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galicia seeker

Joined: 30 Apr 2021
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Location: Mississauga, Ontario
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Posted: Thu Dec 21, 2023 6:17 pm Post subject: Who were the hired help in a Polish/Galicia manor

Hello all!

This question may be a little unusual, but I can't find much information on this subject. The Polish landlords in Galicia in the 18th and 19th century, along with the lesser "nobles" including the G.C. priests who were supported politically tended to live in manors/dwors outside of populated towns.

My background research for a portion of my paternal family roots, all peasants, centers around towns in Rohatyn, Ukraine and includes farms owned by the Krasicki family in the 19th century (after a long inheritance lineage). The Krasicki palace was actually in the middle of Stratyn.

So, other than ekonomist managers and other technical support staff including blacksmiths, etc., who supported the households - cooks, childcare cleaners etc.?

Certainly, history identifies single women doing these duties, but did married women ever work in this environment. Say, a young married women - married to a much older man (second marriage for him) who became infirm and could no longer provide for the household?

Any thoughts?

Just a clarification -I've found numerous examples of peasants and tradespeople who worked for and often lived in the manor houses. Lots of young women too but has anyone found any evidence of a married women working say, as a cook or cleaner?

Sophia
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Posted: Sat Dec 23, 2023 9:27 am Post subject: Re: Who were the hired help in a Polish/Galicia manor

galicia seeker wrote:

Hi,
It is an interesting question.
There are many types of work necessary to the running of a dwor, that could have been done by women. Some would have been specialized (and continually needed) tasks like spinning and weaving, sewing, dairy work including the making of butter, on and on. Other work would have been more ad hoc, like assisting at harvest time, and while this would have helped to provide for the family, it might not have resulted in the woman being viewed as having a specific occupation. It would have been in the best interest of the owner of the manor house to utilize all available labor, frankly.
When you say you are looking for evidence of married women taking on these types of work, I am trying to think how you would find that. A woman's occupation might be cited in her marriage record or her death record. You might go through what is available of Rohatyn records and look at what is written for women who are not in your direct line of research to see if any show an occupation. Didn't you also, at one time, post a list of payments from the dwor? Did you check the names there, to see if any of them were women?
Best wishes to you and yours for a good holiday,
Sophia

Henryk
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Posted: Sat Dec 23, 2023 5:28 pm Post subject: Post subject: Re: Who were the hired help in a Polish/Galici

My mother was hired as a servant in a village manor house, Kielce Province, age 18 in 1920. When she enquired about her wages, she was told that her meals were to be provided, and that was considered sufficient payment. She declined the position.

Sophia
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Posted: Fri Dec 29, 2023 6:33 am Post subject: Re: Post subject: Re: Who were the hired help in a Polish/Ga

Henryk wrote:

Hi Henryk,
Good for her! Sometimes you just have to put your foot down.
Best wishes to you for a happy new year.
Sophia

galicia seeker

Joined: 30 Apr 2021
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Posted: Fri Dec 29, 2023 8:33 am Post subject: Who were the hired help in a Polish/Galicia manor

Thanks for both replies and Happy Holidays to you and your loved ones!

Mid-19th century Galicia was indeed a complicated and diverse environment: Ultra wealthy landowners, mostly Polish estate managers, Jewish tradespeople (who were often contracted to run local taverns and supply the dwors with necessary goods), Szlachta, the Ukrainian nobility in Galicia, the Polish nobility in Galicia, Greek Catholic and Roman Catholic priests, peasants who owned a piece of land, rented a piece of land or were landless.

Phew - complicated indeed.

Sophia wrote:
When you say you are looking for evidence of married women taking on these types of work, I am trying to think how you would find that. A woman's occupation might be cited in her marriage record or her death record. You might go through what is available of Rohatyn records and look at what is written for women who are not in your direct line of research to see if any show an occupation. Didn't you also, at one time, post a list of payments from the dwor? Did you check the names there, to see if any of them were women?

I did post a doc a while back and am re-sending. The document appears to record charges for those that lived on the Stratyn estate (folwark) as documented by the manager. Three of the lines are widows - probably the surviving wives of those that worked on the estate. My Polish language skills are pretty weak - but it appears that they were paid for something?

I agree that there would have been many tasks performed by women, but I would suggest that these were most probably single gals and judging by the sheer volume of illegitimate births and subsequent deaths recorded, it must have been an awful position to be in at times. In the time period we are discussing, mothers had to continue to work - hence no or limited time to care for their infants.

Domestic chores, laundry, childcare, field work and serving as a wet-nurse could all be performed whether you were single or married.

Sophia, I agree that we will probably never know the answer. And Henryk, was your mother married at the time? Good for her!

Thanks again for your replies,
Kind regards, Gail

Henryk
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Posted: Fri Dec 29, 2023 4:19 pm Post subject:

galicia seeker
She was single.

galicia seeker

Joined: 30 Apr 2021
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Location: Mississauga, Ontario
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Posted: Fri Dec 29, 2023 4:58 pm Post subject: Who were the hired help in a Polish/Galicia manor

Henryk, her refusal to work under those conditions was possibly unusual in those circumstances, and again, Bravo! Without knowing anything about her family, such a refusal *could have caused hardship. In my family, my now 93-year-old mother and her sisters were frequently "contracted out" to help in neighboring households in rural Saskatchewan when they were in their early teens. Her family desperately needed the cash infusion....think of a Ukrainian family with 14 children! A couple of her memories include times when she was on the verge of being mistreated, often in a household without a wife, and her father refused to let her go to a particular household. When she did provide services, they included milking all the cows in the morning, making breakfast for the family, doing the laundry, getting the children ready for school, cleaning up then heading off to school herself. All for the princely sum of +/- $5 a month that went directly to her father. I am so blessed by what my parents did so that I would not have to.

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