Forum | PolishOrigins :: View topic - GrandParents: Niewiera & Jakuc. Research in Belarus.

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BobK
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Location: Portland, Oregon USA
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Posted: Tue Nov 11, 2008 8:11 pm Post subject: GrandParents: Niewiera & Jakuc. Research in Belarus.

Rosalia Jakuc was born in Nieciecz, near Lida, about 1885
she married Jozef (or "Osip") Niewiera about 1907.
My mother, Mary, was born Sept 16, 1911, She was baptized in
"the Roman Catholic Parish Church of Lida Province of Wilno, Poland"

I believe I once found a town called Niewiera, (can't find it again) but I've been told that is quite common. Families that owned an estate would rename the town to their name.

I would like to find out more about both grandparents, not quite sure how to go about it with such little information about them.

On my father's side, I learned that that grandfather was born in Plock, or as he wrote it on two different document - Lipna, and Plock,Lipna .
He was born Krampetz, an ethnic German, in 1884. I'll be looking for more about his family too.

dziękuję
Bob Krampetz
P.S. Can someone translate the letter I attached?
Portland, OR USA

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My mothers 'proof' of birth from 1933

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Zenon
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Joined: 28 Apr 2007
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Location: Poland
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Posted: Wed Nov 12, 2008 5:33 am Post subject:

Welcome to the Forum Bob,

I am on travel now so I have to response shortly.

As for Lida, I would try Belorussian Archives. I have a few contacts and names in my desktop's hard drive which unfortunately crashed yesterday (just before I left home). When I hopefully fix it I will send you the contacts.

With regards to Plock, Lipna you should first learn (if you don't know it yet) religion of your grandfather, then you can try to search in Polish State Archives Database Pradziad http://baza.archiwa.gov.pl/sezam/pradziad.php?l=en . I checked that there are some records from Lipno, click here http://tinyurl.com/6cot48 (didn't check if it may be "your" Lipno). Then you can try to contact Archives. I highly recommend you James article Remote Research in Polish State Archives.

When only I have a little time I will try to translate the document.

Zenon
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Posted: Fri Nov 21, 2008 5:15 am Post subject:

Bob,

Below you will find translation of the document
--

Stamp:
Archdiocese Vilnius
Rector of Parish of Church of the Holy Cross in Lida
text with numbers unreadable

Birth and baptism certificate

On September 29, 1911 in the parish church in Lida there was baptized Marja Niewiera daughter of marriage Józef and Józefa nee Kuć (?) (there is probably one or more letters at the beginning of the surname on the paper bend, Jakuć (?) comment by Zenon) born on September 16, 1911 in Lida, parish Lida. Godparents were Andrzej Szulejko and Maria Jakuć (?).
Birth certificate recorded under number 57.

I hereby confirm concordance with original certificate,
Unreadable signature
Rector of Lida parish
Date on the stamp April, 1933

-- end of translation

Last edited by Zenon on Sat Nov 22, 2008 8:19 am; edited 1 time in total

BobK
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Posted: Sat Nov 22, 2008 12:08 am Post subject:

Thank you VERY MUCH Zenon

Based on the dates, I imagine my mother needed that proof of birth
to become a naturalized US citizen.

The name is Jakuc, and my grandmother was born in Nieciecz, a
small village near Bielica which is south of Vilnius. My grandmother's
sister was named Mary, Chu chu Monia to us little kids - I should check
for the correct spelling.. I believe chu chu means 'aunt'
What has me puzzled, is that my grandmother's name was Rosalia,
or Rose. No one ever knew her as Józefa.

Does Belarus have methods to obtain genealogical information?

I found the church at:
http://www.radzima.org/pub/pomnik.php?lang=en&nazva_id=hrlilida01

Thanks again! ..
Bob K.

NancyM
PolishOrigins Matka Chrzestna

Joined: 14 Dec 2007
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Location: Massachusetts, USA
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Posted: Mon Nov 24, 2008 5:17 pm Post subject:

BobK wrote:

My grandmother's sister was named Mary, Chu chu Monia to us little kids - I should check for the correct spelling.. I believe chu chu means 'aunt'

Hi Bob,

The Polish word for "aunt" is "ciocia" http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/ciocia

Your spelling is a lot like I remember pronouncing it, though. Very Happy

Zenon
PolishOrigins Team Leader

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Posted: Fri Nov 28, 2008 4:43 am Post subject:

BobK wrote:

What has me puzzled, is that my grandmother's name was Rosalia,
or Rose. No one ever knew her as Józefa.

It is still quite common here that people are called differently than their official name given in baptism ceremony or registered in official documents in Civil Registers Office. For example, in my family we have always called one of my uncle Tadek (Tadeusz) and his official name is Edward. I had also thought for a long time that my grandmother was Maria and in fact she is Krystyna. I learned about it only when I was a teenager Laughing

BobK wrote:

Does Belarus have methods to obtain genealogical information?

Yes, you can contact State Archives by e-mail, fax or regular mail. Unfortunately, I still don't have access to my documents in desktop and I can't give you any specific hint...

Last edited by Zenon on Fri Dec 05, 2008 4:01 pm; edited 1 time in total

genia

Joined: 24 Dec 2007
Replies: 3
Location: Brussels, Belgium
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Posted: Thu Dec 04, 2008 1:49 am Post subject: in response to Bob's question on how to research in Belarus

: this is the official link to the NATIONAL HISTORICAL ARCHIVES OF BELARUS IN GRODNO
Contact Information
Address: 2 Tizengauza Sq., Grodno, 230023, Republic of Belarus
Tel./Fax: (375-152) 74-31-04
E-mail: [email protected]
Director: Tatiana Yu. Afanasieva

and here are some other interesting links:
http://www.jewishgen.org/yizkor/minsk/minsk.html#TOC-2 (other towns too!)

www.archives.gov.by
(Metric books of the Catholic churches<br>Lida uyezd Vilno province | Archives of Belarus)

www.mtu-net.ru/rrr/index.htm(
Researching Russian Roots site,JewishGen. It's a very fact-filled site with interesting history, phone directories,
surname/first name dictionaries,

good luck. Genia

_________________
research: Boyarski - Wasilishok-Lida & Dragutski-Wasilishok-Suwalki

BobK
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Posted: Wed Feb 25, 2009 5:29 pm Post subject: Re: in response to Bob's question on how to research in Bela

genia wrote:

I've been sending them an email every several weeks since December, and I've yet to get a reply. Did you try email & get an answer? Someone else claims they responded, they didn't say if they used English, Polish or Russian. I used English.

Bob K

BobK
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Posted: Mon Mar 02, 2009 10:22 pm Post subject: Re: in response to Bob's question on how to research in Bela

BobK wrote:

genia wrote:

Well, I spoke too soon. I just got a letter from Belarus today. The only English on the letter is my name and address, I will need help translating it. (posted it over on http://www.genealodzy.pl for a Russian translation.. I assume it's Russian! it looks like Cyrillic)

In addition to the letter, they also sent what appears to be a bill (invoice). That has "National Archives of Belarus in Grodno" (in English), and a very clear "$113" which is what I suppose they're asking for whatever they're offering me in the letter..

The problem is that I sent them an email back in Dec, again in Jan, and in Feb. I also posted on several other web sites, so I *hope* this isn't a hoax (fake).. I suppose if it were, they'd be looking for more than $113! Though it looks sort of ok, I'd like others to say if they've gotten the same thing & if it's legitimate.

The envelope has 6 normal 'lick & stick' stamps, 1 x 50, 2 x 100 & 3 x 300. No currency symbol. I looked up their currency and they use a "Belarus ruble". It shows BYR 315,500 to $1 US!! It that correct?!?
Wow!!

Bob K

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genia

Joined: 24 Dec 2007
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Location: Brussels, Belgium
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Posted: Tue Mar 03, 2009 12:38 pm Post subject:

Bob. The letter & bill that you have received are the genuine thing! it is exactly the same documents I received in the past from the Grodno Archives - and yes, it does cost money - I am sure once you have the document translated you will be satisfied with the result.They only communicate in Russian.
kind regards
Genia
_________________
research: Boyarski - Wasilishok-Lida & Dragutski-Wasilishok-Suwalki

BobK
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Posted: Sun Mar 08, 2009 12:41 am Post subject:

genia wrote:

Looking over the amounts and time quotes. They say they hire contractors (they don't do the work themselves?) and that it could be up to 3 months. They say the cost is $600 per day. They give no estimate of cost or time. That they want a fee before they even look just adds to a bad feeling.

This is similar to other lures that are found everywhere. There are genealogists advertising at lower rates than this.

I think I'll wait to see how many others find the Belarus archives reasearch satisfactory and how much they wind up paying.

Bob K.

andrewb

Joined: 09 Apr 2010
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Posted: Fri Apr 09, 2010 10:48 pm Post subject: Nowogródek Voivodeship - Województwo nowogródzkie - archives

Is Belarus the only place where we could search records for ancestors from Kleck?
Was anyone successful in working with Belarussian archives?

Our grandma was born in Kleck in 1909.
At that time Kleck was in Russian Empire / Minsk gubernia.
The family lived / married / had kids there until mid 30-s.
Those were the years of the Second Polish Republic.

Should we expect Belarussian archives to work the same way as Polish?

Thank you in advance.

BobK
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Location: Portland, Oregon USA
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Posted: Sat Apr 10, 2010 6:31 pm Post subject: Re: Nowogródek Voivodeship - Województwo nowogródzkie - arch

andrewb wrote:

Is Belarus the only place where we could search records for ancestors from Kleck?
Was anyone successful in working with Belarussian archives?
....
.

My mother was born in "Wilno" province, and baptised in the Lida church (no name mentioned in the confirming
letter I have) in 1911. She was Polish as were her mother and aunts. Family story tells that her father was
Lithuanian who died when she was about 4. So not knowing who to write to, I began with emailing a Polish
archive (thinking there was only one).

Tthey directed me to a Lithuanian archive as Wilno is now Vilnius and I guess they didn't note my mention of
the Lida Catholic church. The Lithuanian archive emailed me back that the town I enquired about is now in
Belarus, and they gave me the address for the (or only?) Belarussian Archive.

I wrote Belarus, and waited. About 6-7 weeks later I received a '1950' style letter (very thin paper, lots of
small stamps covering much of the envelope), my address was handwritten on the envelope, and an apparent
'ink jet printer' (those early 1980ish type printers) printed bill on lined writing paper with a minimum of Russian
(or Belarussian) writing was enclosed. Took a bit, but got it translated.

It was a simple request, and to paraphrase it: "Please send us $300 US", thank you, & signed ...
No explanation of what was found, nothing other than the 'ink jet' printing of the 'archive' name, nothing
explaining what would (possibly) be sent. I couldn't even read the written name.

I get better "Nigerian" Spam emails than that..

Needless to say, I'll wait until I hear from someone that they confirm and recommened where to write
in Belarus, and what they charge for time or documents or both. Either whoever wasn't greedy, or
figured better odds if the amount wasn't outrageous.

So, anyone else have any good/bad experience with Belarus archive(s)?

Bob K.

andrewb

Joined: 09 Apr 2010
Replies: 3

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Posted: Sat Apr 10, 2010 7:29 pm Post subject:

For the record - this is what I found so far:
An older (1999) description of problems with archives in Belarus:
http://www.jewishgen.org/Belarus/ragas_report_belarus_revisited.htm

It looks like nothing changed since then.
Here is the webpage from the National archive of Belarus with current prices (in Russian):

http://niab.belhost.by/arhiv/uslugi/

and translated:
http://translate.google.com/translate?js=y&prev=_t&hl=en&ie=UTF-8&layout=1&eotf=1&u=http%3A%2F%2Fniab.belhost.by%2Farhiv%2Fuslugi%2F&sl=ru&tl=en

1 USD ~= 3000 Belarussian Roubles, so the simplest inquiry (one workday) is ~$25.

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