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Elzbieta Porteneuve
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Location: Paris, France
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Posted: Thu Feb 25, 2016 3:42 pm Post subject:

heleninnj wrote:

Elzbieta,
I am hoping you can help me once more with a translation. Further research revealed another Pelke Harz (this was my great-grandmother) who WAS married to a David Weingarten. Together they had a child in1879 named Reisel. I am wondering if my great-grandmother might have been widowed or divorced before she had my grandfather (Meier). Her parents are listed as Nathan & Nadia (or a variation thereof). I am attaching a portion of Reisel's birth record in the hopes that you can translate the cursive and let me know if this Pelke is my Pelke. A million thanks.

Helen

Helen,

This page is difficult for me, because handwritten text is in German - I do hope someone will help us with missing few words. (Sophia, if you are reading it)

Here is my deciphering.

Best,
Elzbieta

==

http://polishorigins.com/forum/files/harz_weingarten_detail_290.jpg
C1: CHRONOLOGICAL-NUMBER: 244
C2: DATE-of-BIRTH-place-house: 10 Juni (June) 1879, Stanislau (Stanisławów), 58 ¼
C3: DATE-of-CIRCUMCISION-if-boy-place-house: 12 Juni (June) 1879, Stanislau (Stanisławów), 58 ¼
C4: CHILD-name-sex: Reisel, girl
C5: STATUS-of-CHILD-wedlock-allegedly-wedlock-out-of-wedlock: uneheliche geburt=out of wedlock [all 4 numbers/children have the same word written and no father in C6]
C6:
C7: MOTHER-name-status-residence-and-her-parents-residence: Pelke Harz, (words1 in German) Nathan Harz in Nadwórna (word2 in German) mutter (mother) Fejge, (word3 in German): Pelke Harz, (words1) Nathan Harz residing in Nadwórna (word2) and mother Fejge (word3)
C8: Israel Baran (kum or witness, sandek or schames) for all 4 numbers/children
C9:
C10: midwife
C11: notes in German, with a couple of names, Dawid Weingarten in bold
NOTE: geography
Stanisławów city in Lwów area of Poland, today Ukraina
Nadwórna, city circa 37 km south of Stanisławów
Google maps:
Stanisławów,+Ivano-Frankivs'ka+oblast,+Ukraine/Nadwórna,+Ivano-Frankivs'ka+oblast,+Ukraine

==

dnowicki
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Joined: 28 Dec 2011
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Location: Michigan City, Indiana
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Posted: Thu Feb 25, 2016 5:27 pm Post subject: Re: Polish Marriage Bann Translation

[quote="Elzbieta Porteneuve"][quote="Mrudnik"]Hello,
Hi,

Here is my deciphering. I wish Dave Nowicki, who knows very well Chicago, could re-read it and validate.

Best,
Elzbieta

==

PO-287:
http://polishorigins.com/forum/files/pv_marriage_banns_312.jpg
Piotr Rudnik, mł(odzian) 22 w Chi(cago) 7 miesiecy // Piotr Rudnik, young man, 22 years old, in Chicago since 7 month
w Pensylwanii Mount Pleasant W. Maryland, Pa // in Pennsylvania
[3 lines joined by bracket]
byl trzy lata // have been staying for 3 years
matka jest jeszcze tam // his mother is still there
i ojczym Ignacy Ostrowski // and his stepfather Ignacy Ostrowski

syn Wojciecha i Mary z fam(ilii) Sandycha // son of Wojciech and Mary born Sandych
urodzony w Osława Dąbrowa, Pomerania // born in Osława Dąbrowa, Pomerania
// NOTE: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Os%C5%82awa_D%C4%85browa Osława Dąbrowa is a village in Gmina Studzienice, Bytów County, Pomeranian Voivodeship, in northern Poland.

na uli(cy) Noble 699 // address in Chicago?
Gl.Pr? (5.) // ?
[on the right side, underlined] czyta // he reads = he knows how to read and write, is literate

Weronika Kosnowska, panna, 19 alm(ost) 1 /2 // Weronika Kosnowska, Miss, 19 years old, almost 19 and half
przy rodz(onym) bracie Franciszku Kosnowskim // [residing] with her brother Franciszek Kosnowki
na Fox pl 32 // address in Chicago
corka Jana i Petronelli Szeklinskiej // daughter of Jan and Petronella born Szeklinska
urodz(ona) Mały Szymwoczek?, czyta // born in Mały Szymwoczek?, she reads = she knows how to read and write, is literate

Licenze odda // he will give back license?
Zap(łaci) trzy paid $1 // he will pay 3 (times?) – paid $1

I a d. 20.I.84 // first [bann] on the day 20 January 1884
27.I.84 // 27 January 1884
3.II.84 // 3 February 1884

Zapłacił dolarow $ 7em // He paid $7

Slub alat // Marriage [what is alat?]
X. Fr(anciszek) Beulkopf C12 // Priest Franciszek Beulkopf C12
d. 4/II 84 Slub w P? Illegible 1/2 10 // date 4 February 1884, marriage in P? illegible, [what is 1/2 10 ? time using Polish saying “w pol do 10”, which is 9:30?]

Swiadkowie // Witnesses
1 Franciszek Susznorski?
2 Julian Stasiewski

Elzbieta & M. Rudnik,

Since the wedding took place in 1884 before the annexations of 1889 to the City of Chicago it is necessary to consult the tables of street name changes and the street numbering changes of 1909 in order to accurately locate the addresses in the record. Noble is located at 1400 West and the 1884 address of 699 changed to 1401 North Noble in 1909. The address of 32 Fox Pl. in 1909 changed to 1331 Fox. The church of St. Stanislaus Kostka was located on Ingraham Street in 1884 and from 1909 until now the street is known as Evergreen Avenue. Perhaps the attached 1880 map of Chicago along with the Google map will help to locate the places mentioned in the record. On the 1880 map Noble Street is indicated with the blue line and Fox is highlighted in yellow and St. Stanislaus is indicated in red. On the Google map Fox Place no longer exists since the Kennedy Expressway is now where 1331 Fox Place used to be. Fox Street was renamed as Julian Street which is highlighted to give the approximate location of Fox Place on the western edge of the Kennedy. The address where Piotr was living in 1884 today would be just to the north of Blackhawk on Noble Street. The site www.alookatcook.com is the place where the street and number changes are found. The 1880 map shows that Piotr and Weronika lived near each other and near the parish church.
The information about where Piotr lived before coming to Chicago is confusing. There is a Mt. Pleasant in Pennsylvania and also in Maryland but unless Mt. Pleasant PA was in a Maryland County in the 1880s (It is not in Maryland County today.) the entry does not make much sense. What makes sense to me is that he had lived in Mt. Pleasant, PA and Maryland is some sort of an error, but that is just my humble opinion. What is clear is that he lived there with his mother and stepfather for 3 years prior to coming to Chicago.
I have no idea what the Gl.Pr.(5) stands for.
I believe that the next line reads: "...panna 19 w Chi(cago) 1 1/2" and means that she had been living in Chicago for 1&1/2 years before the wedding.
I believe that the statement about returning the license refers to the priest returning the license to the Cook County Clerk's office after completing the certificate at the bottom of the license. (That was what was and still is required of the person [priest, rabbi, minister, judge, etc.] who solemnized the marriage.) I also would say that the word trzy refers to the three banns and that he paid $1.00 for all three announcements rather than $1.00 for each. One dollar would seem like a lot to pay for each announcement of the banns although 3 for a dollar still seems like the parish was milking the couple for every dollar possible.
What looks like C12 after the surname of the priest is probably C.R. (Congregatio Resurrectionis), which is the abbreviation for the name of the religious order of priests who were in charge of St. Stanislaus.
I'm pretty sure that the illegible word after Slub w ? is pon(iedzialek)/Monday---especially since February 4 in 1884 was a Monday. I agree the the last words are pol do dziesiatej/9:30 a.m.

Elzbieta, Co mysli Zofia? Moze ona juz lepiej umie czytac i tlumaczyc niz my! Tylko szkoda ze ona nie zna Chicago.
Pozdrowienia z Indiany, Dawid

I hope these comments help to clarify the geography.

Dave

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Elzbieta Porteneuve
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Joined: 09 Nov 2012
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Location: Paris, France
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Posted: Thu Feb 25, 2016 8:18 pm Post subject:

czaplicki wrote:

Hi Elżbieta,
Perhaps if you would go to the original scan (URL below) of the book for Mikołaj Gadomski it might be easier. It looks a lot better on my computer. It is entry 21.
Thank you,
Conrad
http://metryki.genealodzy.pl/metryka.php?ar=6&zs=0102d&sy=1836&kt=3&plik=020-025.jpg#zoom=1&x=213&y=1365

Conrad,

Here it is.

Best,
Elzbieta

==

==PO287:
http://metryki.genealodzy.pl/metryka.php?ar=6&zs=0102d&sy=1836&kt=3&plik=020-025.jpg#zoom=1&x=213&y=1365

DATE-of-ACT: /17/29/ - 29 February 1836, at 8 am, in the ecclesiastical village of Krzynowloga Wielka
WITNESSES: Jozef Gadomski, 45 years old, and Franciszek Gadomski, 35 years old, both partial heirs from the village Czaplice Kurki, ibid residing, both of which are sons of deceased
KTO: Mikolaj Gadomski, died /15/27/ -27 February 1836, at 7 am, a nobleman, widower, partial heir of Czaplice Kurki, ibid born and residing,
PARENTS: son of Antoni and Zofia, spouses Gadomski from Czaplice Kurki, 86 years old,
WIDOW: left behind husband of Agnieszka born Roman

21 Czaplice Kurki
Dzialo sie w wsi koscielnej Krzynowlodze Wielkiej dnia /17/29/ lutego 1836 roku o godzinie 8 rano. Stawili sie Jozef Gadomski lat 45, i Franciszek Gadomski lat 35 liczacy, obydwaj czesci dziedzice wsi Czaplic Kurkow, tamze zamieszkali, i oswiadczyli, ze w dniu /15/27/ biezacego miesiaca o godzinie 7 rano umarl Mikolaj Gadomski, szlachcic, wdowiec, czesci dziedzic Czaplic Kurkow, tamze zrodzony i zamieszkaly, syn Antoniego i Zofii, malzonkow Gadomskich z Czaplic Kurkow, lat 86 liczacy, pozostaly maz Agnieszki Romanownej. Po przekonaniu sie naocznie o zejsciu Gadomskiego. Akt ten przeczytany stawajacym pisac nie umiejacym, ktorzy sa synowie zmarlego, podpisany zostal przez nas.
X. Norbert Zorawski, proboszcz parafii Wielko Krzynowłoskiej

Translated:

It happened in the ecclesiastical village of Krzynowloga Wielka on the day /17/29/ February 1836, at 8 am. Appeared in Jozef Gadomski, 45 years old, and Franciszek Gadomski, 35 years old, both partial heirs from the village Czaplice Kurki, ibid residing, and declared that on the day /15/27/ of the current month at 7 am, died Mikolaj Gadomski, a nobleman, widower, partial heir of Czaplice Kurki, ibid born and residing, son of Antoni and Zofia, spouses Gadomski from Czaplice Kurki, 86 years old, left behind husband of Agnieszka born Roman. After visual conviction that Gadomski passed away. This act was read to the presents, who do not know how to write, both of which are sons of deceased, and was signed by us. Priest Norbert Żórawski, pastor in Krzynowloga Wielka

==

fopuszyn

Joined: 31 Aug 2014
Replies: 177
Location: Connecticut USA
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Posted: Thu Feb 25, 2016 10:33 pm Post subject: Re: Jan Lopuszynski m.1837 b.1808

Elzbieta Porteneuve wrote:

fopuszyn wrote:

Elzbieta,

This could be an interesting find for me. Here are birth and marriage records for a Jan Lopuszynski. Jan's father is Bazyli - a new finding for me. Not sure who Bazyli's father is.

Marriage:

1808 Birth: Łęg parish
http://www.geneszukacz.genealodzy.pl/index.php?search_lastname=lopuszynski&from_date=1808&to_date=1808&rpp1=&bdm=&url1=&w=&lang=pol&op=se
http://www.geneteka.genealodzy.pl/index.php?rid=B&from_date=1808&to_date=1808&search_lastname=lopuszynski&search_lastname2=&rpp1=0&bdm=B&w=07mz&op=gt&lang=pol

Jan born in Łęg parish Mazowieckie province.

1837 Marriage: Chrostkowo parish
http://www.geneteka.genealodzy.pl/index.php?rid=S&from_date=1837&to_date=1837&search_lastname=lopuszynski&search_lastname2=&rpp1=0&bdm=S&w=02kp&op=gt&lang=pol

Bazyli married Barbara in 1807 in Łęg.
http://www.geneteka.genealodzy.pl/index.php?rid=S&from_date=1807&to_date=1807&search_lastname=lopuszynski&search_lastname2=&rpp1=0&bdm=S&w=07mz&op=gt&lang=pol

I have no clue who Bazyli is, where Łęg is.... So why would Jan come to Chrostkowo to get married? Maybe Bazyli was born in Lipno region and moved to Łęg region to marry and start a life? I hope to learn more about this Łęg - Chrostkowo connection. Maybe clues in attached records.

Thanks

Frank

Frank,

Here is the marriage record from 1837, szukajwarchiwach.pl indicates: Łęg,+Mława+County,+Poland, as well birth record from 1808 of Jan Franciszek Xawery Łopuszyński son of Bazyli and Barbara born Szulc.

Best,
Elzbieta

==

==PO287:
http://polishorigins.com/forum/files/ta_lopuszynski_jan_m1837_205.jpg
MARRIAGE: /16 January/7 February/ - 7 February 1837 at 9 am, in the village Chrostkowo
GROOM: Jan Łopuszyński, of noble birth, young man, an income writer [officer controlling income from land] residing in Lubuwiec, born in the village Rościszewo, 28 years old
GROOM-PARENTS: son of Bazyli and Barbara, born Szulc, spouses Łopuszyński, residing in the village Rościszewo, already passed away,
BRIDE: a noble-born Miss Karolina, 29 years old, born in the village Olesno, and now residing in Lubuwiec with her friends
BRIDE-PARENTS: daughter of Bernard and Malgorzata spouses Trzcieński, residing in Olesno, already passed away,
WITNESSES: Michal Dzielski, farmer residing here in Chrostkowo, 72 years old, and Jozef Zatorskiego, [ekonom] finacial manager, residing in the village Lubuwiec, 32 years old, a friend of mentioned below Jan Łopuszyński
BANNS: /17/29/ - 29 January 1837, in the church in Chrostkowo
NOTE: szukajwarchiwach.pl : Łęg,+Mława+County,+Poland
NOTE: geography
Łęg,+Mława+County,+Poland/Kowalewo,+Poland/Rościszewo,+Poland/Chrostkowo,+Poland/Lubówiec,+Poland/Oleszno,+Powiat+lipnowski,+Poland

Lubuwiec // today Lubówiec
Dzialo sie w wsi Chrostkowie dnia /16 stycznia/7 lutego/ 1837 roku o godzinie 9 z rana. Wiadomo czynimy, ze w przytomnosci swiadkow Michala Dzielskiego, gospodarza tu w Chrostkowie zamieszkalego, lat 72 majacego, i Jozefa Zatorskiego, ekonoma w wsi Lubuwcu zamieszkalego, lat 32 majacego, przyjaciela nizej wymienionego Jana Łopuszyńskiego, na dniu dzisiejszym zawarte zostalo religijne malzenstwo miedzy szlachetnie urodzonym Janem Łopuszyńskim, mlodzianem, pisarzem prowentowym w Lubuwcu zamieszkalym, urodzonym w wsi Rościszewie, z Bazylego i Barbary z Szulcow Łopuszyńskich malzonkow, tamze zamieszkalych, juz niezyjacych, lat 28 majacym; a szlachetnie urodzona panna Karolina corka Bernarda i Malgorzaty malzonkow Trzcieńskich w Olesnie zamieszkalych, juz niezyjacych, lat 29 liczaca, w wsi Olesnie urodzona, a teraz w Lubuwcu u przyjaciol zamieszkala. Malzenstwo to poprzedzila tylko jedna zapowiedz na mocy udzielonego z Przeswietego Konsystorza Generalnego Plockiego inclu? w dniu 23 stycznia roku biezacego Nru 42. Zapowiedz ogloszona byla w dniu /17/29/ stycznia roku biezacego w kosciele Chrostkowskim, jako tez zezwolenie ustne obecnych aktowi swiadkow i przyjaciol bylo oswiadczone. Tamowanie malzenstwa nie zaszlo. Malzonkowie nowi oswiadczaja, iz umowy przedslubnej nie zawarli urzedownie. Akt ten stawajacym i swiadkom przeczytany, przez nas, stawajacych, swiadka jednego podpisany zostal.
Xsiadz Eustaszy Dzielski, kommendarz parafii Chrostkowskiej
Signatures:
Jozef Zatorski, swiadek
Jan Łopuszyński
Karolina Trzcieńska

Translated:

It happened in the village Chrostkowo, on the day /16 January/7 February/ 1837 at 9 am. We make it known that the consciousness of witnesses Michal Dzielski, farmer residing here in Chrostkowo, 72 years old, and Jozef Zatorskiego, [ekonom] finacial manager, residing in the village Lubuwiec, 32 years old, a friend of mentioned below Jan Łopuszyński, today has been concluded religious marriage between, of noble birth, Jan Łopuszyński, young man, an income writer [officer controlling income from land] residing in Lubuwiec, born in the village Rościszewo, son of Bazyli and Barbara born Szulc, spouses Łopuszyński, ibid residing, already passed away, 28 years old; and a noble-born Miss Karolina, daughter of Bernard and Malgorzata spouses Trzcieński, residing in Olesno, already passed away, 29 years old, born in the village Olesno, and now residing in Lubuwiec with her friends. This marriage was preceded by only one announcement, [exception] granted under the Holy Consistory General in Plock drafted? on 23 January of the current year, N 42. The announcement was proclaimed on /17/29/ January of the current year in the church in Chrostkowo, as also an oral permission from present to the act witnesses and friends were stated. No opposition to the marriage had happened. The new spouses declare that they did not conclude any prenuptial agreement [urzedownie] by official act. This act was read to the present and witnesses, by us, presents and one witness was signed.
Priest Eustaszy Dzielski, administrator of the parish in Chrostkowo
Signatures:
Jozef Zatorski, witness
Jan Łopuszyński
Karolina Trzcieńska

==

==PO287:
http://polishorigins.com/forum/files/sa_lopuszynski_jan_b1808_118.jpg
Printed form, record N 35, village Kowalewo, signed priest Symforyn Kozlowski
Summary:
DATE-of-ACT: 27 November 1808, at 11 am, in Łęg, county Mława, department of Płock
FATHER: Bazyli Łopuszyński, 37 years old, residing in the village Kowalewo, community Łęg
MOTHER: Barbara born Szulc, 32 years old, his wife
KTO: Jan Franciszek Xawery Łopuszyński, born 20 November 1808, at 3 am, in the village Kowalewo, community Łęg, house number 8
WITNESSES: Marcin Kapewierzyski? 32 years old, and Woyciech Norbertezecki? Lat 29, both from the village Kowalewo, community Łęg
==

Thanks Elzbieta!

This is interesting. Might be opening up new areas to dig into. Until now, my findings have been pretty much centered around Lipno area. Farmers earning a living, providing for their families. My take on Jan is that he may have been educated, managed money, he signed his own marriage record as witness, and he was a "noble" but I'm not sure what that means. Was he born a noble or did he earn it? He married a noble.

So I need to discover what drew him to Chrostkowo to marry? Extended family, grandparents, etc? Or, did the Lipno area clan all migrate from where Jan was born?

One thing I noticed was that Jan's 1808 birth record wasn't a hand written record but a pre-printed form with fill in the blanks. Perhaps the Łęg parish was better funded for such record keeping. Perhaps Łęg was a more affluent community at that time which explains the nobility.

What would a noble be during that era?

Frank

Mrudnik

Joined: 23 Feb 2016
Replies: 61

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Posted: Fri Feb 26, 2016 8:08 am Post subject: Re: Polish Marriage Bann Translation

[quote="dnowicki"][quote="Elzbieta Porteneuve"]

Mrudnik wrote:

Hello,
Hi,

Here is my deciphering. I wish Dave Nowicki, who knows very well Chicago, could re-read it and validate.

Best,
Elzbieta

==

PO-287:
http://polishorigins.com/forum/files/pv_marriage_banns_312.jpg
Piotr Rudnik, mł(odzian) 22 w Chi(cago) 7 miesiecy // Piotr Rudnik, young man, 22 years old, in Chicago since 7 month
w Pensylwanii Mount Pleasant W. Maryland, Pa // in Pennsylvania
[3 lines joined by bracket]
byl trzy lata // have been staying for 3 years
matka jest jeszcze tam // his mother is still there
i ojczym Ignacy Ostrowski // and his stepfather Ignacy Ostrowski

syn Wojciecha i Mary z fam(ilii) Sandycha // son of Wojciech and Mary born Sandych
urodzony w Osława Dąbrowa, Pomerania // born in Osława Dąbrowa, Pomerania
// NOTE: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Os%C5%82awa_D%C4%85browa Osława Dąbrowa is a village in Gmina Studzienice, Bytów County, Pomeranian Voivodeship, in northern Poland.

na uli(cy) Noble 699 // address in Chicago?
Gl.Pr? (5.) // ?
[on the right side, underlined] czyta // he reads = he knows how to read and write, is literate

Weronika Kosnowska, panna, 19 alm(ost) 1 /2 // Weronika Kosnowska, Miss, 19 years old, almost 19 and half
przy rodz(onym) bracie Franciszku Kosnowskim // [residing] with her brother Franciszek Kosnowki
na Fox pl 32 // address in Chicago
corka Jana i Petronelli Szeklinskiej // daughter of Jan and Petronella born Szeklinska
urodz(ona) Mały Szymwoczek?, czyta // born in Mały Szymwoczek?, she reads = she knows how to read and write, is literate

Licenze odda // he will give back license?
Zap(łaci) trzy paid $1 // he will pay 3 (times?) – paid $1

I a d. 20.I.84 // first [bann] on the day 20 January 1884
27.I.84 // 27 January 1884
3.II.84 // 3 February 1884

Zapłacił dolarow $ 7em // He paid $7

Slub alat // Marriage [what is alat?]
X. Fr(anciszek) Beulkopf C12 // Priest Franciszek Beulkopf C12
d. 4/II 84 Slub w P? Illegible 1/2 10 // date 4 February 1884, marriage in P? illegible, [what is 1/2 10 ? time using Polish saying “w pol do 10”, which is 9:30?]

Swiadkowie // Witnesses
1 Franciszek Susznorski?
2 Julian Stasiewski

Elzbieta & M. Rudnik,

Since the wedding took place in 1884 before the annexations of 1889 to the City of Chicago it is necessary to consult the tables of street name changes and the street numbering changes of 1909 in order to accurately locate the addresses in the record. Noble is located at 1400 West and the 1884 address of 699 changed to 1401 North Noble in 1909. The address of 32 Fox Pl. in 1909 changed to 1331 Fox. The church of St. Stanislaus Kostka was located on Ingraham Street in 1884 and from 1909 until now the street is known as Evergreen Avenue. Perhaps the attached 1880 map of Chicago along with the Google map will help to locate the places mentioned in the record. On the 1880 map Noble Street is indicated with the blue line and Fox is highlighted in yellow and St. Stanislaus is indicated in red. On the Google map Fox Place no longer exists since the Kennedy Expressway is now where 1331 Fox Place used to be. Fox Street was renamed as Julian Street which is highlighted to give the approximate location of Fox Place on the western edge of the Kennedy. The address where Piotr was living in 1884 today would be just to the north of Blackhawk on Noble Street. The site www.alookatcook.com is the place where the street and number changes are found. The 1880 map shows that Piotr and Weronika lived near each other and near the parish church.
The information about where Piotr lived before coming to Chicago is confusing. There is a Mt. Pleasant in Pennsylvania and also in Maryland but unless Mt. Pleasant PA was in a Maryland County in the 1880s (It is not in Maryland County today.) the entry does not make much sense. What makes sense to me is that he had lived in Mt. Pleasant, PA and Maryland is some sort of an error, but that is just my humble opinion. What is clear is that he lived there with his mother and stepfather for 3 years prior to coming to Chicago.
I have no idea what the Gl.Pr.(5) stands for.
I believe that the next line reads: "...panna 19 w Chi(cago) 1 1/2" and means that she had been living in Chicago for 1&1/2 years before the wedding.
I believe that the statement about returning the license refers to the priest returning the license to the Cook County Clerk's office after completing the certificate at the bottom of the license. (That was what was and still is required of the person [priest, rabbi, minister, judge, etc.] who solemnized the marriage.) I also would say that the word trzy refers to the three banns and that he paid $1.00 for all three announcements rather than $1.00 for each. One dollar would seem like a lot to pay for each announcement of the banns although 3 for a dollar still seems like the parish was milking the couple for every dollar possible.
What looks like C12 after the surname of the priest is probably C.R. (Congregatio Resurrectionis), which is the abbreviation for the name of the religious order of priests who were in charge of St. Stanislaus.
I'm pretty sure that the illegible word after Slub w ? is pon(iedzialek)/Monday---especially since February 4 in 1884 was a Monday. I agree the the last words are pol do dziesiatej/9:30 a.m.

Elzbieta, Co mysli Zofia? Moze ona juz lepiej umie czytac i tlumaczyc niz my! Tylko szkoda ze ona nie zna Chicago.
Pozdrowienia z Indiany, Dawid

I hope these comments help to clarify the geography.

Dave

Dave and Elizabieta,

Thank you so much for the assistance in translating this. I have been working for 2 years to determine where Piotr and Veronika were born and this finally gave me the answers.

Just to help clarify, Piotr did live in Mt Pleasant Pa. They actually moved back there some time after after 1886 and that is where he died (and where my grandfather and father grew up - We still live in Pa). I was confused about the Maryland reference also since it has always been Westmoreland County. I am also going to assume that it was a mistake. Veronika did arrive at the Baltimore port in 1882 , but Piotr came through New York. (allegedly - I have the date he arrived in 1880, but have not been able to confirm it through ship records. Of course they both departed from Bremen so I cannot check those records.)

I was unaware of a stepfather, so this now gives me something else to look into.

Again, I really appreciate the assistance.

Thank You,

Michael Rudnik

czaplicki

Joined: 01 Nov 2008
Replies: 49
Location: USA
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Posted: Fri Feb 26, 2016 4:37 pm Post subject: M-Piotr CZ Tekla CZ KW 1845-10

Elżbieta, Thank you for translating the death record of Mikołaj Gadomski. Could you please translate the Marriage record of my 1st cousin 3x removed Tekla Czaplicki?
Thank you,
Conrad Czaplicki

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_________________
Researching: Czaplicki, Rudziński, Bartołd, Chmieliński in Ciechanów area;Furtek, Dyka, Armata, Petka, Maslonka near Frysztak; Luczkowski,
Pakos in Dubany, Ukraine

mestanton

Joined: 14 May 2015
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Posted: Sat Feb 27, 2016 1:59 pm Post subject: Jan Rutkowski 1823 Birth, Pawel Rudkowski 1830 Marriage

Please translate the 1823 birth of Jan Rutkowski of Brzezno whose godfather (Pawel Rutkowski of Kikół) may be the brother of his father Bartlomiej Rutkowski.

Pawel Rudkowski's second marriage of 1830 contains the names of his parents. Are they Jacek and Katarzyna Rudkowski?

The Brzezno Rutkowski family seems to have spelled the last name with a "t" while those in Kikół spelled the name with a "d." If so, this will help me find the parents of my ancestor Bartlomiej if he and Pawel are indeed brothers. I have not yet found Bartolomiej's marriage record to Maryanny Lewandowska (before 1815) to know their parents' names. Bartlomiej's 1837 death record in Czernikowo parish states that his parents are not known, so I am still looking.

Thank you for your time and attention to this request.

Marilyn

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elaineb423

Joined: 06 Jul 2015
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Posted: Sat Feb 27, 2016 2:46 pm Post subject: Help with Polish letter translation

I have 2 letters that I would like to have translated. They were in my great grandmother's belongings. I know very little about her or her husband's family and I hope these will shed some light on them.

Thank you
Elaine

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elaineb423

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Posted: Sat Feb 27, 2016 2:51 pm Post subject: Help in translating a letter Polish to English

I am hoping to get help to translate this letter that was found with my great grandmother's belonging. We know very little about her or her husband's family in Poland and we are hoping there might be some clues in the letter!
Thank you for any help!

There is one more page but I can't add it....

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Elzbieta Porteneuve
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Posted: Mon Feb 29, 2016 2:32 pm Post subject: Re: Help with Polish letter translation

elaineb423 wrote:

Elaine,

Here it is.

Best,
Elzbieta

==

==PO278:
http://polishorigins.com/forum/files/second_letter_page_1_13_of_19_103.jpg
[righ side]
Gniewczyna dnia 28/12 1922 // 28 December 1922
Niech bedzie pochwalony Jezus Chrystus. Najpierw donosze ci, ze list od Ciebie otrzymalem, ktorego my wygladali. W kraju nima nic nowego. Jasiek Koniecznego Sobkow przyslal tysiac dolarow przez Jana Chrusciela, azeby mu kupili gdzie jakiego kawalka pola. Teraz pisal, zeby mu odeslali, bo wnet nie przyjedzie, bo teraz w Ameryce bardzo dobrze placa, jak nigdy jeszcze nie placili. Teraz duzo takich co byli w Ameryce to sie wybieraja na powrot,
http://polishorigins.com/forum/files/second_letter_page_2_13_of_19_156.jpg
[left side]
ale teraz trudno dostac sie do Ameryki, jak dawniej, taki co ma papiery z Ameryki to temu latwo. Mroczka mowili, ze pisali do Ciebie, ale nie maja zadnego odpisu.
Piszesz, ze my o tobie zapomnieli. Jeszcze do tego na mnie piszesz, ze jak bede dzielil, zeby o tobie nie zapomniec. Jeszcze nie dziele, jak ty przyjedziesz przywiezierz kufer dolarow, to folwark kupimy. Piet? ? pojdzie do wojska, jak byla wojna z bolszewikami, on byl
[righ side]
na tej wojnie, powrocil z wojny, teraz maja powolywac na powrot.
Nima co wiecej pisac, tylko cie pozdrawiamy z calym domem. My sa wszyscy zdrowi, czego i tobie zyczymy. Zyczymy ci na tym Nowym Roku szczescia, zdrowia dobrego, powodzenia i czego sobie sam zyczysz. Moze ja tam kiedys do ciebie zagoszcze. Do milego zobaczenia
http://polishorigins.com/forum/files/second_letter_page_1_13_of_19_103.jpg
[left side]
tylko nam odpisz

NOTE: geography
The village Gniewczyna is very close to Przeworsk, east of Łańcut. Actually there are two very close villages Gniewczyna in Podkarpackie
https://pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gniewczyna
Gniewczyna Tryniecka
Gniewczyna Łańcucka
https://pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gniewczyna_%C5%81a%C5%84cucka
==
Gniewczyna, 28 December 1922
Praised be Jesus Christ. First, I inform you that I received a letter from you, whose we were looking for. Nothing new in the country. Jasiek Konieczny Sobkow sent a thousand dollars by Jan Chruściel, so that we bought for him a piece of land [field]. Now he writes, that it be sent back because he will not arrive soon, because now in America they are paying very well, as they had never paid before. Now a lot of those who have been in America before intend to return,
http://polishorigins.com/forum/files/second_letter_page_2_13_of_19_156.jpg
[Left side]
but now it is more difficult to get to America, as in the past, so the one who got papers from America it is easy for him. Mroczek said that they wrote to you, but did not get any reply.
You write that we forgot about you. In addition you writes me that, when I will share [divide property], I shall not forget about you. I do not share yet, when you arrive bring a trunk of dollars, we will buy a very large farm. Piet? ? will go to the army, during the war with the Bolsheviks, he was
[Righ side]
in this war, then he returned back from the war, now they shall draft again.
There is nothing more to write, only we salute you with the whole house. We are all healthy, what we wish to you. In this New Year we wish you happiness, good health, good luck and all you wish yourself to you. Maybe one day I will be hosted by you. See you with pleasure
http://polishorigins.com/forum/files/second_letter_page_1_13_of_19_103.jpg
[Left side]
please reply to us.

==

Elzbieta Porteneuve
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Posted: Mon Feb 29, 2016 8:24 pm Post subject: Re: M-Piotr CZ Tekla CZ KW 1845-10

czaplicki wrote:

Elżbieta, Thank you for translating the death record of Mikołaj Gadomski. Could you please translate the Marriage record of my 1st cousin 3x removed Tekla Czaplicki?
Thank you,
Conrad Czaplicki

Conrad,

Here is marriage record.

Best,
Elzbieta

==

==PO287:
http://polishorigins.com/forum/files/thumb_m_piotr_cz_tekla_cz_kw_1845_10_1024_164.jpg
10 Czaplice Kurki
MARRIAGE: /15/27/ April 1845, at 6 pm, in the village Krzynowłoga Wielka
GROOM: well-born Piotr Czaplicki, widower, partial heir to the village Czaplice Kurki, ibid born and residing; 31 years old according to the birth certificate located in this church
GROOM-WIDOW: the left behind husband of Tekla born Humięcka, passed away on the day /18 February/2 March/ current year, ibid in Czaplice Kurki according to the death record located in this church,
GROOM-PARENTS: son of Gabryel and Zofia born Kownacka, spouses Czaplicki, according to the death record located in this church, passed away in Czaplice Kurki
BRIDE: Miss Tekla Czaplicka, 25 years old according to the birth certificate located in this church, born in Czaplice Kurki, and staying with her father
BRIDE-PARENTS: daughter of Jozef, partial heir, residing in Czaplice Kurki, and Anna born Jachowska, passed away in Chaplice Kurki according to the death record located in this church, spouses Czaplicki
WITNESSES: Jan Ulatowski, partial heir, residing in the village Ulatowo Borzuchy, 29 years old, brother-in law of the mentioned Miss Tekla Czaplicka, and Grzegorz Borkowski, church caretaker, residing here in Krzynowłoga Wielka, 56 years old
BANNS: /25 March/6 April/, /1/13/, and /8/20/ April 1845, in the parish Krzynowłoga Wielka

Dzialo sie w wsi Krzynowlodze Wielkiej dnia /15/27/ kwietnia 1845 roku o godzinie 6 po poludniu. Wiadomo czynimy, ze w przytomnosci swiadkow Jana Ulatowskiego, czastkowego dziedzica w wsi Ulatowie Borzuchach zamieszkalego, lat 29, szwagra nizej wymienionej panny Tekli Czaplickiej, i Grzegorza Borkowskiego, dziadka koscielnego tu w Krzynowlodze Wielkiej zamieszkalego, lat 56 majacego, na dniu dzisiejszym zawarte zostalo religijne malzenstwo miedzy urodzonemi Piotrem Czaplickim, wdowcem czastkowym dziedzicem wsi Czaplice Kurki, tamze zrodzonym i zamieszkujacym; pozostalym mezem Tekli z Humieckich dnia /18 lutego/2 marca/ roku biezacego, tamze w Czaplicach Kurkach podlug znajdujacego tu przy kosciele aktu zejscia zmarley, synem Gabryela i Zofii z Kownackich, malzonkow Czaplickich, podlug aktu zejscia to przy kosciele znajdujacych sie w Czaplicach Kurkach zeszlych, lat podlug aktu urodzenia tu przy kosciele znajdujacego sie 31 majacego; a panna Tekla corka Jozefa czastkowego dziedzica, w Czaplicach Kurkach zamieszkalego i Anny z Jachowskich podlug znajdujacego sie tu przy kosciele aktu zejscia tamze w Czaplicach Kurkach zeszlej, malzonkow Czaplickich, lat podlug aktu urodzenia tu przy kosciele znajdujacego sie 25 liczaca, w Czaplicach Kurkach zrodzona, i przy ojcu zostajaca. Malzenstwo to poprzedzily trzy zapowiedzi w dniach /25 marca/6 kwietnia/, /1/13/, i /8/20/ kwietnia roku biezacego w parafii Wielko Krzynowloskiej, jako tez zezwolenie ustne obecnego aktowi malzenstwa ojca nowozaslubionej. Tamowanie malzenstwa nie zaszlo. Malzonkowie nowi oswiadczaja, iz zawarli umowe przedslubna dnia /12/24/ miesiaca i roku biezacych przed Frederykiem Ozirskim regentem kancelarii ziemianskiej w Przasnyszu. Akt ten stawajacym i swiadkom przeczytany, zostal przez nas podpisany, wszystkie zas w akcie wymienione osoby pisac nie umieja.
Xsiadz Norbert Zorawski, proboszcz Wielko Krzynowłoskiej

==

Elzbieta Porteneuve
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Posted: Mon Feb 29, 2016 8:51 pm Post subject: Re: Jan Rutkowski 1823 Birth, Pawel Rudkowski 1830 Marriage

mestanton wrote:

Marilyn,

Here is the birth record from 1823. More tomorrow.
Best,
Elzbieta

==
==PO287:
http://polishorigins.com/forum/files/jan_rutkowski_birth_1823_319.jpg
DATE-of-ACT: 28 December 1823, at 8 am, in Kikół circuit Lipno in the voievodship Plock
FATHER: Bartlomiej Rutkowski, 40 years old, laborer from Brzezno
MOTHER: Maryanna born Lawendowska, 25 years old, his wife
KTO: Jan Rutkowski, born 26 December 1823, at 10 pm, in Brzezno, house at number 7
WITNESSES: Pawel Rutkowski, his brother, 44 years old, farmer from Kikół, and Ignacy Przybylski, 53 years old, laborer in Kikół, a friend

106 Brzezno
Roku 1823, dnia 28 grudnia, o godzinie 8 rano. Przed nami, proboszczem parafii Kikolskiej, urzednikiem Stanu Cywilnego
http://polishorigins.com/forum/files/jan_rutkowski_birth_1823_page_2_121.jpg
gminy Kikół obwodu Lipnowskiego w wojewodztwie Plockim. Stawil sie uczciwy Bartlomiej Rutkowski lat 40 majacy, wyrobnik z Brzezna, i okazal nam dziecie plci meskiej, ktore urodzilo sie w domu jego pod numerem 7 na dniu 26 grudnia roku biezacego o godzinie 10 w nocy, oswiadczajac iz jest splodzone z niego i Maryanny z Lawendowskich, majacej lat 25, jego malzonki, i ze zyczeniem jego jest nadac mu imie Jan. Po uczynieniu powyzszego oswiadczenia i okazaniu dzieciecia, w przytomnosci Pawla Rutkowskiego, brata swego, lat 44 majacego, gospodarza z Kikola, i Ignacego Przybylskiego, lat 53 liczacego, wyrobnika z Kikola, przyjaciela. Akt niniejszy zostal stawajacym przeczytany, i od nas podpisany, ojciec i swiadkowie pisac nie umieja.
Xsiadz Walenty Łubieński, urzednik Stanu Cywilnego

Translated:

Year 1823, day 28 December, at 8 am. Before us, pastor of the parish Kikół, officer of Civil Vital Records Registry
() for the community Kikół circuit Lipno in the voievodship Plock. Appeared in honest Bartlomiej Rutkowski, 40 years old, laborer from Brzezno, and presented to us a male child, who was born in his house at number 7, on 26 December of the current year at 10 pm, declaring he is begotten of him and Maryanna born Lawendowska, 25 years old, his wife, and that his will is to give him the name Jan. After making the above statement and presentation of the child, in the consciousness of Pawel Rutkowski, his brother, 44 years old, farmer from Kikół, and Ignacy Przybylski, 53 years old, laborer in Kikół, a friend. This act was read to the present, and signed by us, the father and the witnesses do not know how to write.
Priest Walenty Łubieński, officer of Civil Vital Records Registry
==

ossnhughie
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Posted: Tue Mar 01, 2016 7:32 am Post subject: Elzbieta new records from Vilnius archives

Elzbieta,

Hello it pleases me that the archives in Wilno have sent me 5 more records to be translated 1 death record and 4 birth and baptism records, all pertaining to the Dowiat(t) family.

Hopefully the script is clear enough for you to decipher. From the 1840 Mejszagola list this should be the baptism records of Bartlomiej and Aniela Dowiatt's children Julia, Nikodem, Alexandra and Maryanna.

The death record that of Bartlomiej Dowiatt.

Thank you again.

Sincerely,

Hugh Whiting

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_________________
Litwo! Ojczyzno moja! ty jesteś jak zdrowie;
Ile cię trzeba cenić, ten tylko się dowie, Kto cię stracił.

brymsza

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Posted: Tue Mar 01, 2016 1:56 pm Post subject: Stammbaum Header

Elzbieta

I apologize if this is a repeat but I just can't remember if I asked you to translate this before or not.

Thank you in advance.
Bob

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Elzbieta Porteneuve
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Posted: Tue Mar 01, 2016 5:04 pm Post subject: Re: Jan Rutkowski 1823 Birth, Pawel Rudkowski 1830 Marriage

mestanton wrote:

Marilyn,

Here is 1830 record.
Best,
Elzbieta

==

==PO287:
http://polishorigins.com/forum/files/pawel_rudkowski_marriage_1830_165.jpg
MARRIAGE: 31 May 1830, at 12 noon, in the village Kikół
GROOM: Pawel Rudkowski, widower, laborer residing in Kikół, 46 years old, born in Kikół,
GROOM-WIDOW: widower left behind by Maryanna born Kędzierska
GROOM-PARENTS: son of Jacenty and Maryanna, spouses Rudkowski, already passed away
BRIDE: Miss Maryanna Karpienska, 42 years old, workwoman residing in Kikół, born in Makowiec
BRIDE-PARENTS: daughter of Piotr and Agnieszka, spouses Karpienski,
WITNESSES: Leon Rudkowski, 52 years old, and Jakub Kielecki, 50 years old, laborers from Kikół; the first witness is the brother [rodzony=same parents] of the groom
BANNS: 16, 23 and 30 May 1830, in the parish Kikół

10 Kikół
Dzialo sie w wsi Kikole dnia 31 maja 1830 roku o godzinie 12 w poludnie. Wiadomo czynimy, ze w przytomnosci swiadkow Leona Rudkowskiego lat 52 tudziez Jakuba Kieleckiego lat 50 liczacych, wyrobnikow z Kikola, na dniu dzisiejszym zawarte zostalo religijne malzenstwo miedzy Pawlem Rudkowskim, wdowcem pozostalym po Maryannie z Kędzierskich, wyrobnikiem w Kikole zamieszkalym, lat 46 liczacym, urodzonym w Kikole z Jacentego i Maryanny Rudkowskich, juz niezyjacych; a panna Maryanna Karpienska, lat 42 majaca, wyrobnica w Kikole zamieszkala, corka Piotra i Agnieszki Karpienskich, w Makowcu zrodzona. Malzenstwo to poprzedzily trzy zapowiedzi w dniach 16, 23 i 30 maja roku biezacego, w parafii Kikolskiej. Tamowanie malzenstwa nie zaszlo. Malzonkowie nowi oswiadczaja, iz nie zawarli umowy przedslubnej. Akt ten stawajacym i swiadkom przeczytany zostal, swiadek pierwszy jest bratem rodzonym nowozaslubionego, pisac nie umieja.
Xsiadz Walenty Łubieński, proboszcz parafii Kikolskiej

Translated:

It happened in the village Kikół on 31 May 1830, at 12 noon. We make it known that in the consciousness of witnesses Leon Rudkowski, 52 years old, and Jakub Kielecki, 50 years old, laborers from Kikół, today have been concluded religious marriage between Pawel Rudkowski, widower left behind by Maryanna born Kędzierska, laborer residing in Kikół, 46 years old, born in Kikół, son of Jacenty and Maryanna, spouses Rudkowski, already passed away; and Miss Maryanna Karpienska, 42 years old, workwoman residing in Kikół, daughter of Piotr and Agnieszka, spouses Karpienski, born in Makowiec. This marriage was preceded by three announcements, on 16, 23 and 30 May of the current year, in the parish Kikół. No opposition to the marriage had happened. The new spouses declare that they have not entered into a prenuptial agreement. This act was read to the present and witnesses, the first witness is the brother [rodzony=same parents] of the groom, they do not know how to write.
Priest Walenty Łubieński, pastor in Kikół

==

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