ronjohn8PolishOrigins Patron
Joined: 05 Feb 2013
Replies: 15
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Posted: Fri Feb 15, 2013 7:19 pm
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my daughter and i are going to Poland in August. My Grandfather was born in Poland and i am trying to see if i can find the town he was born in. My aunt's birth certificate states that he was born in Austria. His date of birth was December 19, 1896 and i beleive at that time Austria had annexed a part of Poland. I have also been told that the Polish spelling of our P name was Poreba with the little hook under the e which sounded like Poremba. There is a town called Poreba and in the origins of surnames it says that names were given with the town you were born in. If anyone has any information concerning the name Poreba or Poremba i would appreciate it hearing from you.
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ShelliePO Top Contributor & Patron
Joined: 18 Feb 2009
Replies: 1000
Location: Atlanta, GABack to top |
Posted: Sat Feb 16, 2013 12:12 am
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Hi Ronjohn8 -
Welcome!
I'm not an expert on Polish history, but the short answer is yes. Parts of present-day Poland were part of the Austro-Hungarian empire. As you learn more about your personal family history, you will also learn more about Poland's history and it will make much more sense why that birth certificate said your grandfather was born in Austria.
Several members here, including me, were able to successfully identify our ancestral village with the generous help of this PolishOrigins community. You have provided a few clues, but perhaps there are a few more clues that we can find about your family to help narrow down a possible location.
Can you please share some more information with us? See if you can answer some of the following:
Your grandfather's full name
Name of his brothers and/or sisters
Name of his wife (first name and maiden name).
Where did your grandfather live? Did he emigrate to the US, Canada, Australia, South America or another country? If he lived in the US - what city and state?
If he went to the US, do you know the year?
These are a few things to get started. If you can answer as many of these items as possible, we can start searching for clues about your grandfather's birth village.
I look forward to hearing back from you.
Shellie
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Posted: Sat Feb 16, 2013 8:25 am
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Hi,
Poreba villages in Galicia:
Poreba
Poreba Mala
Poreba Radlna
Poreba Spytkowska
Poreba Wielka
Poreba Wielka
Poreba Zegoty
Gilberto
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ronjohn8PolishOrigins Patron
Joined: 05 Feb 2013
Replies: 15
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Posted: Sat Feb 16, 2013 9:58 am
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OK Shellie i am at where you put me!!! and i am like a kid in a candy store. And thank you Gilberto for this listing of villages in Galicia. Granfathers full name was Joseph Poremba born December 19, 1896. Had one sister. Her married named Angeline Podgorski. Angeline was born on June 1, 1891. Granfather came to the united states i am guessing from the year 1908 thru 1913. He lived in Ecorse,Michigan. His first wife and mother of my Father was Sophia Grobart. That is the name listed on my aunt Alice's birth certificate. My Aunt Angeline was supspose to have come to the United States in 1910. To the best of my knowledge Grandfather lived in Ecorse, Michigan until he past away in 1975.
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Elzbieta PorteneuvePO Top Contributor
Joined: 09 Nov 2012
Replies: 3098
Location: Paris, FranceBack to top |
Posted: Sat Feb 16, 2013 11:43 am
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Hi John,
When you look at Europe map from 1890 http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/8/8b/Europa_1890.jpg you will note that the Austro-Hungary North border is slightly to the North of 50° longitude (Krakow and Czech Praga).
and then when you look on today's Poland and its voievodships like here http://studioopinii.pl/wp-content/uploads/2011/07/mapa-polski.jpg (it's better to have a map with few main cities, that's the reason I take this one not only wojewodztwa)
you will immediately conclude that the only Poreba with hook Poręba you are interested in might be in Malopolskie or the South of Slaskie or Podkarpackie.
A place South of 50° longitude.
There is a number of Poręba listed in wiki http://pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Por%C4%99ba_(ujednoznacznienie) but only 3 fits Galicia:
Poręba, Malopolskie, Poland (circa 40 km South from Krakow)
Poręba, Kraków, Poland (within Krakow area)
Poręba, Pszczyna, Silesian Voivodeship, Poland (circa 100 km Ouest from Krakow, road distance)
It would help you a lot to find out which one you are interested in before your travel next Summer.
I noted two Poręba Wielka - Great Poręba - which also fits into old Galicia territories, please check for "Wielka" in your name.
An aside: I found a nice map with 3 partitions of Poland, 1772, 1793 and 1795 (then 123 years without Poland, until 1918) it may help too
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/3/30/Rzeczpospolita_Rozbiory_3.png/765px-Rzeczpospolita_Rozbiory_3.png
Kind regards,
Elzbieta
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ronjohn8PolishOrigins Patron
Joined: 05 Feb 2013
Replies: 15
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Posted: Sat Feb 16, 2013 4:42 pm
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thank you so very much for the information...hopefully when my daughter and i get to krakow we can get some assistance there to pin point where my granfather may have lived...cant wait to get into the maps you referenced though...will be a lot of fun. Ron Poremba...
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Cheri Vanden BergPO Top Contributor & Patron
Joined: 16 Oct 2011
Replies: 504
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Cheri Vanden BergPO Top Contributor & Patron
Joined: 16 Oct 2011
Replies: 504
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Cheri Vanden BergPO Top Contributor & Patron
Joined: 16 Oct 2011
Replies: 504
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Posted: Sat Feb 16, 2013 7:58 pm
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Ron,
I think this might be Joseph Poremba, though it says Promba, in the 1920 census.
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/MZ4Z-2NF#
All the census years do have 1913 as his immigration year. The census also has the information that he had at the very least applied for citizenship. He has PA - for papers, and his first papers should have his birth place on them.
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Cheri Vanden BergPO Top Contributor & Patron
Joined: 16 Oct 2011
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Posted: Sat Feb 16, 2013 8:19 pm
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Yes, Joseph Poremba's name appears in a naturalization index in the district court of Detroit Michigan.
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Cheri Vanden BergPO Top Contributor & Patron
Joined: 16 Oct 2011
Replies: 504
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Posted: Sat Feb 16, 2013 8:55 pm
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Ron,
I did find something interesting on a Hamburg Passenger list dated February 13, 1913. This ship was going to arrive at the port of NY. There was a Josef Poremba on this ship AND a Aniela Podgorski (you probably know this but Aniela would be the Polish name for Angeline). I know this does not fit with Angeline arriving in 1910, and also her age doesn't match the age you have for her. Was her husband's name Sylvester by any chance? The list had both of them born about 1882, but maybe her age was just written the same as his. Their residence was Wien, Austria. Josef, born about 1896, residence was Zurowa.
Last edited by Cheri Vanden Berg on Sun Feb 17, 2013 9:44 am; edited 1 time in total
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ShelliePO Top Contributor & Patron
Joined: 18 Feb 2009
Replies: 1000
Location: Atlanta, GABack to top |
Posted: Sun Feb 17, 2013 2:45 am
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Hi Ron!
I'm so glad that you were able to provide more details. See what I mean when I said that some members would probably help out? That's what is so great about PolishOrigins! Thanks to this website and the kindness of the members here, I was able to figure out my ancestral village before my first-ever trip to Poland (in Malopolski). And it looks like you are about to find your village too!
One way to find the name of your village is to follow the paper trail your ancestor make when applying for naturalization. If the information Cheri found in that index is indeed your grandfather, then you might be able to find his paperwork in the court archives. If not, there is a possibility that a copy of his records are in the archives of the USCIS.
You can read about the options available through USCIS here:
http://forum.polishorigins.com/viewtopic.php?t=657&highlight=USCIS
Getting your ancestors' information from USCIS is not cheap, and not quick, but at least you can consider it if you can not find records anywhere else. But note that I said the info does not come quickly. If you think you want to try this avenue, get your request in ASAP to increase your chances of getting something back before you leave for Poland.
I look forward to more discussion on this thread.
Shellie
Last edited by Shellie on Wed Feb 20, 2013 11:07 am; edited 1 time in total
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Posted: Sun Feb 17, 2013 7:09 am
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| Cheri Vanden Berg wrote: | Ron,
I did find something interesting on a Hamburg Passenger list dated February 13, 1913. This ship was going to arrive at the port of Cuxhaven, NY. There was a Josef Poremba on this ship AND a Aniela Podgorski (you probably know this but Aniela would be the Polish name for Angeline). I know this does not fit with Angeline arriving in 1910, and also her age doesn't match the age you have for her. Was her husband's name Sylvester by any chance? The list had both of them born about 1882, but maybe her age was just written the same as his. Their residence was Wien, Austria. Josef, born about 1896, residence was Zurowa. |
Great findings, Cheri
Too many matches for not being them. And more, Zurowa is about 13 miles South of Poreba Radlna (near Tarnow).
Gilberto
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Cheri Vanden BergPO Top Contributor & Patron
Joined: 16 Oct 2011
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Posted: Sun Feb 17, 2013 9:27 am
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I'm not sure about that Hamburg passenger list. I believe I found Angeline Podgorski in the census with her husband WALTER. I wasn't sure that it said Sylvester on the manifest, but it was indexed as Sylvester. There was definitely a y as the second letter of his name, so I didn't think it looked like Waldemar which I found as the Polish equivalent of the name Walter (?). Also, in the census it did have the information that Angeline immigrated in 1910, and Walter in 1913. I realize that people did sometimes go back and forth to Poland...This is the same Josef's passenger record at Ellis Island (two pages):
http://www.ellisisland.org/search/shipManifest.asp?pID=100572080276
http://tinyurl.com/b3y5kor
Last edited by Cheri Vanden Berg on Sun Feb 17, 2013 9:58 am; edited 1 time in total
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Posted: Sun Feb 17, 2013 9:57 am
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Through Ellis Island came a bunch of Porembas, from Zurowa. Maybe Ron would like to check them.
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