840-1860, and I suspect the husbands might have been involved in some of the insurrections going on at the time. They all lived within about 30 miles of Krakow.
If a death happened in another village, would it be recorded at the place where they died? Or would the "home" parish record the death? I guess another way of asking the question, is under what circumstances would a death be reported (or not be reported) in a parish register?
Thanks in advance,
Richard
|
|
|
Cheri Vanden BergPO Top Contributor & Patron
Joined: 16 Oct 2011
Replies: 504
Back to top |
Posted: Sun Nov 23, 2014 9:37 pm
Post subject:
Richard,
In the Austrian partition an imperial decree named Roman Catholic priests as civil registrars in 1782. Then they had to keep records for both church and state. I believe that I had read that the priests took record keeping seriously, and had to see a person's dead body before they would record the death. I wish I could find the source of that information. If that is true, anyone that might have died in the military, or while working out of town, etc. might not have their death recorded in their home parish. It's an interesting question, and I am just speculating.
Cheri
|
|
|
PhilipPO Top Contributor
Joined: 03 Mar 2014
Replies: 117
Back to top |
Posted: Sat Dec 27, 2014 3:19 pm
Post subject:
| Quote: | | If a death happened in another village, would it be recorded at the place where they died? Or would the "home" parish record the death? I guess another way of asking the question, is under what circumstances would a death be reported (or not be reported) in a parish register? |
Hi Richard,
In my opinion she probably moved, for unknown reasons.
A similar situation happened to a my ancestor, he was born in a small village but married and died in another.
What I noticed, reading his marriage certificate, is that on the left border there was a note about his town of birth.
Hence, read carefully every line in every certificate there might be some clues.
I doubt that the home parish had recorded the death, but on it there will be surely informations about his birth or marriage.
Try to look to some towns around or try to some other towns where other realtives lived.
Phil
|
|
|
rsowaPO Top Contributor
Joined: 09 Nov 2013
Replies: 177
Location: Dundee, Michigan, USABack to top |
Posted: Sat Dec 27, 2014 4:04 pm
Post subject:
| Philip wrote: |
In my opinion she probably moved, for unknown reasons.
A similar situation happened to a my ancestor, he was born in a small village but married and died in another.
What I noticed, reading his marriage certificate, is that on the left border there was a note about his town of birth.
Hence, read carefully every line in every certificate there might be some clues.
I doubt that the home parish had recorded the death, but on it there will be surely informations about his birth or marriage.
Try to look to some towns around or try to some other towns where other realtives lived.
Phil |
Thanks Phil...I have indeed seen clues in the margins of official documents that has helped in my searches.
However, in the cases I was referring to in my original post, NONE of the widows moved. They merely remarried in the same village they were living in with their (now deceased) husband, and where all their children were born. In other words, I have proof that they were living in a village for a decade or more, and gave birth to several children there. Then, the widow married a second time, and was identified as a widow in the parish register.
So that was the reason for my original post...how and when might a death be reported in a particular parish register. If the husband died somewhere else, would the ONLY record of his death be in the parish record of his birth? Or maybe the parish where he died? I guess another possibility is as you suggested, that at some point the family moved to another parish, where the husband died. Then the wife returned to the original parish where she remarried.
All of those situations would make it exceedingly difficult to ever find the husband's death record...unless a lot more Polish records eventually become indexed and searchable.
Happy Holidays!
Richard
|
|
|
PhilipPO Top Contributor
Joined: 03 Mar 2014
Replies: 117
Back to top |
Posted: Sat Dec 27, 2014 4:07 pm
Post subject:
| Quote: | | All of those situations would make it exceedingly difficult to ever find the husband's death record...unless a lot more Polish records eventually become indexed and searchable. |
I'm also waiting to discover many mysteries! I know, I also would like to know so many things about my ancestors!
But we have to wait for more documents and indexes!
It's probably the only way for your question.
Happy Holidays also to you and your family!
Phil
|
|
|
sirdanPO Top Contributor
Joined: 07 Mar 2012
Replies: 304
Location: ** Southeast Pole**Back to top |
Posted: Sun Dec 28, 2014 2:11 am
Post subject:
Hi Richard,
At normal circumstances, when somebody dies, his death record should be in parish where he died. If you have guess that somebody could die as a soldier or during military action far from the home, then again, it would be neccesery to search for death record at a parish of death. There is possibility that he died and neither somebody knew his identity, nor soldier mates. Then there would be no death record at all. Threre are usually books or lists that contain names and surnames of people died at war, it would be good to know at least tiny clue where he could die or at what kind of military action he participated.
Today in Poland, there is an institution called "pressumed as dead" or "claimed as dead" but thats just paper on which court assume the one as a dead man. I dont know how it would be in the 1850.
Also you mentioned insurrections. Eager to read about polish history, then check http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Galician_slaughter there are two or three books i know containing people names murdered during that time. Not sure if thats applies to Your cases. It would require to know status of your ancestors.
|
|
|
|
|
|
FAQ
Search
Memberlist
Profile
Log in to check your private messages
Log in
Register